Sure. I just don't see it nearly as often. People that are tolerant of other people liking things that they don't don't seem to be as motivated to post in threads about the thing they don't like.
The Fanboy Wars, Continue They Do ...
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Sure. I just don't see it nearly as often. People that are tolerant of other people liking things that they don't don't seem to be as motivated to post in threads about the thing they don't like.
Then I agree, it's a fair point. I do see a bit of everything... widespread or not I don't know...
Intolerance about people liking things. Lots of that in the gaming threads, people with no interest in a game, trying to tell the world the game suck. It's not creating discussions, it's stupid to argue about personal tastes in games. It's not like anyone can convince someone else they are wrong to love a game. The art argument abouve fits more with this example than the brand fanboyism, but since it's always getting crazy when it's an exclusive, it hints peoples intent was about the platform all along. It's complicated because that game's existence is tied to the platform's success.
I see the opposite more about brand loyalty (at least of GAF, because of the volume perhaps) , intolerance about people not liking the same things seems to be among the hallmarks of fanboyism. Here the mods called it SDF for sony, there's an equivalent acronym for most category of fans. Manifested as a genuine feeling of personal attack when someone have a negative opinion about their chosen piece of hardware. True or false doesn't matter, it's an emotional reaction. This wouldn't happen if people were aware of their own bias and rose colored glasses (or blue, or green). It calls for more introspection.
I hope the irony of dialogue happening and common ground being found in a thread about fanboyism isn't lost on everyone.
My feelings about this subject are based on personal experience. I was absolutely a fanboy by my own definition for quite a while (I remember posting about how much M$ sucked on Amiga message boards) and then I had an epiphany and made the conscious decision to stop. When I realized that every post I was making relating to Sony was something negative, I deliberately refrained from posting anything negative about Sony for a long while. And guess what? My posting in Sony-related threads went down dramatically. I rarely found reason to post opinions about games for a console I didn't own and couldn't play. Forcing myself to only post things that were positive about Sony for a period of time, given my biases, allowed me to gain a different perspective. It was a badly needed reset and it got me in the habit of trying to respond instead of react to the ideas I see in threads. Still not 100% on that, but I'm not sure anyone is.
I eventually got a PS3, and was glad to have it (despite my gripes with the ways some things were handled compared to the way they were handled on 360). And this gen, I bought a PS4 first. My perspective was that Sony nailed the PS4. By comparison, the XBOne at launch was a clusterfuck of epic proportions and, despite my affinity for the Xbox brand and it's exclusives, I wanted no part of it.
Am I still biased? Sure. And I try to be mindful of that.
Am I still a fanboy (my definition)? I'd like to think not. I'm not really the one to judge.
It's only natural that a user defends a product that she or he likes.
It's fanboyism when you believe or perpetuate lies or really extreme embellishments even in the face of facts that say otherwise.
Today it may even be an imperative that the userbase of a product readily defend it in the face of a negative campaign. Social media allows a small but very vocal group to widely drive narratives that can paint a product in a very poor light. If there is no one to contradict those narratives then those products can be perceived as undesirable by the general public.
Me, I am sucker for the underdog. Fav consoles have been XB1, 360/PS3 (360 initially but later the PS3), XB, N64, Genesis and the Vectrex. I've owned Ataris, Nintendos and Playstations and have enjoyed them so haven't really understood the need to paint one side of the competition as "garbage" and the other as "the best thing since sliced bread".
But a little bit of fanboyism is a good thing as our debates would be boring and devoid of liveliness if everyone stuck to the facts and rational positions at all times. LOL.
On a more serious note, the polarization of fanbases seen in spaces like video games seems to be just a symptom of a phenomenon that's spreading across all segments of society. I don't consider it healthy and ultimately we will all suffer if we don't learn to be more tolerate instead of less when it comes to divergent views.
It's fanboyism when you believe or perpetuate lies or really extreme embellishments even in the face of facts that say otherwise.
Today it may even be an imperative that the userbase of a product readily defend it in the face of a negative campaign. Social media allows a small but very vocal group to widely drive narratives that can paint a product in a very poor light. If there is no one to contradict those narratives then those products can be perceived as undesirable by the general public.
Me, I am sucker for the underdog. Fav consoles have been XB1, 360/PS3 (360 initially but later the PS3), XB, N64, Genesis and the Vectrex. I've owned Ataris, Nintendos and Playstations and have enjoyed them so haven't really understood the need to paint one side of the competition as "garbage" and the other as "the best thing since sliced bread".
But a little bit of fanboyism is a good thing as our debates would be boring and devoid of liveliness if everyone stuck to the facts and rational positions at all times. LOL.
On a more serious note, the polarization of fanbases seen in spaces like video games seems to be just a symptom of a phenomenon that's spreading across all segments of society. I don't consider it healthy and ultimately we will all suffer if we don't learn to be more tolerate instead of less when it comes to divergent views.
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Let me ask this question again to everyone...
In a debate or intelligent discussions having constructive opposing viewpoints can be good, but what realistically can be considered a constructive opposing view in a "PreRelease News and Rumor" thread?
Providing impressions about something coming out. Trying to discuss what is credible and what isn't. Correcting false claims. Predicting the impact of a news on the entire industry. Making cocky predictions long enough in advance to expose the ones who are only following their feelings instead of the facts.
I saw you talking in VR threads, and PSVR press conferences, just telling everyone how much you don't give a shit about VR, same for nintendo threads. Everybody wants to express their opinion. It's a human thing.
"100% of b3d readers love the wiiu, according to the heavily filtered forum where negative opinions are not allowed" That wouldn't be a positive thing, and create a false sense of general concesus, ignoring the outliers opinions.
If you filter out any negative viewpoint and copy paste a bunch of PR lines, it amplifies the making shit up mentality... reminiscent of mrxmedia, which you had no problem bashing any mention of it in news and rumor threads. Why didn't you just let people repeat mrxmedia rumors unchallenged? False things are challenged by those who don't have a predisposition to believe what makes them feel good. Since we're all biased, it creates an impression that only those who don't love a thing... don't love a thing.... No wait...
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I agree with what you say there.
However my disagreement is that none of that was happening in the XBox Scorpio thread. What was happening was people simply moving the goal post and attempt to switch the conversation to some other item that already has its own dedicated thread. The last part I recall was something along the lines of it doesn't matter, they won't have exclusives. Or some topic that already existed elsewhere.
That's why I asked, because I have been overly negative in the Nintendo threads even though my intention was for the better -- trying to present a more realistic viewpoint on hardware capabilities. Though who am I to say what's realistic and what isn't (even if it did eventually turn out that way)?
I suppose I've done a little bit of the same poo-poo-ing in the VR threads, even if I thought the discussions there were more about who was or was not into VR. I hope I've curbed that negative behavior of mine within the past few months.
As for the extreme curbing of references to MrXM, it's because there are other people who then sourcing that post from Beyond3D trying to give it more credence. Once that happens, more sites pick up the obviously false magic sauce news. It starts up the echo chamber and it takes a long time to put a stop to the insane banter. That also creates a negative image of B3D. Believe it or not, I do not want anything to happen that would ever tarnish this site.
Anyways, enough lame excuses from me.
Does any of this make sense to you or others? I hope so.
I really do want to have an overall better site experience for every user here. The ideal experience is when there's no silly drama going on and users can self-moderate and engage one another in respectful matters. I think we're far closer to that happening in the console forums, based on what I see in the Nvidia/AMD/Intel PC threads.
I hope everyone continues to work with one another towards this. Thank you for your participation and patience.
There was something you said in another thread that really got to me (for the better). I'm not sure if this is what you intended, if it's not I do hope you accept it as a compliment and having positive impact. Your statement was something about how it's human nature for people to more readily accept positive statements than negative statements even in technical threads, and how it can be a good thing to question a person's qualifications. Thank you for that inception.
Silent_Buddha
Legend
If all anyone has to say are positive things about something, you have to question their perspective, IMO.
If all anyone has to say are negative things about something, you have to question their perspective, IMO.
If someone applies one set to rules to something (to show it in a positive or negative light) but does not apply those same rules to other products, you have to question their motives, IMO.
Everyone's opinions and views are colored by what they believe in and what they like, and that's fine. But even then you have to be able to at least attempt to see the good points in something you disagree with even if you don't necessarily agree with those points.
For example, for me, I'm sure people have seen my posts about VR that tends to be overly negative because I still don't see it gaining any traction outside of a core niche group of VR fans. But even then, I can judge its positive merits in what it does well even if it's outweighed by negative points (due to how my eyes work and perceive the world). And I can attempt to discuss what it would take for it to gain wider adoption. So, despite being overly negative on the market prospects, I can still reflect positively on the technology and what it does well. As well, I can look at developments in the field that impact VR in a positive way.
But then there are things where I have little tolerance (Bioware and EA's treatment of ME and DA, GRRRRRR) which I'm sure people are aware of as well.
That doesn't mean I don't think people shouldn't enjoy the games after their RPG hearts were ripped out of them. Just that I cannot forgive EA and Bioware for doing it.
But most of all, without dissenting opinions you'd never be presented with alternative viewpoints and you may never see a rich new way of thinking about things that you may not have come up with on your own.
Regards,
SB
If all anyone has to say are negative things about something, you have to question their perspective, IMO.
If someone applies one set to rules to something (to show it in a positive or negative light) but does not apply those same rules to other products, you have to question their motives, IMO.
Everyone's opinions and views are colored by what they believe in and what they like, and that's fine. But even then you have to be able to at least attempt to see the good points in something you disagree with even if you don't necessarily agree with those points.
For example, for me, I'm sure people have seen my posts about VR that tends to be overly negative because I still don't see it gaining any traction outside of a core niche group of VR fans. But even then, I can judge its positive merits in what it does well even if it's outweighed by negative points (due to how my eyes work and perceive the world). And I can attempt to discuss what it would take for it to gain wider adoption. So, despite being overly negative on the market prospects, I can still reflect positively on the technology and what it does well. As well, I can look at developments in the field that impact VR in a positive way.
But then there are things where I have little tolerance (Bioware and EA's treatment of ME and DA, GRRRRRR) which I'm sure people are aware of as well.
That doesn't mean I don't think people shouldn't enjoy the games after their RPG hearts were ripped out of them. Just that I cannot forgive EA and Bioware for doing it. But most of all, without dissenting opinions you'd never be presented with alternative viewpoints and you may never see a rich new way of thinking about things that you may not have come up with on your own.
Regards,
SB
D
Deleted member 11852
Guest
There is a difference between being enthusiastic about a product and 'defending' it. For a start why does a product need defending? It's an animate object without any feelings and is unaffected by anything that mean people on the internet may say about it. Fanboyism is a particular strand of cognitive dissonance which appears related to the buyer's remorse phenomenon. Studies have shown that a small number of people find negative opinions on items, or service to which they subscribe, as an attack on their judgement and feel a need to assert their position.
So, not 'normal', fringe. The greater majority of people don't give two hoots what anybody else thinks of their product buying criteria but they're not very active on sites like this, GAF, IGN etc. This is why in a market of 100+ million gamers, an infinitesimally small - rounding-number error levels - number of genuine enthusiasts and fanboys gather. Online communities generally comprise that narrow slither comprising the best and worst of gamer personalities, but generally not many remotely representative of the greater majority. They're just playing Forza 7 and not caring by SDF_Terminator2003 said about his Xbox on GAF. He doesn't give a toss
NeoGAF is down since a few days. Without NeoGAF the fanboy wars would decrease a little.
https://twitter.com/hashtag/neogaf?lang=de
https://twitter.com/hashtag/neogaf?lang=de
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This is hilarious if true because neogaf moderators have been so high and mighty and politically correct to the max, when it comes to stuff like that. Anyway glad that this paid by Sony forum is facing problems and hope it closes completely.
Live specimens are so much better than hypotheticals. So here's some important elements of this post:
Implicit hurt feelings about favorite company leading to hating the competitor (from previous studies)
Parading fake moral reasons, when then emotions expressed are actually about the console war
Making up conspiracy claim about "being paid", a classic
Happiness and hope about the possibility that posters hurting his feelings are silenced
The big one here is the hope competing views magically go away.
Keep fighting the good fight soldier.
Keep fighting the good fight soldier.
Are you really unaware how your posts cause other posters to see you as a fanboy? Or do you just not see that as a problem?
Are you trying to tell me that MrFox is NOT a Sony agent and if I read Sony's financial statements I won't see NeoGaf under Marketing Spending analysis?
My posts have been thus far...games I have played (mostly in psvr and PS4 pro) , criticism on checkerboarding , hating on gt:s , severe criticism on Microsoft about Scorpio actual specs and this year’s e3 presentation , positive posts about sony’s Investment in first party and that’s about it. If people see criticism on gt sports and clear preference for forza 7 as some sort of extreme fanboism the its their problem. Funny thing is that during e3 people were accusing me of being anti-ms. Anyway I never have problem with personal insults on the internet, like the mr. Fox post, and I am quite amused by it so all is well.
As far as neogaf goes, it’s a forum with an extremely fascistic attitude (in terms of actual behavior , they like to think themselves as liberals) and has been known to have ties with Sony for ages. One google search about sonygaf is enough or even simply reading that forum . Oh and no I have never been a member of that forum, but have been reading it since 2001, for the simple reason that I don’t have a paid e-mail which is necessary for them to accept you.
Now keep studying me
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