PC VR

[RancidLunchmeat]

So I got a Vive on Friday ($100 off Prime Day sale), and it is pretty bonkers.

First it is incredibly difficult to set up. I am a fairly tech savvy guy, I built the PC I am plugging it into, I am the go to tech guy at my office, etc. But the instructions do not tell you where all the cables go, there is like 5 ports on the back of the base stations, but nothing tells you that you only need to plug in power. This is quite annoying as you need to plug everything in to the base stations before you mount them.

The hub is the same way, although it is easier to access. Sure, there is a hdmi, power and USB, but what the hell is the mini USB port for? It isnt needed apparently but like the base stations, there is no guide or video that tells you how to set them up.

Finally, played around with it just a bit. Holy hell, so far the most impressive thing is the set up zen room, it is amazing. Played a couple of games briefly, but it is the weekend so I am drunk and that does not work well with VR.

So far, my opinion is that VR is next level. It is simply amazing. But it is no where close to mainstream. When I have to struggle with setup and configuration, there is no way that your typical user is going to this. When you add the $700 or $800 on top of a $1,500 PC, it is also out of reach for most. Especially when you realize that the VR experience is amazeballs but really only for 30 mins or so at a time.

 

[RancidLunchmeat]

Really? A graphics sub forum that I never even knew existed?

...ok

 

[manux]

The common complaint is that vive is like r&d hw. oculus rift is much more user friendly to setup.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

Yes, the Rift is extremely easy to setup in its base configuration. Even without the really simplistic instructions it'd be pretty easy to setup. Oculus absolutely nailed ease of setup.

Plug in camera (one USB), put it on your desk. Plug in headset (USB and HDMI). Make sure camera can see headset. Done.

Regards,
SB

 

[RancidLunchmeat]

So it's the opposite of the Vive then? It's really a pain to mount the base stations 7 feet up the wall, with a bunch of connections on the back that you can't access once mounted.

It's also a bit odd to have the base stations lit up constantly, it'd be nice if their LEDs would shut off when the computer is off so there's no eerie weird red glow coming from the room.

Oh well, I'll get more into the games this week. Last game I tried was subnautica and that was a complete no go after a few beers. Talk about sea sickness! Game looked fantastic for the 20 seconds or so before I ripped the helmet off and yelled 'Hell, No!'

 

[Rodéric]

Let's wait until the novelty effect wears off

 

[manux]

So it's the opposite of the Vive then? It's really a pain to mount the base stations 7 feet up the wall, with a bunch of connections on the back that you can't access once mounted.

It's also a bit odd to have the base stations lit up constantly, it'd be nice if their LEDs would shut off when the computer is off so there's no eerie weird red glow coming from the room.

Oh well, I'll get more into the games this week. Last game I tried was subnautica and that was a complete no go after a few beers. Talk about sea sickness! Game looked fantastic for the 20 seconds or so before I ripped the helmet off and yelled 'Hell, No!'

I highly recommend accounting from steam. It's real funny or offending and it is free.

 

[manux]

If you are wondering about adult entertainment czechvr has highest quality videos around. Shame nobody really makes any interesting high quality non sex related videos yet The samples are free to download without registering/paying. Gives good idea what vr video at best could be.

https://www.czechvr.com/

 

[RancidLunchmeat]

If you are wondering about adult entertainment czechvr has highest quality videos around. Shame nobody really makes any interesting high quality non sex related videos yet The samples are free to download without registering/paying. Gives good idea what vr video at best could be.

https://www.czechvr.com/

Not all heroes wear capes.

Let's wait until the novelty effect wears off

We'll see, one of the main benefits of VR to me was that all the games are short experiences and should allow 30 to 60 mins of game play without getting into something lengthy and complicated as I rarely have hours to set aside for gaming, nor do I really enjoy remembering where I left off from my previous gaming sessions that are weeks or months old.

 

[RancidLunchmeat]

Played about an hour yesterday, Subnautica (wow the water is gorgeous!) and Rec Room. It was pretty fun actually playing Rec Room, got pulled into a daily activity where you get split into teams to play charades? It was great, the best interactive game show experience since 1v100 on 360, and obviously far more immersive. I'm sure it'd be far more fun if playing with friends rather than randoms. Hoping to try Spiderman and Star Trek tonight.

 

[RancidLunchmeat]

So after being annoyed for about a week that my base stations wouldn't shut off when the PC shut off, I found out that if your PC is Bluetooth enabled, you can control them that way. So after buying a little USB BT adaptor, everything is much much better. The base stations shut off so their motors aren't constantly running, there's no eerie glow coming from the office in the middle of the night, and even better, the firmware can be upgraded without having to dismantle the base stations from their places 7.5 feet up on the wall and plugging them directly into the computer via USB.

I get that BT isn't a requirement for Vive, but it sure makes everything better and easier. I highly suggest it for those of you like me, that built your PC's and didn't spring for more expensive motherboards with integrated BT. The one I choose was just about $15, but only because I decided to buy the Asus one rather than the cheapest one which I think was around $12. It also makes the Xbox PC controller adaptor redundant unless I suddenly find 7 other friends that want to come over and game, but oh well.

Anybody got any other tips or tricks they want to share? I think getting rid of the lights and saving the wear and tear on the motors from the basestations as well as being able to upgrade them without needing a ladder is rather great.

 

[homerdog]

This is old news (Jan 2016) but I missed it. Forgive me if this has already been discussed.

AMD's graphics boss says VR needs 16K at 240Hz for 'true immersion'

The article goes on to explain that Raja means 16Kx16K (256MP!!) rather than the 16K Digital Cinema standard (15360×8640 - only a paltry 132.7MP). And he means 256MP per eye.

I seriously doubt we need 256MP per eye in order to make VR practically indistinguishable from real life. I'll go out on a limb and say 4Kx4K per eye is probably enough, 8K almost certainly provided there is effective AA and no screen door effect. How did Raja come to the conclusion that we need 256MP per eye for realistic VR? Perhaps by the time we have the hardware to run games at 512MP (both eyes) and 240FPS we will also have bionic eyeballs that can spot a prairie dog from geostationary orbit?

 

[RancidLunchmeat]

I'll go out on a limb and say 4Kx4K per eye is probably enough, 8K almost certainly provided there is effective AA and no screen door effect. How did Raja come to the conclusion that we need 256MP per eye for realistic VR? Perhaps by the time we have the hardware to run games at 512MP (both eyes) and 240FPS we will also have bionic eyeballs that can spot a prairie dog from geostationary orbit?

I totally agree with your premise. By the time tech is available for that, even with large headsets like Rift and Vive, the tech would have totally changed to the point of Google Glass type AR or possibly even AR contact lenses will exist before we see 256MP per eye in bulky VR headsets.

But, if I had Raja's job, I'd be pushing the same thing. Its his job to create the market for his bigger and better graphics cards. If he said future VR will be ubiquitous because everybody can do it with their cell phones and cheap cardboard-like attachments, he'd be putting himself out of business!

Maybe there will come a day when all those bitcoin mining operations turn over their GPU farms to source a cloud based solution that can be accessed for VR from anywhere in the world!

 

[RancidLunchmeat]

If you are wondering about adult entertainment czechvr has highest quality videos around. Shame nobody really makes any interesting high quality non sex related videos yet The samples are free to download without registering/paying. Gives good idea what vr video at best could be.

https://www.czechvr.com/

Yeah, okay.. I did it. I'm not ashamed to admit it.

Uhh... holy crap. Like for real. The first video (Yes, I watched more than one, stop judging me!) wasn't good at all. It was like the chick kept trying to climb inside of me while getting screwed by a guy from behind. It was very unsettling and not at all pleasant. The next video, however, which was more POV was just holy crap.

On a more PG rated note, Vive Video comes with a Dunkirk teaser video that is amazeballs! The bit where you are under water with bullets flying around you and dead bodies floating everywhere is immersive as hell. The part with the planes after that wasn't very good, but the beginning was awesome.

Hey.. does anybody know how to turn off the menu selection bar in Vive Video? It breaks the immersion every time you turn and look in that direction.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

I'll go out on a limb and say 4Kx4K per eye is probably enough, 8K almost certainly provided there is effective AA and no screen door effect.

4k x 4k is most definitely not going to be enough. Not even close, IMO. Even at the rather pathetic FOV that VR is currently at. 8k x 8k for the current FOV would be decent probably. Right now the pixels are absolutely massive so a reduction by 4 in each direction (4k x 4k) will be welcomed but still show quite obvious pixels.

The thing is, the FOV needs to be increased significantly over what the current headsets have. So 16k x 16k with expanded FOV would be decent, IMO. Not sure it would be ideal, but it would be pretty decent.

Regards,
SB

 

[manux]

If it was possible to have much higher pixels density where eye focuses and have less outside focus that would help a lot with the required resolution. Brute forcing pixels "equally" is not a great path forward.

This company is trying to achieve that but I have no idea if their solution is good or bullshit to get hype.

http://www.varjo.com/

 

[homerdog]

4k x 4k is most definitely not going to be enough. Not even close, IMO. Even at the rather pathetic FOV that VR is currently at. 8k x 8k for the current FOV would be decent probably. Right now the pixels are absolutely massive so a reduction by 4 in each direction (4k x 4k) will be welcomed but still show quite obvious pixels.

The thing is, the FOV needs to be increased significantly over what the current headsets have. So 16k x 16k with expanded FOV would be decent, IMO. Not sure it would be ideal, but it would be pretty decent.

Regards,
SB

Unfortunately there's no way to test this so all we have is our opinions.

To be clear, I am assuming *perfect* AA in all cases. I think it would be hard to tell the difference between 4Kx4K and 8Kx8K when neither have any visible aliasing. I am also not very familiar with VR and could be totally wrong

 

[Deleted member 13524]

Microsoft store has the Acer and HP headsets for sale:

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Windo...vailable-on-the-Microsoft-Store.239852.0.html

$300 and $330.
I guess this will put a huge pressure on HTC and Valve to lower Vive's price.

4k x 4k is most definitely not going to be enough. Not even close, IMO. Even at the rather pathetic FOV that VR is currently at.

I used to think PSVR's 90º FoV was pathetic until I tried it.
It's the same as viewing through a pair of regular glasses.. and that doesn't really bother me a lot. I have a Cardboard VR headset with a larger 110º FoV to use with my AMOLED 2560*1440 phone (Axon 7), and I don't think the larger FoV contributes that much to the immersion experience. I do notice a sizeable difference regarding the higher resolution, though. That's really noticeable in videos even though the difference in amount of subpixels between PSVR and my phone is only ~30%.
IMHO, we should pursue the higher pixel density a lot more than larger FoV.
After we reach decent pixel density closer to visual acuity, then we should pursue larger FoVs for "total immersion".

 

[Silent_Buddha]

Microsoft store has the Acer and HP headsets for sale:

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Windo...vailable-on-the-Microsoft-Store.239852.0.html

$300 and $330.
I guess this will put a huge pressure on HTC and Valve to lower Vive's price.



I used to think PSVR's 90º FoV was pathetic until I tried it.
It's the same as viewing through a pair of regular glasses.. and that doesn't really bother me a lot. I have a Cardboard VR headset with a larger 110º FoV to use with my AMOLED 2560*1440 phone (Axon 7), and I don't think the larger FoV contributes that much to the immersion experience. I do notice a sizeable difference regarding the higher resolution, though. That's really noticeable in videos even though the difference in amount of subpixels between PSVR and my phone is only ~30%.
IMHO, we should pursue the higher pixel density a lot more than larger FoV.
After we reach decent pixel density closer to visual acuity, then we should pursue larger FoVs for "total immersion".

As I've noted before, I apparently notice it far more than other people. But current VR FOV is hugely irritating due to the fact that it results in the view basically being segmented into 3 sections with black half circle edges separating the left, middle, and right areas.

That's obviously caused by the fact that view from the 2 screens don't overlap 100% due to the need for there to be separate views to achieve proper stereoscopic separation. Hence for me, as I've mentioned, the area where the left and right edges overlap, there's a quite obvious black edge in the view of the world. This is caused by the fact that the background is pure black, which enhances the stereoscopic overlap artifact.

For me, this likely isn't going to be resolved until the FOV is at least 180 degrees or so. Basically until the edges of where the views overlap are no longer visible anywhere near the frontal vision cone. It may be possible that somewhere in the 150-170 degree region, it would be far enough to the edges that I wouldn't notice it, but I'm not sure.

Regards,
SB

 

[RancidLunchmeat]

Okay, just got my first taste of horror VR FPS with Dead Effect 2.

Quite frightening when the zombies coming running straight at you and you're all out of bullets and haven't figured out how to reload yet.

Pretty damn fun but so intense I only played through the very first objective and decided I had enough for now.

I don't know how it ranks compared to other VR games, but it seems pretty good. All the reviews were positive which is why I got it.