Yes, the original PS3 looked like a premium bit of kit...and of course weight makes it feel more expensive!
PS4 Pro Speculation (PS4K NEO Kaio-Ken-Kutaragi-Kaz Neo-san)
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Yes, the original PS3 looked like a premium bit of kit...and of course weight makes it feel more expensive!
Sure, I get that but since it's not powerful enough to go "full" 4K what better way to sell it as premium than to double the frame rate? The GPU bump should be good enough for 1440p, maybe better AF, AA and some extra FX, but it wouldn't be able to improve frame rates (to significant extent). This would also be pretty cheap, since I can imagine Jaguar cores are inexpensive.
You should know by now to wear gloves when these things fall off the back of a truck.
upnorthsox
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Agreed that a quieter console could be a price premium but imo almost all of the noise comes from the spinning drives, so in that case an SSD and restricting the BD drive to 4x would do more than 4 lbs of additional cooling.
upnorthsox
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There's also the possibility that they are significantly boosting clocks and thus the need for more significant cooling.
D
Deleted member 13524
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[ After 2+ years of lurking my 1st post]
In absence of Zen CPU being available, would you think it's possible that Sony could consider using 3-4 Jaguar modules (12-16 cores) instead of just 2 in OG PS4? Based on the presentations I've seen a lot of modern engines are multithreaded with job schedulers, so maybe this would be how they can improve performance in CPU-restricted games or double the frame rates?
We've seen slides where Sony shares the amount and architecture of compute units and CPU modules in the Neo's hardware. It's a 36 compute units iGPU and 2*4-core Jaguar CPU.
The moment they shared this information was most probably when the chip was already in (or very close to) mass production stage, which means there's no way they could make any major changes since then. Unless they scraped the whole thing and are planning to launch an entirely different console in late 2017.
As a reaction to Scorpio's announced specs, the only thing they could do within that time frame is take their existing SoC and clock it higher at the cost of a more expensive/larger heat dissipation and power converter units.
So if there's a Neo coming out in September/October, it'll definitely have a 36 CU GCN iGPU and 8 Jaguar cores, which they may or may not have decided to clock above the 911MHz/2.1GHz values they have already mentioned.
Totally, just look at the RX 480's massive heatsink made up of
hm... Not sure which review of the stock cooler you were pulling the noise measurements (at the lower clock speeds), but the Anandtech preview had it to about 50 dBA during a gaming load, or 53 dBA in the Furmark (might expect some console devs to obtain higher utilization than PC games, I suppose, but anyways - worst case scenario).
Of course, there's the clock & voltage coming into play, but I'm not sure about speculating in-between since I don't know how throttling or the boost functions on there. The chip temperature would also be somewhat a function of the enclosure as well, so again I'm not sure how that compares when the setup is a much tighter space compared to your typical computer chassis. I don't know what the specific environment conditions were for the Anandtech article though.
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Anyways, yes. Certainly there must be a fair bit of leeway factoring in 911MHz vs 1150-1266MHz power consumptions.
All CPU cores are inexpensive. They are measured in dozens of mm2 [even latest i7 cores].
There is the question of what the SOC would support. The northbridge and queues the modules plug into would need to support more things hanging off of them, and generally AMD has not opted for an uncore architecture that scales well without a redesign of the interface. AMD's chips below the Bulldozer server chips don't have more things plugging into the uncore than what we have now, and what is there now is not particularly good or likely to get better if increased.[ After 2+ years of lurking my 1st post
In absence of Zen CPU being available, would you think it's possible that Sony could consider using 3-4 Jaguar modules (12-16 cores) instead of just 2 in OG PS4? Based on the presentations I've seen a lot of modern engines are multithreaded with job schedulers, so maybe this would be how they can improve performance in CPU-restricted games or double the frame rates?
It seems like even at its worst that the RX 480's ASIC-level power control was good at capping things at 110W. I suppose there's room for AMD to muck things up, but all parameters being equal outside of the SOC it seems like this shouldn't require a massive over-engineering of the cooler. I would hope it's for other reasons than a Jaguar shrink and a significantly down-clocked GPU combining to draw way more power than the sum of their probable draw in isolation.
upnorthsox
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Maybe it includes the Foxconn guy's 2 kilos of heroin that you are then supposed to forward on to his local dealer
This seems like wishful thinking. If premium means cooler and quieter, it does open a branch of thinking that aligns with increased case size and weight.
We know it will likely use a blower. Blowers are loud because of pressure. Pressure creates cooling, but pressure is always loud.
Reduce the pressure by increasing the throat, but simultaneously increase the surface area of the heat sink and you get effectively cooling quieter, at the cost of console size and a more expensive heat sink.
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Bagel seed
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Will it have the rotateable PS logo like PS2 and PS3 did?
The real question is, what's in it for Sony?
They have a price point they want to meet. They sent out the dev kits a while ago.
So what if Scorpio is more powerful? If they attempt to bridge the gap, all MS has to do is widen in next year. It's a moving goal post for Sony.
We have to assume there is a lot more to Neo than just another platform, Sony has plans to follow as well. If it's not a big stretch then sure, like adding on more memory. Trying to get a crazy high clock on a console? Eh. I dunno. That's quite a bit more of a stretch considering that the clocks are probably as high as they want it to go already.
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Well it's all relative. An extra 50-100MHz is still going to be well below actual RX 480 but will still give an extra several hundred Gflops of gpu power. And if it is as large as the leaks say it is they should go for it.
Bagel seed
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Could've been dev pressure, could be that they saw the sentiment online, pre or post Scorpio. I think it was mostly the latter, but probably a mix in the end. Apparently some first party devs wanted more memory.
Scorpio isn't really a threat to Sony, but 5.5TF vs 6 or 7 doesn't look as bad as 4.2 vs 6. MS still has to come in around $500 next year after all so I dont see them hitting 8TF or anything like that.
Not 8TF. But i could see them hitting 6.5TF.
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