PS4 Pro Speculation (PS4K NEO Kaio-Ken-Kutaragi-Kaz Neo-san)

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pjbliverpool said:
Do we know there is a PS4 slim even planned? What if PS4K actually IS the PS4 slim? Depending on exactly how power efficienct Polaris is, and how keen AMD are to see it in a console, isn't it concevable that not only could it be possible to fit in a smaller chasis, but that it could be just as cheap (or close) as shinking the existing PS4 APU?

Since it's 100% backwards compatible with the PS4, they could simply be planning to retire the old PS4 model altogether. That would certainly encourage movement to the PS4K and result in a more even split of the market.
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That'd be the most problematic situation for Sony. It'd mean the latest buyers being properly shafted. That's true of mobiles, but not consoles and they'd be (probably rightly) up in arms having paid £300 for a PS4 only for the next guy to spend £300 getting a Neo. There'd have to be a value difference. Worst case, Neo is cheaper to make but Sony charge a premium to price it higher (good business sense given likely demand!) and take a loss on PS4 to clear out old stock. Dangerous territory though.
 
Shifty Geezer said:
That'd be the most problematic situation for Sony. It'd mean the latest buyers being properly shafted. That's true of mobiles, but not consoles and they'd be (probably rightly) up in arms having paid £300 for a PS4 only for the next guy to spend £300 getting a Neo. There'd have to be a value difference. Worst case, Neo is cheaper to make but Sony charge a premium to price it higher (good business sense given likely demand!) and take a loss on PS4 to clear out old stock. Dangerous territory though.
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I would expect Sony to sell the system at a quite high price, I mean that is 4TFLOPS and that extra powered is going to be loss on most users that only have a FullHD TV or do not plan to buy Sony VR headset (depending which rabbits Sony is after with the system). In both case it's going to be a small number of buyers with either a great buying power or willing to spend a lot on tech (same result): they should aim at comfortable margins nothing like traditional consoles.
EDIT
If the system is about improved VR experience it could make for the system to ship with a morpheus headset with the whole thing amounting to quite a few bucks, 999$ is not that crazy looking at the price of the competition (PC + occulus or HTC Vive).
 
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I hope it won't be too expensive and I don't think it will. I just see it as Playstation 2016 model vs current 2013 model. The old model will be cheaper and the new one takes the place of older system. This is what you get now for around the same price and powerdraw. This is how a Playstation console launching in 2016 looks like regardless of what happened in the past. It is going to run regular games and VR games in higher fidelity than PS4, so users with 1080p TV or PSVR are going to see all the benefits of it, whether that's higher framerate, resolution or details.
 
On the other hand, it seems like despite having 4TF to demand top billing, other facets are rumored to be unchanged like HDD bandwidth, and Sony doesn't want this premium product to have premium game play features.

A fun speculation point is that GCN as it is currently known cannot support the 36 CU load with the PS4's apparent 2 shader engines. GCN allows for 16 CUs per engine, which is fine for 20 physical CUs, but that would cap Neo at 32 CUs.
Possibly, Sony could pay for that restriction to be tweaked.
Otherwise, it needs a bump in the shader engine count--which has implications for the per-engine setup hardware and ROP partition. The PS4 has 32 ROPs, so a scenario where there are 4 shader engines could subdivide the pool and still leave a number per engine that doesn't depart from other GCN configurations if Sony opted to not double the count.
 
MrFox said:
Don't kill me for asking this.... is it possible the specs rumor is false?

There's a lot of well corroborated rumors about Neo, but I see only a single source that leaked the specs.
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Didn't both Giantbomb and Eurogamer confirm those specs...?
 
Df said they have seen the specs but we're waiting for another source too confirm the info was correct, then another site leaked it so you have two separate sources at least.

Sent from my SM-G928F using Tapatalk
 
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3dilettante said:
On the other hand, it seems like despite having 4TF to demand top billing, other facets are rumored to be unchanged like HDD bandwidth, and Sony doesn't want this premium product to have premium game play features.

A fun speculation point is that GCN as it is currently known cannot support the 36 CU load with the PS4's apparent 2 shader engines. GCN allows for 16 CUs per engine, which is fine for 20 physical CUs, but that would cap Neo at 32 CUs.
Possibly, Sony could pay for that restriction to be tweaked.
Otherwise, it needs a bump in the shader engine count--which has implications for the per-engine setup hardware and ROP partition. The PS4 has 32 ROPs, so a scenario where there are 4 shader engines could subdivide the pool and still leave a number per engine that doesn't depart from other GCN configurations if Sony opted to not double the count.
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Though the rumours do not speak about ROPs at all, it is just nonsensical to double the number of CUs and keep the ROPS the same. It is a given that if the system have 36 CUS it will have more than 32 ROPs or so I think at least. No matter what is Sony plan for the system (increased resolution closer to 4K, higher frame rate for VR or a blend of both) they plan to draw more pixels, a lot more pixels hence more ROPs.
 
mpg1 said:
Didn't both Giantbomb and Eurogamer confirm those specs...?
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Ok I read it again and while Eurogamer is referencing GiantBomb, they said they also have access to the same documentation. Nevermind.

Hold on, I'll attempt to meditate an accelerated Kubler-Ross...

I refuse to believe it, the rumors must be false.
I am angry Sony is doing this to us. Why? WHY!
If this isn't true, I'll stop making jokes constantly on B3D.
I feel really sad for the early adopters, think of the children.
Okay, it's definitely real, maybe it's for the best. Day one preorder! Wheeeee!!!
 
liolio said:
Though the rumours do not speak about ROPs at all, it is just nonsensical to double the number of CUs and keep the ROPS the same. It is a given that if the system have 36 CUS it will have more than 32 ROPs or so I think at least. No matter what is Sony plan for the system (increased resolution closer to 4K, higher frame rate for VR or a blend of both) they plan to draw more pixels, a lot more pixels hence more ROPs.
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380x has 32 ROPs with 32 CU's. And the expectation on that to run at higher resolutions would be greater than on the PS4K.
 
pjbliverpool said:
380x has 32 ROPs with 32 CU's. And the expectation on that to run at higher resolutions would be greater than on the PS4K.
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Memory is a complicated thing lol I was sure both Tonga and Tahiti were ahead of Pitcarin on that front, I went back and check some article you are indeed right. I still think it makes sense for Sony to increase the ROPs throughput (more than the rumored upclock would).
 
Michellstar said:
I tend to think now that AMD fooled both Sony and Ms, and force them to redesign their socs...
Passing them inaccurate info about a powerful refresh that was on the cards for either party :smile2:
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It would not surprise me if a 20nm shrink was part of the original plan for both Sony and MSFT, now did AMD lie or 20nm went really wrong? I would favor the later.
 
If you ask me PS4 neo is a misstep for Sony. They hit a good place with the PS4 dominating the market and PS4 owners have successfully belittled the Xbox one enough to break MS's momentum going forward with the 360 yet now you'll neo owners doing the same to PS4. It's almost like Sony are going to create a mini civil war within their own faithful.

Then there is the VR question. Obviously Sony are banking a lot on it, and PS4 neo will probably be mandatory rather than optional going forward.
 
Don't buy it, and enjoy the same games on your PS4 that you'd have bought anyway.
And no, Neo will not be probably mandatory for PSVR.
Next!
 
Commenter said:
If you ask me PS4 neo is a misstep for Sony. They hit a good place with the PS4 dominating the market and PS4 owners have successfully belittled the Xbox one enough to break MS's momentum going forward with the 360 yet now you'll neo owners doing the same to PS4. It's almost like Sony are going to create a mini civil war within their own faithful.

Then there is the VR question. Obviously Sony are banking a lot on it, and PS4 neo will probably be mandatory rather than optional going forward.
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Neo exists mainly because of PSVR IMO. Neo without VR would have being a bigger mistep (even if it's not). They could have sold 100 millions without VR, maybe. My guess is that they want more with PSVR, maybe they really want PS2 level of sucess, again.

A lot is going to depend on virtual reality, and its software. VR could be the DVD player attractive feature of the PS4.

And like during PS2 era, PS4 is the only console in the VR market (PS2 was the only console having a DVD player, at least at the beginning). You want a plug and play console to play VR games? Easy, buy a PS4! Worry not, this console is also the best selling one and has the best 1st party and 3rd party non-VR games.

No competition again! How is that possible? What were the others thinking? :|
 
I wouldn't be surprised if more people bought the PS4 Neo for the 4K video, both UHD Blu Ray and the Netflix and other streaming clients, than PSVR.
 
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