We already know a lot about how QB is breaking away from the standard formula. I really don't understand your point there... unless it's only to counter criticism of your preferred platform's exclusive with an attack on the other platform's exclusive.
The Order: 1886
- Thread starter Bagel seed
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We already know a lot about how QB is breaking away from the standard formula. I really don't understand your point there... unless it's only to counter criticism of your preferred platform's exclusive with an attack on the other platform's exclusive.
Sigfried1977
Legend
^while there's obviously a lot more at stake here, the big budget games that acually did become sales records all took some significant risks. Take a franchise such as Assassin's Creed for example. There was nothing quite like it ever before, and despite its annual schedule, the devs are actually still willing to take chances with the franchise. Heck, even the CoD games aren't averse to change. Black Ops2 did some really neat things with the campaign for example. Seems to pay off handsomely for them too. All the while the countless me-too franchises are barely turning a profit. That is if they do not outright sink companies left and right.
One thing I will suggest to MJP, given that it'd be easy to do, is to release shots with various settings for the post effects and gauge player opinion. At the end of the day, you are wanting to maximise appeal based on your audience's preference. If more people will buy the game with less CA, or more, then you want to put that it in. Art leads may take offence that the crude, ignorant masses don't know a thing about fine art, but if people are saying, "yuck, too much blur," and that can be changed with a single parameter tweak, it strikes me as far more sensible to make the tweak.
I'd love to see the effect of different amounts of CA and film effects, all the way from zero to extreme. It may also prove the value of them in adding authenticity and stop the detractors from grumbling.
I'd love to see the effect of different amounts of CA and film effects, all the way from zero to extreme. It may also prove the value of them in adding authenticity and stop the detractors from grumbling.
Bagel seed
Veteran
^^Focus testing? There's pros and cons to that. I think if RAD is content with their vision and art style they should stick with it. They can still sell the game adequately on its current merits. It's not like 'blurry' games are sales bombs in the making (multitudes of upscaled games say hello). This graphics nitpicking is simply forum dweller OCD.
Quantum Break, Gears, Uncharted, TLOU are all TPS. All different approach. For Quantum Break the small gameplay segment don't show some revolution of TPS, they will show innovation in extended gameplay at E3... But I am sure it will be a very good games.
I had a PS3 and a 360 and Gears was a good game and I think the next one will not be a revolution but an evolution and it will be a very good game.
All games don't need to be a revolution and The Order is not only a succession of shooting sequence from what we heard from the dev... But we will see more at E3.... I think Sony marketing team failed hard... But it is not the first time and not the last time...
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I agree...
So many games (and films) have overdone the post effects only to receive criticism. JJ Abrahms has even gone on record as overdoing it and has recognised as much and is cutting back on his lens flare. I see nothing wrong with getting creative feedback from one's audience. Of course, there's nothing wrong with sticking to one's guns either if one's got a significant artistic vision, but the main purpose here is to make money. I really doubt the degree of CA is an artist objective at RAD. I expect they want camera realism, have put in this convincing effect, but haven't nailed the look because CA in games is fairly new. Whenever a new effect is introduce to real-time graphics it tends to be overused. And if you're really close to an artwork, it's often hard to get a realistic perspective as your end users/viewers will experience. I can imagine tweaking the CA, feeling it was too little, adding a bit more to get where we are so they can see it, and thinking that's the sweet-spot. But a little public consultation may show they've overshot a little and dialling it back a bit will result in a result that's the believable filmic look RAD want.
The only downside is if the public say, "no, we don't like it," and yet RAD go ahead with it (or vice versa) because that'll impact sales. If that's the case, it's better not to ask the public's opinion and then you aren't going to be flatly ignoring them.
L. Scofield
Veteran
I wouldn't mind the blur if their technique didn't mess up the colors as well. It's like looking at anaglyph 3D source images.
Inuhanyou
Veteran
I think RaD don't have much to worry about when the only major complaint is "its a third person shooter". Like yeah we pretty much figured that out a while back. I'm much more interested in the world, the characters, the story and of course the atmosphere. Like LoU, the only the the gameplay needs to be for me personally is solid enough not to get in the way of everything else.
Or they could just put a cinematic lens toggle in the options.
Some games already had options for on-screen filters (Gears of War, Mass Effect, Uncharted 2).
I'm all in favour of options, but they require more effort than fixed values. If the parameters' are going to be baked, test them before release is my suggestion. Have an option is of course much better. But 'on or off' wouldn't work in this case. I think people grumbling about the CA is about the degree. They still want the cinematic lens, just balanced differently.
Bagel seed
Veteran
I have no hard evidence, but it seems everytime I hear about something being focused tested be it movies or games, they tend it either water it down or make it safer. Whether or not sales improved because of it can be hit or miss too (see Fuse).
That said, I agree with you on new post effects often being over applied. That also being said.. I'm not sure the average Joe would notice it, yet
The CA is slightly overdone, but not significantly so, imo. I like the idea of having graphics options though.
I think the 2 are caused by the same technique:
Apparently it's some kind of specular contrast blurring algorithm. Its job is to wash out any specular constrasts (luminance and/or colors based?). I am not a fan of this technique, obviously.
This has already been explained to you by myself and MJP, and I'm a bit annoyed that you haven't learnt and are repeating this FUD. Gaussian != blur. Gaussian is a mathematical function. It's being applied here precisely as it should* to simulate high frequency averaging from small specular highlights over distance
*I've no idea how accurate or effective the implementation is, but the mathematical basis is spot on.
The blurring is probably caused by two elements. I believe there's an actual blur in effect. There's also chromatic aberration which adds the coloured halos, which is being applied with distance from my brief look at some pictures. The correct way to do this would be to separate the image into wavelengths and position the wavelengths at different positions, which would blur everything. that'd be straightforward to implement in a post effect shader. (colour seperation > positon/scale > recombine)
It's an interesting idea, but I would imagine there would a lot of barriers to actually doing that publicly. Integrating something into our focus tests would be much more realistic proposition. We already do focus tests, although they're generally focused on gameplay and level design. Either way I don't think I would just want to release still shots, since I wouldn't want to bias people towards techniques that work well in a single frame but have temporal issues. This is particularly relevant with regards to antialiasing, since you can make tradeoffs between preserving high-frequency details and suppressing temporal artifacts.
Great graphics, great rendering choice(forward rendering and MSAA) the game is so clean, the most cgish game.
And congratulatinons to artist, design team and I am very happy to see artwork so well ported to the game engine. Like the gritty mood, the filtrer grain, London choice... Like the vision it will be a great game.
Sorry english is not my native language.
Thank you! We try really hard to achieve a clean, cohesive look to everything in the game. I will pass along your kind words to the rest of the team.
