Battlefield 4 official discussion/thread. [PS4,XO,PS3,X360]

Finally the game is ready? And what do we get as an apology? A refund?
You don't get a refund for a product you own. If you wanted a refund because the game was broken, you needed to return it to the retailer as your contract is with them, not the creator (at least AFAIK in most countries). If you keep possession of the product, especially if you play it later when fixed, then you aren't entitled to a refund. Maybe a partial refund as a gesture of goodwill, but if you factor in the cost of making the game and updating it, to then want DICE to throw all that money away and give you the game for free is asking them to commit Harakiri.

They should have got no money at release for a broken game. Now the game works, they should be paid what the game is worth. All you've really lost is the potential interest on that $60 if you hadn't bought the game on release and waited until now. A fancy lawyer might to able to convince folk that you've also lost entertainment where you could have been playing something else with that money and are entitled to compensation to the value of lost entertainment, but that'd be one helluva fancy lawyer!

I'm very much anti-bugs and broken software, but the solution isn't to want refunds after bug-fixes. That's untenable.
 
actually battlefield is protected by GGG program from EA. So you can ask refund in the 1st week or month (i forgot) after buying it from origin.
 
You don't get a refund for a product you own. If you wanted a refund because the game was broken, you needed to return it to the retailer as your contract is with them, not the creator (at least AFAIK in most countries). If you keep possession of the product, especially if you play it later when fixed, then you aren't entitled to a refund. Maybe a partial refund as a gesture of goodwill, but if you factor in the cost of making the game and updating it, to then want DICE to throw all that money away and give you the game for free is asking them to commit Harakiri. They should have got no money at release for a broken game. Now the game works, they should be paid what the game is worth. All you've really lost is the potential interest on that $60 if you hadn't bought the game on release and waited until now. A fancy lawyer might to able to convince folk that you've also lost entertainment where you could have been playing something else with that money and are entitled to compensation to the value of lost entertainment, but that'd be one helluva fancy lawyer! I'm very much anti-bugs and broken software, but the solution isn't to want refunds after bug-fixes. That's untenable.


I pre-ordered the game and even the season pass. Costed 110 Euros...I know its crazy, but back then BF was my favorite online franchise.

First month: game did not work. Finished SP the first afternoon. But online did not work: server issues, crashes, maps without sounds, random server de-connections: every time the claim to patch the game, me and my friends tried it out...no success pure frustration. But still, if you just count the numbers...yes even in this time we had Several hours of 'fun'! Back then, we were die hard BF fans and just wanted the game to work and play some epic rounds...we waited week over week believing that DICE fixes the game....GGG my ass.

I stopped playing. My friends as well. Coming back a few weeks later: still many issues, no fun. I once tried one of the DLC maps, but never touched the others, as in meantime the community has also dissipated.

I have no interest in playing the game 100 years later, now that it is 'fixed'.

So, Mr Shifty Geezer...what do you say? Is it my fault? Did I have enough 'hours of fun'? I am to blame that I did not give back the game in the first week? Is it my fault that DICE does openly lie to their customers: 'everything is on hold until we fix the game, no DLC is released!' (Everyone who followed the game knows how this turned out.)

You make it sound that I play now this beautiful bug free game and after 100 hours of pure joy I want still my money back because I am the evil customer who wants to steal from the poor devs.
No.

I want responsibility from devs and publishers. They earn big money, but in a law free space, were customers are just dumb cattle for them.


OT: played 3 hours of the new BL game...already had 2 mission bugs: items I need to pick up crashed through world geometry and were unreachable. Door to the boss fight did not open. Nice.
 
I pre-ordered the game and even the season pass. Costed 110 Euros...I know its crazy, but back then BF was my favorite online franchise
...

So, Mr Shifty Geezer...what do you say? Is it my fault? Did I have enough 'hours of fun'? I am to blame that I did not give back the game in the first week?
...

I also bought the pre order for 110 Euros based on my BF3 experience, and I would definitely say that the issue is customers like us. If noone would preorder and if people would return it if it was not up to the correct standards, these issues would be far fewer.
 
BFBC2 was awesome
then i pre order BF3

BF3 = underwhelming (in term of freedom, destruction, and teamwork)

so i did not pre-order BF4 but decided to buy it after i got affected by the "LEVOLUTION" marketing buzz.
then when i played it, BF4 = buggy mess that even more underwhelming than BF3.

so by these experience, i wont buy BF5 until i tried a demo/friend or if i got affected by another new marketing buzz :/
 
So, Mr Shifty Geezer...what do you say? Is it my fault? Did I have enough 'hours of fun'?
No.
I am to blame that I did not give back the game in the first week?
Yes. And you're to blame for not giving back the game after weeks and weeks of undelivered promises. You should have sought a refund immediately it became apparent that the game was no good and DICE weren't going to fix it within a reasonable timespan. Not a year later after it's been 'fixed'. You chose to wait until it was fixed so you could finally play the game you paid for. Now you can.

You make it sound that I play now this beautiful bug free game and after 100 hours of pure joy I want still my money back because I am the evil customer who wants to steal from the poor devs.
I said no such thing. I said you're not entitled to a refund on a game that works. And I said a refund after the investment to fix it would possibly sink DICE. The time to choose whether the game was worth it (and by implication, DICE) was at launch. If everyone wanted a refund, DICE would have probably closed shop and the game would have ended there an unfinished mess. By leaving their money with DICE, consumers financed the fixing of the game. I'm not going to claim it was a perfect effort by DICE - I'm just stating an independent observation on the situation and where responsibilities lay within the timeline.

I want responsibility from devs and publishers. They earn big money, but in a law free space, were customers are just dumb cattle for them.
It's not a law free space. You have consumer rights to get a product that works. How much did you fight for that in the beginning? I just managed to get a refund from Steam for BG2:EE on the fact it was provided without a manual or tutorial and I couldn't play the thing! So I wanted a refund to get BG1:EE to play the game as that title came with the necessary components needed to learn it. They were resistant, sticking by their 'no refunds' policy, but I didn't let up because I was confident of my rights - a bought product has to be fit for purpose and usable. We've had other folk pressuring the likes of Steam into giving in to this issue too when a game has clearly been a buggy mess. If you didn't try to get a refund back then, you certainly aren't entitled to one now!

The law outlines a course of action. First, you request a refund. Second, if it's not dealt with suitably, you have to write to head office. If that's not resolved to your satisfaction, you then seek further legal action (not necessarily lawyers if trade bodies are involved). Obviously there are variations by country, but you probably weren't at their mercy to rip you off. Waiting a year for the game to get fixed and then requesting a refund is the wrong way to go about it. If you feel hard done by, kick up a stink and look for some sweeteners from EA like free content. Ultimately though, you paid for a working BF4 game and that's what you've got (eventually!), so what's the justification for a refund?
 
Not to twist the knife, but anyone spending 110 quid on a game without even knowing if it's good or not, is a FOOL. What the hell is the point of preordering a game?? It's not like it's going to be short in supply like a console or a piece of hardware. FOOLS!!!!
 
Yes. And you're to blame...

True, I learned that. It was my fault believing in DICE that they fix their game within a month. Problem back then was, that I really wanted the game to work...I really wanted to play it, I was a big fan (played through all the classes in BF3 several times and so on...). But I am healed now! And I cut my losses and move on, I know it is to late now. But DICE is on my blacklist now, and they can celebrate...because they are the only one on this list :smile:

I already changed my behaviour and don't buy games in advance, maybe even wait a few weeks until they get cheap. DC hit me again, but this was still my PS4 (preorder) bundle item...so it costs me 'nothing', only nerves :cool:

@London Boy: you ass!! :mrgreen:
 
I still play a lot of BF4 to be honest. It's still the best online shooter on the PS4 by far IMO.
 
To be fair, DICE had a reputation for putting out ambitious projects that were a bit rough around the edges at first. It's not dumb to preorder based on that sort of reputation. It so came to pass that this particular product skipped normal QA in order to beat COD to retail by a few days. I hope gamers aren't dumb enough to preorder Battlefield: Cops and Robbers en masse this time. EA needs to be severely punished for screwing up BF4.

Every game I was anticipating on PS4 turned out to be a turd. So...I guess I'll play another PS3 game I skipped, or maybe even read a book.
 
BF4 was the best game on ps4 for me till Infamous and Child of Light came in. Then Destiny arrived and wiped everything away ! I am very happy with my ps4. Tried going back to the ps3 once or twice but that just doesn't cut it at all now.
Metro Redux were also very awesome in parts. Still have to complete Last Light, but Destiny won't let me.
 
So the first next-gen game i'm getting is BF4, what are people's thoughts now (after the huge patch) on how it compares to BF3 MP - gameplay wise? (ignoring technical issues)

Is it as fun, worse? More balanced, less balanced?

And is it possible to buy all the unlocks? I don't particularly want to put 50 hours in just to unlock my optimum loadout (that I used in BF3) again.
 
BF4 vs BF3
- smaller map
- smaller fly-area
- less destruction
- more awesome destruction
- a lot more weapon and customization and perks (infantry and vehicles)
- more focused on small-scale battle (even the air-battle is funnelled)
- mini interactivity in map (working elevator, shutter gate, etc)
- certain map have great weather effect that affect visual, audio, and gameplay.
- auto-kill turret on base (press Q to mark enemy and turret will kill them).
- more modes for "infantry-funnelled" play-style.


basically its the natural progression from BFBC2 to BF3 to BF4. The gameplay more and more optimized for small-scale war.
 
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