XBox One, PS4, DRM, and You

[function]

Even if a game required an online connection for persistent game elements, and had no fallback offline mode (like sim city where the offline mode was configed out) that still wouldn't necessarily place a a PS4 game in the same tent as every Bone game. Unless the PS4 game came with a single-use code, the game could still be given or lent to friends an infinite number of times.

The amount of interference that the (minority going by the latest poll) Xbox crowd are running against PS4 is incredible. The two systems aren't the same, the most you can say is that publishers may force some games to be limited similarly to how every single XBone game is limited thanks to system level restrictions.

"Online only" is just one element of the XBones anti-consumer DRM policy.
"No rental" is another.
"No resale" is another.
"No gifting without most benevolent glorious publisher support (but only once)" is another.
"No lending" is another, and it's possibly the most overtly contemptuous thing they've done. And no, it has nothing to do with "no-disk play" or "always online" or even "no resale". Their DRM system can handle lending, but they've chosen to block it. It's a choice all in itself that has nothing to do with anything else.

 

[-tkf-]

pretty easy to work around the negative things when you really want something huh.

Huh?

When i started with PS+ it was because it gave a wealth of value to me, it was something that Sony offered by which i gained something.

I can PERFECTLY understand why people wouldn't buy a PS4 now that online costs money it's very easy to understand. You buy a console, you buy a game, you try to go online.. you have to pay again?

I am very conscious of the limitations that the XBOX Live model imposes on me, and my purchases will reflect this.

Sadly Sony learned the hard way that consumers are stupid and does not focus on the cost of ownership, they just focus on what the price is here and now. If Sony made a $499 sku with free online forever i would buy that instead

 

[Lycan]

Ballmer is the worst thing that happened to MS in a long, long time.

 

[Jwm]

Article up at edge: http://m.edge-online.com/news/e3-20...ar-policies-across-both-consoles-say-sources/

 

[Lycan]

The issue was cleared by a formal statement from Sony yesterday, and Shuhei Yoshida reiterated no DRM during the podcast beyond. However, he stated, Sony has no control over the online portion business model of a publisher, thus, the latter could opt for online passes. Remains to be seen whether said publishers would have the guts to impose them...:smile:

 

[Kb-Smoker]

Article up at edge: http://m.edge-online.com/news/e3-20...ar-policies-across-both-consoles-say-sources/

So xbone drm is not built into the console? The article doesn't make any sense.

Unless Ms change something the only thing publisher opt in or out of is supporting used games. Drm is built into os and every game has drm no whatever what.

 

[mrcorbo]

Article up at edge: http://m.edge-online.com/news/e3-20...ar-policies-across-both-consoles-say-sources/

I wonder if this move by Sony has damaged its business relationships with publishers. If they wanted these restrictions and in some cases feel that they actually needed them and now Sony has put them in a position where they would have to take a massive PR hit to do so they can't be happy.

I really get the sense that the leadership at Sony just saw an opportunity to really go for it and with the DRM announcement coupled with the pricing they did just that.

I like it.

It's risky, because if MS can still manage to find a way to earn significant marketshare I could see publishers aligning themselves with MS because of the universal DRM and, in the long run, content wins. OTOH, if Sony can grab a big enough sales advantage because of the price and the perception that they are more consumer-friendly then publishers will be forced to support them.

It'll be interesting to see which way this all breaks. In my mind the single biggest strategic mistake MS made (among several) was $499. Given all of the other baggage that the XBOne carries I think a $100 price premium was one too many.

 

[pc999]

The price hike is less than it seems, once you factor in VAT (20% for UK, 20-25% for most other EU countries).

$500 + 20% VAT is 385£, - so a little over 10% surcharge.
$500 + 20% VAT is 450€
$500 + 25% VAT is 470€

That is enough to buy a game, at least the worst case enough to buy a second hand, a cheaper one, or a promo game .

 

[Nesh]

You don't need a god damn movement or online petitions.

Vote with your wallets. This is about consumerism, not some civil right.

It is a right and I agree that the best way to do it is to not buy it. But I think petitions or movements are a good way to encourage more people to vote with their wallets by not buying it

 

[expletive]

When you think about it, maybe this isn't entirely a DRM move by Microsoft because what they are essentially doing is making EVERY game purchase, an online purchase. In the future, this will enable them to completely eliminate the optical drive from the hardware reiterations and future console platforms. If all their games were activated online starting now, then any console they make in the future wont require a blu-ray drive at all for people to play all the games they bought...

EDIT:they are taking a beating now but in the future they will be free of an optical drive with no impact to their users' game libraries...

 

[Gubbi]

at least the worst case enough to buy a second hand... game

Not on XB1 it ain't

Cheers

 

[Nesh]

A truly hilarious video -thanks for sharing bubukillaxd - comparing the overwhelming reaction of the crowd after CEOs announced both PS4 and X1 prices.

... "tswypswts"

Could anyone make a gif of Phil Spencer holding his hand in the air and clenching his teeth? :smile:

edit: the video has been doctored though.

I find this one funny and a PR disaster too

 

[mrcorbo]

From a sidebar in this Ars Technica article

It's a "family" affair

Since its announcement, there has been some confusion over the details of sharing your Xbox One game library with up to ten "family members." Mehdi couldn't give comprehensive details but he did clarify some things.

For one, a family member doesn't have to be a "blood relative," he said, eliminating the extremely unlikely possibility that the Xbox One would include a built-in blood testing kit. For another, they don't have to live in the primary owner's house—I could name a friend that lives 3,000 miles away as one of my "family members" Mehdi said.

You'll be able to link other Xbox Live accounts as having shared access to your library when you first set up a system, and will also be able to add them later on (though specific details of how you manage these relationships is still not being discussed). The only limitation, it seems, is that only one person can be playing the shared copy of a single game at any given time. All in all, this does sound like a pretty convenient feature that's more workable than simply passing discs around amongst friends who are actually in your area.

I really like this concept depending on how the specifics turn out.

 

[Squilliam]

What if Microsoft makes the DRM opt in? So you can have a choice either:

1. PS4 style.
2. Xbox One style.

So if you like the Xbox style DRM you can choose that and if you like the PS4 style you can choose that but once you choose you're stuck that way for a time/permanent.

 

[pc999]

Article up at edge: http://m.edge-online.com/news/e3-20...ar-policies-across-both-consoles-say-sources/

Not hard to believe at all. The real bad part is if they try to change it 2 years down the road, after we have made the investment I am actually worried about it.

Maybe Nintendo+PC really is the way to go...

 

[dagamer]

Not hard to believe at all. The real bad part is if they try to change it 2 years down the road, after we have made the investment I am actually worried about it.

Maybe Nintendo+PC really is the way to go...

Basically, Sony only announced that THEIR games will be DRM-free. To me, DRM doesn't matter. I was planning on buying all of my games digitally, and if publishers screw up, you'll see a downward trend in pricing. People today complain about games costing $60, but if you wait a month or two, it's $35 or 40 (like it should be, if you can't wait, you end up paying more!)

I think if Microsoft could will it, they would make the entire console digital download only, but then Gamestop would never sell it. It's funny that arguably having more restrictions (aka, making it just like Steam) would be better received by the people of Reddit and the like. All the controversy would be undone by a simple quote: "Games can't be re-sold, no 24 hour requirement, we will have sales, download and play your games everywhere." Done.

 

[Cranky]

From a sidebar in this Ars Technica article



I really like this concept depending on how the specifics turn out.

That article is fantastic. MS position is clearly articulated and to me does strike that balance between the various stakeholders.

MS gets way too much crap for smart, forward-thinking decisions. Case in point, Metro and Win8. Fantastic future oriented changes whose benefits will be realized as more computing moves to tablet and cloud. is the transition painful, hell yeah. Does it annoy setintheirways customers, absolutely! however, in past few years, MS is try to keep up with the changing technology landscape instead of being left behind. From a strategic standpoint, they are probably making all of the right moves. Their DRM policy is actually extremely consumer friendly, especially the family plan. 24 hour checks lead to easy implementation of digital rentals, probably through Live, and potential for all you can eat plans of back content. However, in order to deliver these new services certain other options are curtailed. MS gives substantial new abilities and does take away some existing abilities. Net-Net, it is a huge win for consumers. Basically, the only thing that is going away is ebay-style sales, for which MS could introduce a similar marketplace given the infrastructure and DRM policy that exist, and unrestricted gifting.

Sony probably just made two potential disastrous mistakes. Depending on their COGS they priced the machine way to low at launch, probably leaving $300 to $500 million desperately needed dollars on the table. Second, by not making a clean break with past they are really going to piss off customers when they move to a more MS like system in a few years. Mark my words, they will regret their short-sighted DRM approach within 3 years.

 

[babybumb]

Pretty amazing how MS just conceded basically few billion customers to Sony. XboxOne Live countries are pretty restricted

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/xbox-one/pre-order-xbox-one/disclaimer

 

[Laa-Yosh]

It's risky, because if MS can still manage to find a way to earn significant marketshare I could see publishers aligning themselves with MS because of the universal DRM and, in the long run, content wins. OTOH, if Sony can grab a big enough sales advantage because of the price and the perception that they are more consumer-friendly then publishers will be forced to support them.

I completely agree with this, and some parts seem to work - the online community has been properly misguided and they're cheering Sony, even here on B3D. Publishers are already backing out at least in their PR and MS is left with all the blame.

It'll be interesting to see which way this all breaks. In my mind the single biggest strategic mistake MS made (among several) was $499. Given all of the other baggage that the XBOne carries I think a $100 price premium was one too many.

That I disagree with, though. Microsoft does not want to lose more money, they want to reap the rewards for their 10+ years and billions of investment. And they will probably not suffer as much, whereas Sony will most likely take a loss on the PS4 at first.

 

[-tkf-]

Not hard to believe at all. The real bad part is if they try to change it 2 years down the road, after we have made the investment I am actually worried about it.

Maybe Nintendo+PC really is the way to go...

Actually it's getting harder to believe than just a few weeks ago.. Now we have 2! CEO's from the biggest publishing companies telling us that they don't have a problem with 2nd hand sales.

We have a Sony CEO on record for saying that DRM releated to online gaming is out of their hand, like it always was, but claiming that Disc based single player/offline gaming is not and will not be requiring any online connection.