News & Rumors: Xbox One (codename Durango)

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There's no correlation other than denial does not necessarily equate to the truth or what will happen.

Have Microsoft every outright denied it. All I can find are the "no plans" quotes, i.e. "We have no plans to introduce an Xbox One without Kinect." And I believe they was serious when they said this - I really don't think they had plans, I think the plans were very last minute - somewhat supported they they announced them mid-May but they won't be on sale until June 9th.

MS said they were not going to provide a Kinect-less XB1.
Again, I think they've said at various times they have no plans to sell a Kinectless Xbox One. PR Evasion 101. I don't think I've ever read a categoric "We will never sell Xbox One without Kinect".

A citation of the CEO saying, "We aren't wanting to sell XB division at this time," is no proof that the XB division won't be in someone else's hands in a month or two's time.

Agreed. It means they're not doing it now. But he did say their intent [with Xbox] is to do what they are today. What they are doing today (or whatever day it was) is running Xbox as a business, not trying to sell it. But that could change. I think if Microsoft were really serious about this, news would have leaked. The rumour is that a some investors want them to sell the Xbox Division. Mind you, Sony came under the same pressure from Daniel Loeb, a significant shareholder via various hedge funds. Bloody nom-gamers!
 
There's no correlation other than denial does not necessarily equate to the truth or what will happen. MS said they were not going to provide a Kinect-less XB1. They then provided exactly that. MS say they won't sell XB division. It still might happen even if they say otherwise. That's not proven - no-one's taking the Kinect situation as proof that a sale of XB is on the cards. The Kinect situation is only taken as disproof of the assertion that XB won't be sold. A citation of the CEO saying, "We aren't wanting to sell XB division at this time," is no proof that the XB division won't be in someone else's hands in a month or two's time.

I can say same thing about every other company, and I don't need to have an example or even a weak/nunrelated correlation for doing this. Selling Xbox division is entirely different from unbundling Kinect.


@DSoup
You'r right:

Spencer said. “It’s been five weeks since I was made head of Xbox, and at that time, Yusuf Medhi and I—we’re running the program together as partners now—and we began spending a lot of time looking at the list of opportunities for us.”

That list also included removing the Xbox Live Gold paywall for media apps like Netflix, Hulu, and ESPN and expanding the Xbox 360’s Games for Gold freebie program to Xbox One.

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/...decouple-kinect-from-xbox-one-began-in-april/
 
Except...
I'm not sure comment like that are trustworthy. In fact in business you never mention a sell until the last minute, and it's only leaks that suggest its happening. If MS are in meetings arranging to sell the XB division, they'll still claim business as usual. Saying, "yeah, we're gonna sell it to someone else," would only damage the present business.
The CEO making a statement like this is pretty serious in business terms as well. First off, its a material statement that can may cause investors to make a decision - these kind of things that lead people in one direction only to shortly turn out to be another are the stuff of class actions. Secondly, those calling for the sale are investment institutions, and if the CEO is making a comment that is directly opposing the direction the institutions are requesting then they may decide to move their funds elsewhere, causing a stock reduction. A comment like this is generally very considered.
 
If people are going to talk about Microsoft selling of Xbox, they should be providing proof that Microsoft is making steps to do so.
Yep. Until there's evidence, it's heresay. however, this is a rumour thread. ;)
Until something concrete happens to signal they are going to sell, it just sounds like a bunch of brand warriors trolling.
It has nothing to do with brand warriors. The rumours stem from reports of investors wanting it dropped - the rumour originates from the financial sector and not the gaming community.

Have Microsoft every outright denied it.
Not that I know of. However, whenever it was raised the response was, 'no, XB1 needs Kinect'. That 'no' may or may not have been true at the time (they may have had plans on the drawing board as they watched sales numbers and considered options, or not. As it turns out, the change was very abrupt), but the assurances that Kinect would remain a part of the standard XB1 package didn't hold water in the long run. If Ms had plans to drop Kinect well in advance, why would they want to tell the world that? They wouldn't, so they'd be evasive. Similarly, if there were plans to sell the XB division, they wouldn't ever confirm that. So a denial isn't really much use in determining the validity of a rumour.

I can say same thing about every other company, and I don't need to have an example or even a weak/unrelated correlation for doing this.
Yes, they are all evasive and keep their plans close to their chest. What makes you think my opinion was unique towards MS's response?

Selling Xbox division is entirely different from unbundling Kinect.
One can argue that, but it's immaterial. Selling Kinect was never an argument for selling the whole division. I repeat, it is only presented as proof that evasive answers aren't useful answers. The only true denial would be something like, "We have a 3 year plan for XB1 including non-negotiable, non-transferable contracts for production. We are not going to be selling the Gaming Division any time before then." And we never get such answers. This is how rumours get to persist even without much merit to them, because they are as hard to disprove as they are to prove.

Read Penello's argument's in favour of Kinect. Kinect is fundamental to the DNA of XB1, yet it's gone. Now look at an argument saying XBox is a vital part of the DNA of MS's long-term strategy. A change in plans can see the gaming division dropped just as well (this can happen for Sony or Nintendo, and does. Just needs a catalyst. Shareholders telling Sony to sell Playstation, or shareholders telling Nintendo to release on mobile).

Note, because some people seem to get confused that arguing against the validity of a point is the same as arguing in favour of its opposite counterpart, that I do not believe MS are planning to sell Xbox. I'm just being very particular about the logic of interpreting rumours. They often deal with very hazy information and people typically form an opinion based on faith (look for example at Eastmen's surprise on this board the Kinect was dropped where he and others firmly believed in MS's earlier position that Kinect was essential). IMO it's better not to form an opinion and just entertain all reasonable possibilities.
 
The CEO making a statement like this is pretty serious in business terms as well. First off, its a material statement that can may cause investors to make a decision - these kind of things that lead people in one direction only to shortly turn out to be another are the stuff of class actions. Secondly, those calling for the sale are investment institutions, and if the CEO is making a comment that is directly opposing the direction the institutions are requesting then they may decide to move their funds elsewhere, causing a stock reduction. A comment like this is generally very considered.
What's the alternative? If MS is in discussions with someone regards selling Xbox, what would the answer to that question have been?

"No comment," would be construed as, "yes."
"Yes, we're going to sell XB," would have complications. AFAIK all big sales are kept under wraps. I don't recall any (eg. FB buying OVR) with months of forewarning except as insider leaks.
"No, we never will, " and then doing so would have negative implications and irate investors.
"We have no plans to," leaves the door open for future plans without actually lying.

I wouldn't expect anything other than option 4 from any exec in any business when faced with such a huge change.
 
What's the alternative? If MS is in discussions with someone regards selling Xbox, what would the answer to that question have been?
"We're keeping all options open" or "I'm reviewing everything at Microsoft right now".
 
"We're keeping all options open" or "I'm reviewing everything at Microsoft right now".

That will invite even more speculation.

Saying you have "no plans.." is simple and sufficient. It doesn't tip your hand nor does it fuel speculation. It's a safe non-answer.
 
Who would buy the Xbox brand?
I can't think of any big company that would benefit entering the console market and even less through buying the box division.
 
It has nothing to do with brand warriors. The rumours stem from reports of investors wanting it dropped - the rumour originates from the financial sector and not the gaming community.

A quote from the article you linked:

Two influential Microsoft shareholders have been pushing the Redmond software giant to abandon what they view as non-essential product lines

It was mostly a hit trolling article title as it was just two shareholders that spoke about it. You can probably take any company on this planet and the next and find two shareholders that would say the same types of things.
 
...
It has nothing to do with brand warriors. The rumours stem from reports of investors wanting it dropped - the rumour originates from the financial sector and not the gaming community.
...

Sure it does. There's no doubt that there are investors that want MS to sell off those business, but in the context of gaming forums the conversation is mostly being carried on as brand trolling.
 
...but in the context of gaming forums the conversation is mostly being carried on as brand trolling.
I don't know about gaming forums. I only know that in this forum, it's just another rumour, like so many others, founded on very little but still up for discussion, like so many others.

In the context of a rumour, you have either confirmation or denial, or neither. The CEO was quoted as providing a position, which in my interpretation is neither really and I've argued that it shouldn't be taken as evidence that XB is not going to be sold. Unless someone can present a solid proof either way (and the arguments thus far are mostly subjective interpretation of what the CEO's comment means), the rumour is neither confirmed nor disproved and just being debated as a possibility, much like Nintendo going 3rd party.

How is that trolling?
 
I don't know about gaming forums. I only know that in this forum, it's just another rumour, like so many others, founded on very little but still up for discussion, like so many others.

In the context of a rumour, you have either confirmation or denial, or neither. The CEO was quoted as providing a position, which in my interpretation is neither really and I've argued that it shouldn't be taken as evidence that XB is not going to be sold. Unless someone can present a solid proof either way (and the arguments thus far are mostly subjective interpretation of what the CEO's comment means), the rumour is neither confirmed nor disproved and just being debated as a possibility, much like Nintendo going 3rd party.

How is that trolling?

In general when these rumours come up, there is very little to talk about. The discussion inevitably turns into denial meaning proof positive. If Microsoft says they're not selling, it means they're planning on selling. If Microsoft said, "No comment," it would mean they are selling. If Microsoft said they were selling then ... yah. The discussion is mostly being carried by people who are negative towards Microsoft brands in general.
 
In general when these rumours come up, there is very little to talk about. The discussion inevitably turns into denial meaning proof positive.
I don't think anyone has taken a no comment/denial as proof. If they did, it was based on prejudice as there's no factual basis, although I do appreciate that people often don't like operating with unknowns and will fill in a blank with an opinion/interpretation just to fill in the hole.

The state of this rumour, like very many, is, "uncertain, highly implausible." It's still worth discussing though (maybe not in this thread), such as if MS sold XB, who would be best to buy it and where would it go?

Who could/should/might buy XB if MS sold it moved here.
 
Except...
I'm not sure comment like that are trustworthy. In fact in business you never mention a sell until the last minute, and it's only leaks that suggest its happening. If MS are in meetings arranging to sell the XB division, they'll still claim business as usual. Saying, "yeah, we're gonna sell it to someone else," would only damage the present business.
You are comparing apples to oranges.

Time ago I shared news on how they are building a bridge at Redmond between the Xbox division facilities and the rest of the Microsoft campus, and they plan to end building it by 2020, and it would take 5 minutes on a bike to go from one part of the campus to the other.

Talk about long term vision.

Kinect removal is part of a priorities shift 'cos of the new people leading the division. At first it was essential 'cos of the language and voice recognition thing, and all the exclusivity around the idea of the console.
 
A fan has designed a Kinect-less interface, and it looks spectacularly beautiful. Much more than the ugly thing we have now.

Really brilliant!!!

image_40248_fit_940.jpg


image_40251_fit_940.jpg


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image_40249_fit_940.jpg


image_40247_fit_940.jpg


http://cdn.medialib.totalxbox.com/screens/dir_402/image_40250_fit_940.jpg

image_40246_fit_940.jpg


http://www.totalxbox.com/viewer.php...ids=40248,40251,40252,40249,40247,40250,40246
 
I can't see how it is better for "non-kinect" navigation...
How so? It is pretty clear. Up-down-left-right, everything is at the tip of your hand (in the middle of the screen), which is just perfect for a controller.

The guy who designed that seems to be so smart.
 
How so? It is pretty clear. Up-down-left-right, everything is at the tip of your hand (in the middle of the screen), which is just perfect for a controller.

The guy who designed that seems to be so smart.

The current interface works fine with controller. You can use LB/RB to change sections, and Up-down-left-right for options.
 
The current interface works fine with controller. You can use LB/RB to change sections, and Up-down-left-right for options.
The current interface is, imho, so so so so bad that I'd rather not say how I'd define it.

I miss Xbox 360's interface...

But this fan-made one is even better and would suit the Xbox 360 as well.

With that design, everything that's important is right there for you to use, and even the X360 with its fine interface can't match that -pressing the big X and moving around the menus is not bad, but it requires more time than in the interface presented here-.
 
Xbox One interface is basically the same than Xbox 360, but with fewer options. As I said, LB and RB can jump from section to section (only 3 sections, pins, home and Store, less than Xbox 360), and use your stick or d-pad for selecting options, the same than Xbox 360.

For example:

- Press the guide button (the xbox logo) and you will travel to the Home section.
- LB to go pins section or RB to go Store section.
- Up/down/left/right and "A" button for selecting things.


That's all, I don't know why people can't drive this.
 
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