Pachter: Apple 2013 Console
- Thread starter TheChefO
- Start date
"No used games" alone is probably an attribute of digitally distributed games today. It already exists today on PS360 download games (e.g., PSP Minis).
The iOS app model broke new ground because of cheap and open dev license (no special development hardware !), dirt cheap price, and run on all iOS devices with "no DRM".
Has anyone done a "No used games" physical package before ?
The iOS app model broke new ground because of cheap and open dev license (no special development hardware !), dirt cheap price, and run on all iOS devices with "no DRM".
Has anyone done a "No used games" physical package before ?
Yeah but in exchange for no used games, they have to lower prices, especially since they have no manufacturing or distribution costs.
If a console charged $60 for games which couldn't be re-sold, it will hurt sales because a lot of games buyers count on being able to re-sell to finance/justify the new game purchase.
Problem with consoles going all-digital is, what is the incentive for Wal Mart and every other retail chain to stock consoles, which they make no money on, if they can't sell games, which is where the margins are in console gaming.
Retailers are already pissed at "show rooming" which is the trend of buyers going into stores to check out products and then using their smart phones to scan the barcode and search for better prices online. How are they going to look at a console which has no margins and on which you don't get to sell software?
I was thinking maybe they should just introduce CD Keys to unlock unlimited usage of a game for the gamertag it is attached to.
If you don't input a CD key, then only allow the person to play the game for a limited amount of time or up to a certain point in the game. It's essentially a trial version of the entire game.
The goal is to encourage new sales whilst discouraging used or piracy. IIRC, the online pass system that EA employs works similar to this - if you don't have the online pass, you're given a trial of 15 days or something to play online. Given that a game profile is attached to your gamertag, they can create a reference date.
If people start sharing the key offline, then there's not much one can do about it. But once multiple people go online (thus activating the key), then it should be relatively easy to detect if more than one gamertag is sharing it and is essentially practising piracy. Solution is simple: invalidate the key so that none of the people who shared the key will have unlimited access.
People lending the games to friends just have to know they have a limited amount of time to play really. If they want to play longer or the rest of the game, then the publisher can offer buying a new key via the online service, perhaps at a discount.
People can still sell their copy of the game this way, and it'd still allow that sector of the market to exist. It needs to be made quite clear and obvious to the next consumer about the limitations of the used copy though. Obviously, a person would probably want to avoid used copies if they suddenly find themselves wanting the complete experience just to find out they need to spend even more for a new key.
Just some passing thoughts.
I'm not a fan of the idea of a "no used games" system. Pretty much all digital-distribution systems that I know of do not allow games to be passed on or resold. I just thought it would be interesting if a disc-less console was released, because it would essentially kill the used market for that system. The publishers hate the used market, so it would be an incentive for them to maybe push users to that system. Hey, want the new COD game? Well, buy it on this system and we'll give you some exclusive DLC, or a reduced price (and kill your ability to resell your games). It could be the hook that Apple could use to get publishers on their console, without having to go out and spent big money on the exclusives people are suggesting they'd need.
Plus, used games drive the purchase of new games. I never understood this fallacy that publishers try to use. I would pretty much stop purchasing new games, if I couldn't sell the old games when I was done with them, and I'm sure I'm not alone in this regard. When it comes to consoles, I'm not a collector and I don't need a stack of 60 games I'm never going to play again.
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Agreed. I'd have to wait for sales to get most of the games I play. Can't buy so many games at full price if I can't get some of my money back.
Then the platform holders may have to give the retailers a good enough revenue. Current gen consoles are already experimenting with these ideas.
I think Gravity Rush and Escape Pan are PSN only games in EU. If they bypass the retailers for game sales, they can afford to charge less for the consumers. Or they can offer more flexible DRM. e.g., It's more flexible to buy PSN PSP games than UMD PSP games because the former run on PSP, Vita, PS3 or perhaps even PS Suite platforms. The latter is stuck on PSP only.
For Apple, it's not just about "No used games", the weak DRM and low price are legitimate publisher concerns. However I don't see any evidence that suggest Apple has plans for a console at this point.
I think Gravity Rush and Escape Pan are PSN only games in EU. If they bypass the retailers for game sales, they can afford to charge less for the consumers. Or they can offer more flexible DRM. e.g., It's more flexible to buy PSN PSP games than UMD PSP games because the former run on PSP, Vita, PS3 or perhaps even PS Suite platforms. The latter is stuck on PSP only.
For Apple, it's not just about "No used games", the weak DRM and low price are legitimate publisher concerns. However I don't see any evidence that suggest Apple has plans for a console at this point.
Sony already said the world needs offline distribution. Some countries are just not there yet.
I suspect we will see bolder digital plans moving forward. We already have certain categories going fully digital, and some games going exclusively digital worldwide or regionally. Perhaps some day we will see a free-to-play game becoming a mega-hit ?
For the more expensive games I agree. For the cheap and play-on-any-platform ones, it's not so clear. I think I can stomach both. For free-to-play, subscription and ad sponsored games, the concept of "used games" may not exist.
For Sony, that is true. For Apple, it is not. Their products are made, designed and sold to people with fast Internet service. They could easily go the way of direct download, as they have with iOS and Macbook Air. I don't think Apple sees people without Internet connections as potential customers, and I believe they'd take that approach with a console. They'd try to take take market share in rich developed countries, like they do with their other products. Anyway, it's an interesting thing to think about if you wanted to figure out how Apple could be successful in the console market. Maybe publishers and developers aren't very fond of the iTunes model. I don't know how the money really pays out. Attacking the used game markets might be in their interest. Steam is a good place to look to figure out how successful direct download can be, and how pricing, sales, etc could work.
That's because iOS starts with a phone first. A phone is always connected, and then pan out from there to iPad and Mac. The "old" Mac business has a relatively small B&M software distribution channel, and it is expanded by the AppStore effort. Apple doesn't really get any $$$ for Mac software sales over physical channels. But they get 30% cut from AppStore sales, and some % from Apple Store sales. In this sense, it is in Apple's interest to go digital and direct.
Sony already has an established consumer electronics distribution worldwide. The Playstation business is already benefiting from physical game licenses regardless of who sells the games. Going fully online will cannibalize their software retailers although they can take a bigger cut. Hence, their model becomes hybrid or mixed up. In addition, since the titles can be enjoyed without online component, Sony can continue to sell old hardware and software in poorer countries.
Sony is trying to establish a stronger online presence now. But it would be strange for Apple and Sony to set "No used game market" as a business goal. It's more a side-effect of being digital (You can vary the price and have a direct relationship with the second-hand buyers).
Sony already has an established consumer electronics distribution worldwide. The Playstation business is already benefiting from physical game licenses regardless of who sells the games. Going fully online will cannibalize their software retailers although they can take a bigger cut. Hence, their model becomes hybrid or mixed up. In addition, since the titles can be enjoyed without online component, Sony can continue to sell old hardware and software in poorer countries.
Sony is trying to establish a stronger online presence now. But it would be strange for Apple and Sony to set "No used game market" as a business goal. It's more a side-effect of being digital (You can vary the price and have a direct relationship with the second-hand buyers).
Speaking of Steam...
Steam launches Android and iOS app for free, in beta
http://www.joystiq.com/2012/01/26/steam-launches-android-and-ios-app-for-free-in-beta/
Steam launches Android and iOS app for free, in beta
http://www.joystiq.com/2012/01/26/steam-launches-android-and-ios-app-for-free-in-beta/
Doesn't work on my iPhone 3g. 
I'm still using it. It's slowly getting better, though nothing substantion at least on the iOS version - just read the blogs, the news from the site, and login to PSN to see what your friends are doing, check your and their trophies and do some comparing.
tongue_of_colicab
Veteran
Don't know but with 1.2 billion people even if just 25% has a internet connection you'll already have more people connected to the internet than there are living in the USA.
Plus maybe some regions don't have home internet connections like we have them? Just like a lot of african counties skipped right to 3g because they don't have the old infrastructure available like in the west. I could see that being the case in China as well.
Plus maybe some regions don't have home internet connections like we have them? Just like a lot of african counties skipped right to 3g because they don't have the old infrastructure available like in the west. I could see that being the case in China as well.
They won't do a console that is marketed as one. But their Apple TV device may well evolve into something of the sort. They'll lose though if they don't get the controls for it right. And it'll probably be too expensive too, and be out of date in two years.
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