New news on PS4 and PS3 from Sony

[jeff_rigby]

http://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/column/kaigai/20110210_425921.html

There are no plans to reduce the die size of the PS3 beyond the current 45nm. It's possible that they are waiting for 22/20nm and will skip the 32/28nm generation. I'd read that reducing from 45nm to 32nm required a design change for the external pin connections and Sony is probably waiting for 22/20nm to make the change practical. So probably middle of 2012.

There are rumors of a PS3.5 which might happen at the same time (more memory and less likely a 4 element SPE tacked onto the memory buss). 22/20nm die process applies to all silicon including memory. As die size decreases efficiency improves and faster speeds are possible. A redesign for the PS3 from XDR ram to conventional cheap PC style ram using 20nm process could be as fast as the current XDR ram and cheaper. This might allow 500k or even 1gig ram for the PS3.5. Higher efficiency for the Cell and RSX might translate to a fanless PS3 with passive cooling. The PS3 Cell BE and RSX are being used by Sony in 4K commercial editing hardware so I expect there is a large market coming with 4K and 3-D movie editing.

Plans are to upgrade the OS Software and features of the PS3 to make it last longer For instance the PS3 can display 4K, that can be enabled with a software upgrade. 2012 should have 4K res sets as well as 4K & 1080P 3-D blu-ray players. That would have the PS3 still able to match CE equipment standards and that will be the end of the PS3's ability to keep up with the CE media advances. The PS3 will be getting a webkit browser and upgrades to the PS3 OS to enable a webkit port and to allow porting of applications and games to the PS3 via PS Suite from the NGP (windows support).

Hiroshige Goto says SCEI suspended PS4 development. They were working on a PowerPC based system at IBM Rochester after the Larrabee fall out, then shelved it. They are betting the farm on PSP2 as they expect handhelds to displace consoles.

MS at board level is also considering shelving a next generation Xbox

● There is no immediate plan for PlayStation 4 (PS4)
　In the introduction to a new portable game platforms, the new generation of anxious but deferred. PlayStation 3 (PS3) machine's successor, present what's going on. Hirai said that as mentioned below.

　"On stationary and went in business in 2006 PS3 will go to the lifecycle of 10 years. In that sense, do not go to the halfway point yet. An attractive first-party titles, both third party, rather I came out. has implemented a new initiative announced each year in the future PS3 software to enhance the feature sets to take care and hope to grow. So suddenly the next generation PS4 or stationary machines that's what the debate is not even now. I mean the PS3 is now concentrating on. In addition, NGP and PS3 now want you to appeal to a new partnership with. "

　This explanation is convincing. This generation aircraft is in the current harvest, the situation has been eagerly anticipated next-generation consoles is not. There are Gemupaburissha / circumstances of the developer is also at stake. Deferred generation machine now, advances in hardware development cost is bloated title. Thus, even the major studios can not run a large number of title lines of development. Due to rising costs, market failures and costly title.

　In these situations, if the aircraft appeared to freeze new architecture to study again, the engine and tools, and will repeat the cycle, such as the burden would increase further. Many Gemudeberoppa, considering the business side, it would freeze the machine you really want to leave alone.

● SCE's next game is unchanged since the process 22/20nm
　SCE's plans for PS4 generation machine, the various plans so far surfaced, disappeared. Larrabee and Intel's plan to use, IBM PowerPC-based development centers in Rochester there was a plan to develop a CPU. However, last year (2010) in the middle, the plan was back to the drawing board for all these. Currently, there are even plans to run, so would not be at an advanced stage.

　As a result, SCE's 32nm/28nm generation process is likely to have no plans of silicon stationary machines. Cell Broadband Engine (Cell BE) said that no plans for 32nm process version. In other words, SCE-CPU machines deferred production, presumably they can empty a process generations. Perhaps the next generation is going to be a 22nm/20nm for subsequent generations of the process.

　SCE and Microsoft, IBM for one another, dimly seen through the different situations have been encountered with scissors game. Microsoft side also, the direction of the next generation, there is considerable confusion as the first next-generation hardware that Microsoft had been told to reconsider whether to even sales. For example, is said to have been discussed at the board level as well as how to feed. Microsoft also is running as a plan, not very advanced stage.

　In other words, SCE is also Microsoft also last year (2010) in the later stages of planning, next generation game consoles freeze, which had continued to pretty. Both companies make no signs of generational change now that the strategy focused on current machines.

　Because there was a situation, SCE also plan aside PS4, NGP is estimated to have focused on. SCE also considered an in-house resources, it is considered unavoidable. NGP and software stack, PlayStation emulator PlayStation Suite / Xperia Play 割Ita resources in software development, PS4 strength of the SCE will not only taken up and move on to. The device is smaller than the aircraft against stationary, portable machines that are more urgent is the threat of smartphone market situation there.

 

[eastmen]

IF its true that the ps4 is no longer being worked on (i don't believe this ) then they will simply be handing the market to MS . MS could basicly put out a $400 console that costs them $300-$400 to make and have the market to themselves for at least a year or two before sony would be able to come up with an answer.


As for the process srhinks that just seems really weird to me . Perhaps cell and rsx would be to small for the 128bit busses but not small enough to combine into a single chip at 32/28nm but they will be small enough to do so at 22nm ?

 

[jeff_rigby]

IF its true that the ps4 is no longer being worked on (i don't believe this ) then they will simply be handing the market to MS . MS could basicly put out a $400 console that costs them $300-$400 to make and have the market to themselves for at least a year or two before sony would be able to come up with an answer.


As for the process srhinks that just seems really weird to me . Perhaps cell and rsx would be to small for the 128bit busses but not small enough to combine into a single chip at 32/28nm but they will be small enough to do so at 22nm ?

You missed this in the quote:

In other words, SCE is also Microsoft also last year (2010) in the later stages of planning, next generation game consoles freeze, which had continued to pretty. Both companies make no signs of generational change now that the strategy focused on current machines.

You could be correct and both Cell and RSX on the same die at 20nm or it's only a pin placement redesign which would require changes to the layout. That involves a significant cost. 28nm is coming the end of 2011, delay 6 months and 20nm is here and the same redesign is needed for that anyway.

With a Cell BE redesign, Shifty could be correct and a couple more SPE elements or dedicated media hardware codecs could be in the new design. Sony uses the Cell BE and RSX for 4K video editing, what design change could make the PS3 hardware better for that job. Possibly a better security scheme built in too.

With 20nm die process for all silicon including memory, multiple changes for the PS3 design could result in a large savings and increase in features. Fanless is possible, cheaper and possibly more memory. Rumors of a 3.5 could be true especially if the PS4 has been tabled.

 

[eastmen]

I don't trust Sony to know what MS is doing .

As for 20nm die sizes i doubt we will see them 6 months after 32/28nm chips would be avalible what fab has production ready 20nm process slated for summer of 2012 that can make 6-8 million needed for sony ?

 

[Shifty Geezer]

This news was already mentioned in the Next Gen Tech thread, which has been spawned into an independent discussion here.