Nokia's Present & Future

[french toast]

Well i hope you are right TOTTENTRANZ thats something that i have been wondering for ages..a proper game changer..full w8 on a unique Nokia high end phone...goodbye ICS, c ya Jellybean off you go Android.
Apple?? not a repeat of the 90's..but will damage there pride if nothing else as IOS and Apple products have lost the x factor the last few cycles...even if sales are still growing.

 

[Trawler]

I expect the 360 will get WinRT app compatibility too, so one app will run on PC/Tablet/Phone/Xbox.

MS are on the right track with this one IMO.

 

[dagamer]

Phones, tablets and PCs won't have the same kernel, but all will feature the Windows RT (RunTime) software stack which Metro apps will be coded for. This means that developers can support all Microsoft platforms by merely changing the target in Visual Studio (at least in theory).

This means you be able to run your apps on all platforms. It gives Microsoft a giant crowbar to break into markets. You work PC runs Win 8? Well, so will your work phone, because that way you get to run the same apps. You buy a few casual games for your work phone while stuck in airports, - sure would be nice if your tablet in your livingroom could run the same games, better get a Win 8 tablet. Etc.

Cheers

Err... the WinRT software stack is the kernel for all intents and purposes (it's heavily intertwined). It is not some simple software layer that floats above traditional Windows. Microsoft has said several times that the "desktop" is an app just as much as any other Metro app, heck it doesn't even get loaded when a machine first boots to the Start Screen.

And Paul Thurrott has already confirmed that Windows Phone 8 uses the Windows 8 kernel. It just will use an interface very similar to Windows Phone 7 (for the sake of familiarity).

Source: http://www.winsupersite.com/article/windows8/windows-phone-8-preview-142154

The "developer holy grail" as I like to call it is that you basically write one app for smartphone, tablet, and desktop/laptop. Since all Windows 8 apps are required to have a docked view, such a view can automatically be forced to run when the app is on a smartphone, solving the "app problem" WP7 currently has. And I find it hard to believe that developers that want to make money will ignore a platform that is for the near future is guaranteed to sell hundreds of millions of new copies each year.

 

[hoho]

The "developer holy grail" as I like to call it is that you basically write one app for smartphone, tablet, and desktop/laptop.

having them all share the same UI would be horrible for end-user though.

I kind of liked the QTQuick way of being able to quickly and easily generate "throwaway" GUIs for each of your target system so that you can have specially optimized interface on all targets.

 

[dagamer]

having them all share the same UI would be horrible for end-user though.

I kind of liked the QTQuick way of being able to quickly and easily generate "throwaway" GUIs for each of your target system so that you can have specially optimized interface on all targets.

UI would change based on the platform, much like how the iPhone and iPad share entire view controllers now. I adapted my iPhone app to an iPad UI in 4 days knowing absolutely nothing about how to program for the iPad. When you've got that kind of turn around, the benefits are simply astounding.

 

[Lazy8s]

http://www.engadget.com/2012/03/10/microsoft-cuts-touchscreen-lag-to-1ms/

Touchscreens are in great need of this improvement. Maybe Microsoft can partner with a panel maker to get this into Windows Phone/tablet devices first within the next few years.

 

[I.S.T.]

http://www.fudzilla.com/home/item/26349-nokia-boss-dismisses-dual-and-quad-core-phones

 

[Exophase]

Anyone who thinks that dual core is useless for phones or not worth the rather minimal price you pay for it is dead wrong. That the CEO of a huge cell company can claim something as ignorant as dual cores (in any competent SoC out today) being both useless AND battery draining is quite unsettling. To say the least.

The whole thing will quickly be made moot by the fact that no one is making a high end ARM SoC today that's still single core, unless he's also comfortable using substantially weaker older (and probably more expensive) SoCs in upcoming phones. Today the whole thing sounds like little more than sad excuses for still using single core processors and OSes that aren't good at utilizing anything different. Even if he truly believes this he's a fool for trying to buck the marketing strength behind multicore.

 

[eastmen]

They will be switching to dual core come the fall. However after the battery issues were fixed lumia 810 users were reporting very good battery life

 

[Deleted member 13524]

Stephen Elop is hardly someone with a large technical knowledge.
Furthermore, I'm still trying to figure out what exactly is he good at.
Future will tell if he's either a really successful trojan horse or just a guy who has very little understanding of the company he's running and this ecossystem he's trying to embrace.



While we don't know exactly what he said (maybe someone here can translate mandarin?), that statement is as ridiculous as it can be.
Everyone with a tiny little bit of knowledge on this matter is aware that the only reason for the top-end WP7 smartphones to be using souped up Snapdragon S2 SoCs is because the O.S. doesn't support multi-core yet.
The same goes for different resolutions, external storage, USB host, HDMI out, and tons of other things we've seen in top-end Android smartphones but we can't see in top-end WP7.

 

[wco81]

Why is WP7 taking so long for multicore support? Even WebOS and the Playbook OS supported dual-core a year ago?

 

[Deleted member 13524]

Why is WP7 taking so long for multicore support? Even WebOS and the Playbook OS supported dual-core a year ago?

WP7's market share is kind of irrelevant, and afaik there are no signs showing that it's going to improve...
I think it wouldn't be bad if Microsoft is actually planning on dropping WP7 development in order to focus on speeding up Windows 8 for smartphones. This means there'd be no Windows Phone 8, only Windows 8 Smartphone.
WP7.5 may stay around for low-end devices, sharing the Metro UI, somewhere along the timeline disappearing into thin air as even low-ends will eventually get dual Cortex A7s at +1GHz speeds and DX9 GPUs (2015?) for W8S compliance?


Windows 8 on smartphones has so much greater potential than any "windows phone" will ever have, why spend too much time/money with it?

 

[wco81]

Why will W8 phone fare any better than WP7?

I can understand the argument that W8 could dominate on tablets, since they would ship hundreds of millions of copies of W8 (though not sure how many W8 ARM tablets would be shipped).

But W8 phones would look pretty much like WP7 phones, no? Same Metro UI, maybe app. development will improve but otherwise, they'd be running on whatever hardware that Android manufacturers decide to devote to W8, right?

Right now, Samsung's flagship is the Galaxy series running Android. How much of that production would they divert to W8 phones if their Android phones are selling so well?

 

[eastmen]

Why will W8 phone fare any better than WP7?

I can understand the argument that W8 could dominate on tablets, since they would ship hundreds of millions of copies of W8 (though not sure how many W8 ARM tablets would be shipped).

But W8 phones would look pretty much like WP7 phones, no? Same Metro UI, maybe app. development will improve but otherwise, they'd be running on whatever hardware that Android manufacturers decide to devote to W8, right?

Right now, Samsung's flagship is the Galaxy series running Android. How much of that production would they divert to W8 phones if their Android phones are selling so well?

I dunno , depends on how many apple lawsuits Samsung looses . They might not be able to sell andriod phones any where

 

[metafor]

Why will W8 phone fare any better than WP7?

I can understand the argument that W8 could dominate on tablets, since they would ship hundreds of millions of copies of W8 (though not sure how many W8 ARM tablets would be shipped).

But W8 phones would look pretty much like WP7 phones, no? Same Metro UI, maybe app. development will improve but otherwise, they'd be running on whatever hardware that Android manufacturers decide to devote to W8, right?

Right now, Samsung's flagship is the Galaxy series running Android. How much of that production would they divert to W8 phones if their Android phones are selling so well?

Whether it'll be W8 phone or WP8, if the metro apps developed for desktop find their way over, then it'll be a big draw.

 

[french toast]

Whether it'll be W8 phone or WP8, if the metro apps developed for desktop find their way over, then it'll be a big draw.

Agreed, all Microkia's wp8 needs is some improved funtionality, app store unification between ARM desktop/phone and some better hardware to stick it in.

By all accounts that is exactly whats happening, sort out the dodgy colourfull marketing..which tells consumers nothing about the advantages of the operating system and combine that with what seems like a hardcore following..and we have a winner!:smile:

Just hope Elop goes with a Qualcomm S4 pro for the tablet and not the dual core Krait+Adreno 225....

 

[Silent_Buddha]

Why will W8 phone fare any better than WP7?

I can understand the argument that W8 could dominate on tablets, since they would ship hundreds of millions of copies of W8 (though not sure how many W8 ARM tablets would be shipped).

But W8 phones would look pretty much like WP7 phones, no? Same Metro UI, maybe app. development will improve but otherwise, they'd be running on whatever hardware that Android manufacturers decide to devote to W8, right?

Right now, Samsung's flagship is the Galaxy series running Android. How much of that production would they divert to W8 phones if their Android phones are selling so well?

As someone mentioned the ability for a Metro App to run on Desktop, notebooks, tablets, and even your smartphone can't be discounted.

That was a huge opportunity that Apple missed by making iOS seperate from OSX.

So while Apple is trying to port features of iOS to OSX, MS is instead just making all computing on all devices uniform as long as they are in Metro. Legacy apps and desktop x86 centric apps will be the only things in Win8 that will have no chance on running on a Win8 phone.

It's too early to say if this will allow them greater penetration into the smartphone market or not. But it could play a large and pivotal role.

As well, it should at the very least make them extremely attractive to large businesses. Where corporate IT managers can set group policy on Win8 phones just like they can with Win8 tablets, notebooks, and desktops. In other words they'll be able to manage group policies in similar ways to what they are currently doing with all WinXP and Win7 devices. And for businesses, MS support for Win8 could just as likely be tailored to include professional support for Win8 business phones.

Regards,
SB

 

[dagamer]

As someone mentioned the ability for a Metro App to run on Desktop, notebooks, tablets, and even your smartphone can't be discounted.

That was a huge opportunity that Apple missed by making iOS seperate from OSX.

So while Apple is trying to port features of iOS to OSX, MS is instead just making all computing on all devices uniform as long as they are in Metro. Legacy apps and desktop x86 centric apps will be the only things in Win8 that will have no chance on running on a Win8 phone.

It's too early to say if this will allow them greater penetration into the smartphone market or not. But it could play a large and pivotal role.

As well, it should at the very least make them extremely attractive to large businesses. Where corporate IT managers can set group policy on Win8 phones just like they can with Win8 tablets, notebooks, and desktops. In other words they'll be able to manage group policies in similar ways to what they are currently doing with all WinXP and Win7 devices. And for businesses, MS support for Win8 could just as likely be tailored to include professional support for Win8 business phones.

Regards,
SB

Regardless Microsoft does not need to directly compete with Apple head-to-head in the first year of Windows phone 8, but they just need to knock Google off its perch.

 

[Florin]

Right now Windows Phone doesn't even support any resolutions other than fixed 800x480. Let alone any CPU not made by Qualcomm, or for that matter with more than 1 core. I'd say that bold predictions of an effortless unified Metro future are well premature.

At least Android has already made huge strides in tackling the challenges that come with different form factors. But of course over there it isn't an advantage but a sign of the impending fragmented death of the platform.

 

[manux]

Right now Windows Phone doesn't even support any resolutions other than fixed 800x480. Let alone any CPU not made by Qualcomm, or for that matter with more than 1 core. I'd say that bold predictions of an effortless unified Metro future are well premature.

At least Android has already made huge strides in tackling the challenges that come with different form factors. But of course over there it isn't an advantage but a sign of the impending fragmented death of the platform.

Maybe win8 supports dual cores, multiple resolutions and some what nots? http://www.engadget.com/2012/02/02/windows-phone-8-detailed/