Official E3 Nintendo Conference Thread 2010

[DemoCoder]

Well obviously a 2 year old isn't capable of playing anything other than simple straight forward games. 5 year olds probably still lack a lot of skills needed for more complex gaming (or more complex tasks too for that matter) too.

If it's easy enough for a 5 year old to play it, it's easy enough for any casual gamer. BTW, my 5 year old primarily plays tower defense games and physics oriented games.

Yes. Its a phone. Besides if you look at the metro's the amount of iphones you see is nothing compared to the amount of other phones. Also its far far smaller than the amount of people with a ds/psp you see and if you consider that a fair amount of people probably does little to no gaming on their iphone I don't see how apple is a threat to Nintendo. Sure apple sells games, but its on a different level than Nintendo. Apple is for the small, im bored and want to be entertained for 5 minutes games. Nintendo (and sony) are there for people who want bigger games. Even a simple pick up and play game like new super mario bros already has way more depth than any iphone game I ever seen.

Apple has sold over 50 million iPhones, has 200,000 apps in the App store and sold 1 billion apps (or about 800 million games). Games are cheaper to develop for iPhone/iPad and you have a superior distribution channel. If you can't see this as a threat, you're too blinded by loyalty. Have you even looked at the iPhone store recently? Grand Theft Auto is on the iPhone. You think that's a casual 5 minute game? EA, Activision, all the heavy hitters are plowing resources into mobile.

The newest iPhone even has superior motion controls to the WiiMote. Like I said, I own a DS, but I don't take it on flights any more, I take my phones and iPad. If I get bored of a game, I just download a new one, any time, anywhere. My DS is sitting on the shelf collecting dust now.

All this, and I personally *hate* Apple, but they are making some damn good products with excellent user experience.


My prediction: In mobile, Nintendo is heading the route of Sega. In 5 years, they'll be making software for other company's mobile HW.

 

[obonicus]

Indeed double standards. MS announced at least 6 new games (Kinectimals, Kinect Sports, Kinect Joyride, Kinect Adventure, Star Wars, Ubisoft Your Shape, The Eden thing (Rez 2 looks like), The Dance game, a new Forza, and more). Many of those weren't even rumored.

Children of Eden was at the Ubi press conference. New Forza wasn't announced at the press conference either. And I wasn't even including stuff like that, like 'Just Dance 2'. Do you seriously not understand the difference between these games or are you just defending the homefront? When a publisher markets games that are markedly not for me, I get to complain that they're not for me, that I don't like them.

The last console Zelda was a Wii game, by the way. (Twilight Princess)

Hardly, it was a GC game that had a Wii version.

 

[obonicus]

The iPhone in Japan launched and is selling like hotcakes.

So's the X10, funnily enough. And? Cell phones that play games aren't new in Japan, they haven't hurt the DS so far. Or even the PSP, really. You might want to pick a region that isn't Japan to make that argument.

The price of the cheaper iphones are dropping to $99. Battery life is improving. The publishing model is *way* better even if Apple is a bitch with censorship, it's quicker to author a game with Xcode and publish it as a digital download or with virtual purchases in-app, then to publish through retail, cartridge, or memory card.

Great. These may all be true, but no one here honestly cares that Joe Small Developer can reach iPhone more easily. No one here plays those games. The games people care about are from studios that can handle all the licensing and dev kit fees.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

I
Apple has sold over 50 million iPhones, has 200,000 apps in the App store and sold 1 billion apps (or about 800 million games). Games are cheaper to develop for iPhone/iPad and you have a superior distribution channel. If you can't see this as a threat, you're too blinded by loyalty. Have you even looked at the iPhone store recently? Grand Theft Auto is on the iPhone. You think that's a casual 5 minute game? EA, Activision, all the heavy hitters are plowing resources into mobile.

The newest iPhone even has superior motion controls to the WiiMote. Like I said, I own a DS, but I don't take it on flights any more, I take my phones and iPad. If I get bored of a game, I just download a new one, any time, anywhere. My DS is sitting on the shelf collecting dust now.

All this, and I personally *hate* Apple, but they are making some damn good products with excellent user experience.


My prediction: In mobile, Nintendo is heading the route of Sega. In 5 years, they'll be making software for other company's mobile HW.

Nintendo has sold over 100million DS system and they are all used for gaming. How many of those 50million iphones are used for gaming? how many are used for regulair gaming? Sure, 200000apps is great. But how many of them are the same? How many are useless? how many are bad quality? how many are games? how many are decent games? how many are games that can rival mariokart, nsmb, zelda, ff etc? Ofcourse games are cheaper to develop as they arnt anywhere close to the quality and size of good DS games. But than again you can't ask more than a couple of bucks either. DS games sell for 40 euro's. Ofcourse thats not all for the developer but you can't compare them directly. iphone games are small and get boring fast. DS games are the opposite.

One of those games I keep hearing everybody rave about, doodle jump, its just boring. Seriously if this is supposed to be gaming on the iphone than Nintendo has little to worry. Sure you got a few big games like gta (ported from DS to psp to iphone, so probably very little investment done and it would have never been there if it wasnt for the other 2 versions). but a handfull of decent games doesnt really beats the DS library.

I watched the 3ds keynote and something I noticed that I didn't read here yet is that Nintendo decided not to do 3d on the bottom screen because fingersmudges and holding your finger infront of the screen had a negative impact on the 3d experience.

 

[Entropy]

Apple has sold over 50 million iPhones, has 200,000 apps in the App store and sold 1 billion apps (or about 800 million games). Games are cheaper to develop for iPhone/iPad and you have a superior distribution channel. If you can't see this as a threat, you're too blinded by loyalty. Have you even looked at the iPhone store recently? Grand Theft Auto is on the iPhone. You think that's a casual 5 minute game? EA, Activision, all the heavy hitters are plowing resources into mobile.

The newest iPhone even has superior motion controls to the WiiMote. Like I said, I own a DS, but I don't take it on flights any more, I take my phones and iPad. If I get bored of a game, I just download a new one, any time, anywhere. My DS is sitting on the shelf collecting dust now.

All this, and I personally *hate* Apple, but they are making some damn good products with excellent user experience.

Hmm, the last official number I saw (from WWDC a week ago) was 5 billion downloaded iApps. Apple has a great distribution/publishing setup, awesome for small developers, and incredibly convenient for their customers. It is not obvious if Nintendo is even going to try to compete with that. They have gotten themselves a definite unique selling point in 3D and they have strengthened their platform from a control point of view. They are playing to their strengths, rather than taking the battle to the home turf of the phones, which is diversity. I think this is wise of them, and will give them a fighting chance at a holding onto their niche by doing their own (limited) thing better than anyone else. Damn. That sounds a lot like Apple.

 

[obonicus]

I wonder if Nintendo will set up a real security system for 3DS this time around, to make piracy at least inconvenient.

 

[patsu]

Speaking of iPhone apps...

EA, I believe you under-priced your iPad games. For $2.99, you have a great Monopoly game. I saw some user reviews complained about other overpriced iPhone apps because they can get high quality game just for $2.99.

Even My wife was wondering why you under priced the game too. I mean she's the thirfty housewife arche-type (although she's not a housewife). If she says it's under-valued, I have to agree with her

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I wonder if Nintendo will set up a real security system for 3DS this time around, to make piracy at least inconvenient.

Yes. They've coupled it with their online system, so every game you pirate needs it's own identification code for you to play. The hassel deters everyone.

 

[sfried]

I wonder if Nintendo will set up a real security system for 3DS this time around, to make piracy at least inconvenient.

This is something I've been wondering too, given how they tried using region locking but obviously didn't succeed with it.

Their card sizes hold 2Gigs initially but I'm wondering how much of that code is for scruitinizing.

 

[liolio]

The most offending issue Apple is facing is piracy, it's crazy huge on the platform.
Other than that game market on smart phone is far from mature, actual the whole smart phone market is in need for serious consolidation. They get used more and more in enterprise and lack of compatibility is quiet a burden, But I don't think things are set to stay this way. Environement will be become more normative winners will emerge most likely AndroÏd and the Iphone/Pad Os. Ms almost needs a miracle at this stage we will see.
In regard to Democoder's points I agree I see more and more people playing on their phone, that's the trend, your phone is always with you and teens are completely addict to them. And I'm not sure they would limit themselves shiity or "have a break in transportation" kind of games given proper games. One of my workmate is actually I don't know which SE rpg on its Iphone, he's a gamer and enjoyed it. he demoed it to me and it looks neat. He also shown me SF which suck touchscreen didn't make it. Still the trend is strong, give editors more intensive to develop for smart-phone (ie more control on piracy) and handled market would be threatened.
I'm hoping for more vids of 3DS tomorrow may be I made my mind to fast about its capabilities I actually had high expectations for the 3DS I've the mixed feeling that Nintendo compromise the system too much for the sake backward compatibility.
Still the conf was boring no matter the announcements.

 

[Archgamer]

Nintendo won the show. SUPER MEGATON BOMBSHELL announcements. That's how you do a press conference.

 

[RudeCurve]

A chip that refuses to die is hilarious, though.

Not if it's dirt cheap and making boatloads of money on hardware.

 

[DemoCoder]

Tongue, it's obvious you don't have an iPhone, so why make commentary. I own both a DS and an iPhone, and I can tell you without a doubt, that there are games from "big studios" that exceed the typical DS game in quality, length of play, "fun", as well as price. For example, Grand Theft Auto, Need For Speed, FIFA, Command and Conquer, Guitar Hero and Rock Band, Mirror's Edge, Call of Duty and Medal of Honor, Cooking Mama, Trauma Center, Crash Bandicoot, Tony Hawk, Skate, Dr Awesome, Sims, Madden, etc There are hundreds of high quality games, action adventure games, JRPGs, and some that make extensive use of the iPhone's controls like the Rolando series.

So this idea that iPhone games are all like these stupid little 5-minute puzzle / tetris / fart apps is so far off the mark as to be ludicrous. There are real *core gamer* games on this platform, with PSP-level graphics. The existing game studios are plunging huge resources into the iPhone, and there's a reason why Apple is now the #1 tech company in terms of market capitalization, as well as earnings.

The future of single function mobile devices is in question, toys of a non-web, non-mobile, non-social networked bygone era.

p.s. if you don't believe me, go to YouTube and enter any search like "Top N iPhone / iPad games" and you'll see tons of *core* serious games that put even the best the DS library has to shame.

 

[tha_con]

3DS does seem lacking in light of iPhone. It's a DS with a 3D screen, a screen which isn't going to change gameplay. And then they've added an analogue button when they have a touch-screen, which seems a step backwards, at least for DS type games. It will improve traditional games, like a top-down shooter that can have analogue direction now. Compared to Apple, it seems very yesteryear. 3D will have to be extremely compelling.

Analog a step backward? How may iPhone games have a "touch screen" analog button? Hundreds? More? It's a step forward. These control schemes should all supplement each other, not be held back because of a tech junkies dreams.

Adding in an analog nub unlocks 4 more buttons (the dpad) for additional controls, along side the touch screen. I am really struggling to see how it's a step backward. It does nothing but open up the target audience for the 3DS.

 

[DemoCoder]

The real problem is doing 3D with poor 3D HW. Something like an iPhone 4 / iPad has a 1 Ghz ARM8 with PowerVR GPU on a nice hi-res display, the current DS is what, 67Mhz, point sampling only, 6k vertices/sec? Has the 3DS got an upgrade to its basic HW to a modern ARM/GPU combo? There were rumors of Tegra, did that pan out?

 

[RudeCurve]

The real problem is doing 3D with poor 3D HW. Something like an iPhone 4 / iPad has a 1 Ghz ARM8 with PowerVR GPU on a nice hi-res display, the current DS is what, 67Mhz, point sampling only, 6k vertices/sec? Has the 3DS got an upgrade to its basic HW to a modern ARM/GPU combo? There were rumors of Tegra, did that pan out?

Yes the 3DS has upgraded hardware, haven't you seen the pics of MGS and RE on 3DS?

 

[obonicus]

The word here on B3D was that no, it's not Tegra.

 

[Arwin]

Success of this is going to greatly depend for me on the quality of the 3D screen. If it works really well, then I'm definitely interested, although I'm slightly disappointed that they couldn't figure out something to make the input more 3D then as well, like maybe pressure sensitive touch/pen so that you can push into the screen, as it were (even if the 3D and the touch screen will remain separate). Graphics don't look that impressive just yet, certainly not Wii quality, but it is very early still and they're probably suffering from not being able to take many shortcuts in 3D now and of course having to render everything twice.

As for the conference, they definitely brought the games this time, at least for the Wii fans. I was impressed by Kirby, somehow, in particular and some parts of Epic Mickey were really rather nice too (especially the 2.5D platforming levels in semi-black and white). They'll definitely survive another year on the strength of that alone, and then the 3DS will kick arse in the handheld space while they can get their next console ready.

However, as far as I can tell Move is going to be a big success for Sony, and where Wii and PS3 were already going head-to-head in Japan, the PS3 now a big threat there, and could become one in the other regions as well.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

Tongue, it's obvious you don't have an iPhone, so why make commentary. I own both a DS and an iPhone, and I can tell you without a doubt, that there are games from "big studios" that exceed the typical DS game in quality, length of play, "fun", as well as price. For example, Grand Theft Auto, Need For Speed, FIFA, Command and Conquer, Guitar Hero and Rock Band, Mirror's Edge, Call of Duty and Medal of Honor, Cooking Mama, Trauma Center, Crash Bandicoot, Tony Hawk, Skate, Dr Awesome, Sims, Madden, etc There are hundreds of high quality games, action adventure games, JRPGs, and some that make extensive use of the iPhone's controls like the Rolando series.

So this idea that iPhone games are all like these stupid little 5-minute puzzle / tetris / fart apps is so far off the mark as to be ludicrous. There are real *core gamer* games on this platform, with PSP-level graphics. The existing game studios are plunging huge resources into the iPhone, and there's a reason why Apple is now the #1 tech company in terms of market capitalization, as well as earnings.

The future of single function mobile devices is in question, toys of a non-web, non-mobile, non-social networked bygone era.

p.s. if you don't believe me, go to YouTube and enter any search like "Top N iPhone / iPad games" and you'll see tons of *core* serious games that put even the best the DS library has to shame.

I disagree. I know of those games. But for example CoD has gameplay that is even worse than doom on the snes. Its a good thing you are fighting zombies because if there was any action from the AI you wouldn't stand a chance with your touchscreen controlls. Crash bandicoot. Nice but try playing it in a bus. Impossible.

This is discussed in a different topic already but I just don't think a phone will ever work as well as a handheld. First of all you just need buttons and as soon as you start designing your phone with game ergonomics in mind it will fail as a phone because it will look ugly and people don't want to look like idiots. Phone gaming has been around forever in Japan but it never hurt handheld sales. Even now when phones are more capable than the DS it still doesnt. Thats because a phone just doesnt work as well as a handheld and IMHO software doesnt cut it either for the most part.

Than there is still the issue of price, battery life, device life (how many new games do you think will run on a 6 year old iphone? with a handheld you are guarranteed atleast 5 or 6 years of gaming) etc

 

[bkilian]

Children of Eden was at the Ubi press conference. New Forza wasn't announced at the press conference either. And I wasn't even including stuff like that, like 'Just Dance 2'. Do you seriously not understand the difference between these games or are you just defending the homefront? When a publisher markets games that are markedly not for me, I get to complain that they're not for me, that I don't like them.

Hardly, it was a GC game that had a Wii version.

I saw Children of Eden listed in the MS video, although it wasn't played, it was specifically listed (since I knew about it before the Ubi conference) and they actually played and showed the motion controlled ferrari in Forza.

If you just don't count stuff you don't want to play, then nintendo announced no new games, since I don't feel that any of them are for me. We're at the point now where the only thing the wii gets used for is Wii fit and youtube videos, and lately not even the youtube. If I buy "Your Shape", I can probably recycle the wii to someone else and never even miss it.

Of the MS games announced, I will probably buy at least two thirds of them, since they will be well received in my family.