Digital Foundry Article Technical Discussion Archive [2010]

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I'd still love to see a framerate compare of retail versions. Would still expect PS3 to have a better framerate, but would like to settle the issue.
 
Users have found shadow differences between the console versions of NBA 2k11 (the best basketball game ever made and one of the best sport games ever made too) and the PC.

Apparently it's because of a shader that makes the lighting much more realistic (the graphics of the game are exceptional) which is present on the console versions but it's inexplicably absent on the PC version of the game.

They are modding the game but for such a game that needs 60 fps to run and work as flawlessly as it does, the current mod adds a performance drop between 10 or 15 FPS regardless how powerful the computer is.

Two pics showing the differences :oops::

http://forums.nba-live.com/viewtopic.php?f=136&t=75655

http://forums.nba-live.com/viewtopic.php?f=132&t=75511

CONSOLE

m2508267.jpg


PC - maxed settings

m2621573.jpg
 
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I'd say it's proper self shadowing and some more advanced soft shadow solution on the console pic. SSAO should affect the ground around and behind his legs because of the close Z values.
 
I'm not sure why they would say that the graphics haven't improved..texture quality does look like a step up and the shadowing has been overhauled - characters and objects now cast real shadows (not just blobs), also have self shadows and there's proper real time shadows from the environments. There are also effects like depth of field in and specular lighting on the water. It has more upgrades than the God of War collection :|

Would have liked to have seen a framerate analysis of the original too, it didn't have a spectacular framerate as I recall..
 
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N_B said:
I'm not sure why they would say that the graphics haven't improved..texture quality does look like a step up and the shadowing has been overhauled - characters and objects now cast real shadows (not just blobs), also have self shadows and there's proper real time shadows from the environments. There are also effects like depth of field in and specular lighting on the water. It has more upgrades than the God of War collection :|

Would have liked to have seen a framerate analysis of the original too, it didn't have a spectacular framerate as I recall..
Click to expand...

Yeah, I'm finding it baffling as well, its clearly a much bigger upgrade than any of the other "HD classics" we've seen. The main issue is the low quality of the base assets but that's not the fault of the port. I don't know why they didn't port Allied Assault instead though, it was a much better game, the base assets were much better overall and porting from a PC codebase should be much simpler. I guess the problem was that the bonus game would end up better than the main game that way, and we can't be having that! ;)

They should have either locked it at 30fps or used triple buffering though, having the game constantly tear throughout like that is not an acceptable solution.
 
Could be a difference in the type of blurring in the post-process step for getting the glow; if not that, then perhaps a difference in the glow texture itself.
 
It's insignificant during actions but on close ups i'd imagine it could be quite annoying. The shadows are simply more offending on the 360's and they should at least point it out if just for reference check.
 
I didn't see it noted in the article but the snow on the PS3 version appears to be running at a much lower resolution to other effects (similar to the water in Bioshock 2).
 
ultragpu said:
It's insignificant during actions but on close ups i'd imagine it could be quite annoying. The shadows are simply more offending on the 360's and they should at least point it out if just for reference check.
Click to expand...

It'd be "annoying" on both platforms, as they both suffer from very poor quality shadowmaps. The resolution seems to be slightly higher on the 360, but the filtering better on the PS3, I'd call that a wash and neither platform comes particularly strongly in the comparison. They mentioned the better shadowmaps when discussing the PC version and that seems fine to me, its the only platform where the implementation has an appreciable difference in overall quality.
 
ultragpu said:
It's insignificant during actions but on close ups i'd imagine it could be quite annoying. The shadows are simply more offending on the 360's and they should at least point it out if just for reference check.
Click to expand...

It must be said that I don't have the game on either platform, but going from the EG video here http://www.eurogamer.net/videos/medal-of-honor-ps3-360-campaign-performance?size=hd it looks to me like the PS3 shadows are more offending. The stepping is really noticable in the mountains part of the video, and even more so in the warehouse part looking to the girders and rear wall.

So yes, I also thought the 360 shadow filtering looked to be the poorer version from a couple of screenshots, but the reality is that the higher quality shadow maps and larger steps for filtering make for better in-action shadowing.
 
ultragpu said:
It's insignificant during actions but on close ups i'd imagine it could be quite annoying. The shadows are simply more offending on the 360's and they should at least point it out if just for reference check.
Click to expand...

Did you even look at the images that AlStrong linked? It's quite clear that the PS3 shadows are inferior with no filtering of the edges going on.

Either way, both look horrible due to the low resolution of the base shadowmap. The X360 shadows end up looking softer although the filtering gradients are bad. The PS3 version is sharper, but then look extremely unrealistic due to that.

Regards,
SB
 
Silent_Buddha said:
Did you even look at the images that AlStrong linked? It's quite clear that the PS3 shadows are inferior with no filtering of the edges going on.
Click to expand...

The PS3 shadows definitely have standard 2x2 PCF being applied, which is what you'd expect considering the RSX can do it "for free". The 360 has some sort of nasty grid-based sample pattern with equal weights given to the taps, and the results are seriously ugly.
 
"Unfortunately, there are two bugs ("features") that made it through: Lightsabers are a little fatter on the PS3 which some people happen to like more, and there is no tension map on the character's face in cut-scenes on the PS3. This is not because of any technical problem or hardware constraint of the PlayStation 3. Just a bug."

Ha! :)
 
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