NVIDIA Fermi: Architecture discussion

[SiliconAbyss]

There is a huge difference between Intel showing Larrabee and talking about it months or even years in advance, vs Nvidia talking about Fermi. Larrabee is not Intel's core business. And if Larrabee is never released, or never makes any noise in the marketplace, at least in the mid term Intel will hardly be affected.

Fermi is Nvidia's core business and vital to their future. So of course there is going to be great discussion when it turns into a fiasco. Let's be honest here, we don't have a launch date commitment from Nvidia because they simply don't know when it will happen. "Fully ramping Q1-2010" etc. doesn't exactly clear up the situation.

 

[silent_guy]

There is a huge difference between Intel showing Larrabee and talking about it months or even years in advance, vs Nvidia talking about Fermi. Larrabee is not Intel's core business. And if Larrabee is never released, or never makes any noise in the marketplace, at least in the mid term Intel will hardly be affected.

Fermi is Nvidia's core business and vital to their future. So of course there is going to be great discussion when it turns into a fiasco. Let's be honest here, we don't have a launch date commitment from Nvidia because they simply don't know when it will happen. "Fully ramping Q1-2010" etc. doesn't exactly clear up the situation.

CPU's are Intel's core business, last time I checked. So are cars for most car makers. etc. etc.

My point is that GPU makers seem to be the only ones that are held to a higher standard wrt pre-announcement.

 

[neliz]

if that picture really IS a GeForce board, it would give credentials to the rumor of different designs.
The Fermi design has PEG connectors on the top and far edge of the card, this card only has them on the top, much like the current GTX's.

 

[Bob]

I thought it was a Parhelia 3...

 

[SiliconAbyss]

CPU's are Intel's core business, last time I checked.

Has anyone stated otherwise? I don't think Nvidia or ATI are being held to a higher standard. Imagine Intel posting blurry pics on Facebook, or showing hacked up fake products and passing them off as the real deal.

You don't think people would have a field day with that?

 

[SiliconAbyss]

BTW, where is the CPU HSF behind the "Fermi" card? Must be a pretty low profile unit to be hidden completely by the graphics card. Also, what is the motherboard sitting on? Seems to be floating in mid air, or hanging over the edge of something.

And what is that red smear under the floppy connector? Also, if you zoom in to the SLI connector area, what is directly behind it? It looks like part of the Heaven demo imagery, but cropped and zoomed and out of place? I don't know, starting to think the picture is shopped.

 

[Cookie Monster]

I feel like wearing my tinfoil hat.

 

[seahawk]

That is of course your opinion. But there is alot of things people can learn from the picture that were previously unknown to most before.

Power requirements, cooling, and size, an idea of how far the hardware has come since prototype builds. There are those out there who care more about that than the political issues that some people seem intent on harping on.

A photo of a sample card tells us nothing. They should deliver real cards or shut up. This teasing is pointless and makes them look like the idiots they are.

It is bad enough to have been beaten by AMD so clearly, but the constant deny and FUD strategy is far worse.

I would only respect NV, if they would go to the press and finalyl say that there will be no Fermi based products before May 2010. And that the whole faimily won´t be on the shelves before the end of next year.

 

[silent_guy]

Has anyone stated otherwise? I don't think Nvidia or ATI are being held to a higher standard. Imagine Intel posting blurry pics on Facebook, or showing hacked up fake products and passing them off as the real deal.

You don't think people would have a field day with that?

You're talking about presentation tactics, which is not my point. But if you insist: Nvidia shows a mock-up enclosure and Intel shows a wafer full of Larrabee's. Both were not showing a working prototype, but both were presenting concrete details of the chip architecture. Practical difference for everybody involved: nihil (* exept that one will supposedly launch much earlier than the other.) Yet nobody complained about Intel paper launching Larrabee...

If Nvidia had decided to show a wafer full of dies instead, do you really believe people would not have complained about a paper launch?

Anyway, I don't care about presentation tactics. The main question is: why is it considered evil for GPU vendors to disclose technical details of their next architecture when it's not for anybody else?

 

[SiliconAbyss]

Yet nobody complained about Intel paper launching Larrabee...

Intel never paper launched Larrabee, where did you get that idea? They showed off wafers, a few demos, talked about the tech etc. but nothing even remotely considered a launch. I'm sure when Intel is ready to make Larrabee based products available, they'll issue a release with expected launch date.

If Nvidia had decided to show a wafer full of dies instead, do you really believe people would not have complained about a paper launch?

Again the term paper launch. Nothing has been launched by Nvidia with respect to Fermi. We have a white paper, a fake card, a demo supposedly run on Fermi, a questionable Facebook image. That's about it right?

Anyway, I don't care about presentation tactics. The main question is: why is it considered evil for GPU vendors to disclose technical details of their next architecture and when it's not for anybody else?

It's not, that is your impression. AMD has released a few choice details on Bulldozer, but they state a 2011 launch. They are quite clear when it is expected to launch even a year out. No they don't give exact dates, but they can't because they don't know.

If some version of Fermi is so close to being released, it seems logical that we would hear noise about prices, clocks, release date, performance, leaked benches, board partner versions etc. but we have none of that. Something doesn't add up. So either Nvidia has become extremely secretive, or they are a long way off from a proper release. I believe the only official statement from Nvidia is Tesla Fermi in Q2-2010, someone can correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[XMAN26]

BTW, where is the CPU HSF behind the "Fermi" card? Must be a pretty low profile unit to be hidden completely by the graphics card. Also, what is the motherboard sitting on? Seems to be floating in mid air, or hanging over the edge of something.

And what is that red smear under the floppy connector? Also, if you zoom in to the SLI connector area, what is directly behind it? It looks like part of the Heaven demo imagery, but cropped and zoomed and out of place? I don't know, starting to think the picture is shopped.

Watercooling? Low Profile Intel HSF unit, we got some for C2Ds in the shop I work for, 2.5 tall including fan. 3" ones for Core i7s.

 

[SiliconAbyss]

Watercooling? Low Profile Intel HSF unit, we got some for C2Ds in the shop I work for, 2.5 tall including fan. 3" ones for Core i7s.

Possible.

I do want to know why the motherboard seems to be resting on nothing, just looks strange to me. A nice clear image would be nice, but that would be too simple I guess, better to post low quality images and have people speculate.

 

[thatdude90210]

What happened to Nvidia? In the past, they would have met the opposition's launches with their own launches, heavily O/C products if they weren't ready, or at least "performance drivers." Now AMD is launching products left and right and all Nv has is some white paper and a facebook photo. Surprising.

 

[ChrisRay]

Just to be clear. I don't know what the second motherboard is in the background.Its too unclear. I have asked Nvidia and am hoping they'll clear it up. In a way I think its a little odd. Spending more time figuring out what the other hardware is rather than the pic itself... But hey whatever right?

http://twitter.com/NVIDIAGeForce

Considering this is part of their new geforce twitter thing they are doing on twitter. I dont think they honestly expected it to be dissected so much. They have been providing bits of information every week here. The picture isn't very high quality. So its partially their fault.

 

[XMAN26]

Just to be clear. I don't know what the second motherboard is in the background its too unclear. I have asked Nvidia and am hoping they'll clear it up. In a way I think its a little odd. Spending more time figuring out what the other hardware is rather than the pic itself... But hey whatever right? Considering this is part of their new geforce twitter thing they are doing on twitter.

http://twitter.com/NVIDIAGeForce

I dont think they honestly expected it to be dissected so much. They have been providing bits of information every week here. The picture isn't very high quality. So its partially their fault.

Late night CR?

 

[ChrisRay]

Late night CR?

Just got home from wal mart. Bought the Star Trek DVD, and decided to do one more forum browse and e-mail checkup

I would only respect NV, if they would go to the press and finalyl say that there will be no Fermi based products before May 2010. And that the whole faimily won´t be on the shelves before the end of next year.

So you'd only respect Nvidia if they told you what you wanted to hear? I'll be sure to let them know.

 

[SiliconAbyss]

Spending more time figuring out what the other hardware is rather than the pic itself... But hey whatever right?

I put my tinfoil hat on and looked closely at the card and motherboard. If I didn't know better, I'd say someone photoshopped the whole thing in front of a monitor. But that's crazy talk I suppose.

Considering this is part of their new geforce twitter thing they are doing on twitter.

Ugh, Facebook and now Twitter. This goes for any corporation, use your own site for god sake not these stupid "social networking" trash sites to get your message out.

I dont think they honestly expected it to be dissected so much.

I'm sure the same mentality applied to the Fermi mockup huh.

 

[Razor1]

I
Ugh, Facebook and now Twitter. This goes for any corporation, use your own site for god sake not these stupid "social networking" trash sites to get your message out.

Hey coming from the advertising world, social networks are pretty big tools for advertisers

 

[ChrisRay]

I put my tinfoil hat on and looked closely at the card and motherboard. If I didn't know better, I'd say someone photoshopped the whole thing in front of a monitor. But that's crazy talk I suppose.

I asked about it. And I'll just wait for a response at this point. They'll either choose to respond or not. I got the impression from them that they were surprised this is even an issue.

gh, Facebook and now Twitter. This goes for any corporation, use your own site for god sake not these stupid "social networking" trash sites to get your message out.

The twitter thing I only mentioned because its part of their "weekly" Fun Fermi Facts thing that they are doing there. They started it about the same time they decided to mention Fermi's tessellation.

I'm sure the same mentality applied to the Fermi mockup huh

Maybe. I don't know. I do not know the reason for everything Nvidia does. Unfortunately everyone seems to think I do. If something I say does come from Nvidia. I am pretty clear on outlining that. TBH I am surprised at the reactions here. Most forums ((with the exception hardocp/B3D that I have read. Have mostly been positive. Most people are just happy to see a picture of the card.

Then again. I looked at the picture as "Silicon Sex pic". "Naked uncensored Hardware". So I always thought seeing the card on display like this was quite fun When I first saw that they were hosting a picture of it I was rather excited. But you guys are total kill joys.

Chris

 

[silent_guy]

Again the term paper launch. Nothing has been launched by Nvidia with respect to Fermi.

We're in agreement then. Both Intel and Nvidia unveiled tidbits about their new architecture at their technical conference. Let's treat them the same then.