So if Far Cry on Wii was given a second chance........

[kyleb]

Surely he means simple hightmaps rather than normal maps.

 

[Fox5]

So a shift from normal mapping to EMBM is an improvement? Granted, Unleashed looks better, but not by a lot.

The xbox version of the godzilla game looked much better than the gamecube version. Look at the gamecube version and there's a huge jump here.

 

[fearsomepirate]

I didn't think Godzilla: Save the Earth came out on Gamecube. The Wii game is certainly looking better than the Cube original:

Cube:

Wii:
http://media.wii.ign.com/media/881/881519/img_4583210.html
(sorry, oversized image)

The lighting is better, the particles are better, other effects I can't name are better, the water is 1000x better, the models are more detailed, and there's more bump-mapping.

 

[archangelmorph]

Granted there are technical variations between the platforms but you only have to look at games on the Xbox & PS2 like MGS3, Ninja Gaiden & Halo 2 to see that there's probably a fair bit of room for improvement with regards to the visual aspects of Wii games..

In addition,

I can't help but wonder whether alot of the problems with Wii games development stem from inadaquate resources with respect to good quality art over the technical limitations the platform may present..

If Peter Jackson's King Kong on the PS2 can have such a high level of atmospherics & exception art direction on such a limited hardware base, I'm sure with enough talent, Wii games should be able to easily follow suit..

 

[maluraq]

PS2 Examples

I just look at the Ratchet & Clank, Jak 3 or God of War (1&2) as examples of what the PS2's hardware is capable of and then wonder why the Wii games still don't look comparable yet to me.

Maybe its just a style issue, but those games really pushed the hardware to shine compared to early PS2 games (and many later PS2 games as well).

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

I suppose it has been said a 1000 times already, but its because devs dont have the time/money/skills/whatever to build a good wii engine.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

That doesn't make much sense. A good GC engine would translate into a good Wii engine, certainly achieving more than last-gen platforms just on the strength of being a double-clocked GC without factoring in any small tweaks needed to get more from the architecture. A huge plus-point for Wii development is that it's a lot cheaper, so it makes no sense to cut back on Wii expense when a similar cutback on a PS360 title will yield a lot more saved cash.

Indeed, you've cast your explanation very wide! Clearly some devs have the skills to make the most of Wi, but these ones aren't given the time or money needed? Whereas those with the time and money don't have the skills?

I'm sure the problem does lie in the development side but that's a sad state for Wii and rather ironic given the system ought to be the simplest, cheapest, easiest to develop for system of all three!

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

Maybe its because devs have invested so much in being hd ready? maybe its because the B and C teams are on Wii games? Maybe because of that they automatically get less money and time? Maybe its because devs/publishers rather make a quick buck on a miniparty game than build something decent?

Even RC:UC using the re4 engine, one of the best of the GC, doesnt look alot better than RE4 if any at all which to me make it seem like not enough time and money is spend or a lower ranked team is on the game or a combination of those.

 

[fearsomepirate]

If we're talking 3rd party, I think RC:UC looks pretty nice. MOH:Heroes 2 looks better than any of the PS2 MOH games did, especially given that it runs at 60 fps with anti-aliasing. Red Steel had a few areas that looked quite good, even if it was rushed overall.

I think quality of 3rd party games will slowly improve.

 

[DeadlyNinja]

That doesn't make much sense. A good GC engine would translate into a good Wii engine

Well see, I think that's the problem, they don't have a good GC engine. Look back at the GC and you'll notice all it did was get hand-me-down versions of PS2 games. The games were generally ports (and bad ports even) of PS2 games. The engine was never built specifically to make the most out of the GC. Now a company like Capcom on the the other hand did in fact build games tailors for the GC, that's why they can make the most out of what they did last gen.

I think quality of 3rd party games will slowly improve.

Yeah, check out NiGHTs on the Wii. The newest screen shots clearly show a leap over their previous Sonic and the Secret Rings. It shows that Sega is getting the hang of the hardware now.

Regular? What exactly is "regular bump mapping"?

I would consider just "bump mapping" being regular bump mapping. I mean, I'm sure you've heard of dot 3 bump mapping, environment map bump mapping, and even effects like parallax mapping and displacement mapping fall under the enhanced bump mapping category.

 

[seebs]

My assumption is that the main issue may be time -- a whole lot of Wii games thus far were rushed hugely because everyone was assuming the Wii would be irrelevant in the market, and then suddenly BANG, "it's the fastest-selling console, RELEASE THE GAMES!"

For an example, compare Zack & Wiki to Wind Waker. Z&W, IMHO, looks a LOT better, even though Wind Waker was no slouch.

 

[Turok]

My assumption is that the main issue may be time -- a whole lot of Wii games thus far were rushed hugely because everyone was assuming the Wii would be irrelevant in the market, and then suddenly BANG, "it's the fastest-selling console, RELEASE THE GAMES!"

And despite all that, third party games are still selling better on the 360 and PS3. Not that this has anything to do with the thread topic.

 

[seebs]

Well, yeah.

But I think the rush-to-market is a big part of why we see so many games that look like utter crap.

 

[theafu]

And despite all that, third party games are still selling better on the 360 and PS3. Not that this has anything to do with the thread topic.

I know you read gaf PS3 is not doing better for 3rd parties globally than Wii. If Wii had any 3rd support like 360 it would easily be doing a lot better definetly not the same though. Comparing 3rd support of 360 vs Wii is extremely inaccurate due to the quality and selection of titles for consumers.

 

[Turok]

I know you read gaf PS3 is not doing better for 3rd parties globally than Wii. If Wii had any 3rd support like 360 it would easily be doing a lot better definetly not the same though. Comparing 3rd support of 360 vs Wii is extremely inaccurate due to the quality and selection of titles for consumers.

Actually, I'm just paying attention to certain games like Madden, that were released on all consoles. Also, Medal of Honor Heroes 2, which is getting some pretty good press, is still selling like crap. Nintendo has been at the short end of the 3rd party stick for 11 years now, and it looks like it's going to continue this way.

 

[seebs]

I think it's early to make solid predictions about third-party sales; until the Wii catches up with console demand, there are millions of people who want the console, and might buy some games for it, who aren't in a position to buy games yet. I'd guess that the broader market base will mean lower attach rates for any given kind of game, so I'd expect sales to be lower than they would be, say, on a console with a very narrowly targeted demographic whose gaming preferences are very well understood.

But that's attach rate, and sales would be lower per capita, leaving some room for success anyway.

 

[theafu]

Actually, I'm just paying attention to certain games like Madden, that were released on all consoles. Also, Medal of Honor Heroes 2, which is getting some pretty good press, is still selling like crap. Nintendo has been at the short end of the 3rd party stick for 11 years now, and it looks like it's going to continue this way.

EA is mixed and they released a report showing that Wii is their 3rd best platform PS2 in 2nd and 360 is first. What's sad I'm fairly sure I read their mobile products do more than PS3 does for them.

Madden is a horrible example btw. 07 actually did good for them in comparison to how they typically do with nintendo consumers. 08 has so many product quality issues related to gameplay they have only themselves to blame for the sales. Tiger 07 and Godfather actually did pretty good for them in sales.

I'm sure in a year EA will relaize the better products are selling on the system rather then bad ports in comparison to other platforms or the dumb casual games like boogie and playground they seem to think is hotstuff with the Wii base.

BTW their PS3 products suck but it seems sony fans are starting to realize what pc and nintendo cosumers have known for years if you're not the main bread winner for this company.