Formula 1 - 2008 Season

[DJ12]

they said they have NO info and later this was proved to be a lie.
So, Ron Dennis is a proved liar.

Did they prove Ron Dennis knew?

Maybe Ferrari knew Stepany was giving McLaren the documents too ey? Maybe they were all in on it.

I'm sure were you work everyone knows what you are doing 24 hours a day.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

I hope so. I'm starting to like Alonso.

US

 

[chavvdarrr]

Did they prove Ron Dennis knew?

Maybe Ferrari knew Stepany was giving McLaren the documents too ey? Maybe they were all in on it.

I'm sure were you work everyone knows what you are doing 24 hours a day.

LOL, I'm sure if I'm a manager of a team, I'd know if my team had problems heating tyres and then find a solution via external info. And I'd know if my pilots discuss openly such external info.
You know, I guess pilots do not pump tyres by themselves

Or, if pilots and mechanics don't bother informing me about possessing such info, I will resign before being fired. He did not resign. He was not fired. So he knew and thats my IMHO based on widely known facts. You may believe he is white and puffy, thats your right.

 

[pocketmoon66]

Excellent footage!

http://f1.com/news/headlines/2008/10/8530.html

Shows Hami bogging down at the start.
Shows Kovi not Hami pushing Kimi off
Shows Masa aiming at Hami to take him out - Actually Masa struggling to keep his car from colliding, but still worthy of the penalty.
Bourdais not rolling out the red carpet for Masa.

Me ? Biased ?

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

Take a closer look my friend. Yes its kovi doing the initial way to late braking pushing out Kimi the first time, but if you keep looking you also see Hammi is not taking the corner but keep going forword while knowing that Raikonnen is right next to him. What he basically did is just push him totally wide, even out of the track.

And massa aiming for hamiton? get some glasses. All the time he had his steering wheel to the left, he didnt make one move to steer the car towards hamilton. When you got 2 wheels on the grass you just dont have total controll anymore.

Cant say much about the bourdais thing, not that easy to see. But if you look at the massa in car footage it almost seems from his reaction that he didnt expect him to be there.

 

[DJ12]

I seem to recall Massa saying he crashed into Lewis because Lewis forced him off the track. Someone test him for drugs, he's on something.

 

[pocketmoon66]

Take a closer look my friend.

OK....

I see Hamilton cut up on the inside, forcing his teammate to take evasive action (scary!)
Then hami locks up BIG TIME....
As the reach the apex kimi is behind hami with Kovi behind and pointing straight at him
Kimi takes evase action to stop kavi hitting him! At this point hami is 3/4 car length out of the way.

Unless you think hami was smart enough to force kimi to slow down into the path of kovi knowing that the direction kovi was traveling in would force kimi off-track ? Penalty for both of them!

 

[Bludd]

I think the penalties awarded to Hamilton and Massa were OK and deserved. Bourdais' wasn't. He was robbed period.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

OK....

I see Hamilton cut up on the inside, forcing his teammate to take evasive action (scary!)
Then hami locks up BIG TIME....
As the reach the apex kimi is behind hami with Kovi behind and pointing straight at him
Kimi takes evase action to stop kavi hitting him! At this point hami is 3/4 car length out of the way.

Unless you think hami was smart enough to force kimi to slow down into the path of kovi knowing that the direction kovi was traveling in would force kimi off-track ? Penalty for both of them!

Dude, Hamilton wasnt infront of him. The only time he was infront of Kimi was when he didnt hit the freakin' brakes, driving straight ahead and forcing kimi to do the same because kimi couldnt make the corner anymore because both kovie and hamilton parked their car there because of late braking.

 

[Kaotik]

Bourdais incident was justified IMO, after all Bourdais DID have the blue flag/light on him from the pits, so he should have been the one giving room

 

[DJ12]

But he was racing for position, the fact he is an inferior car shouldn't make any difference. How many times did we see Mansell, Senna, Schumacher and the like swerve violently out of the pits to stop someone overtaking them.

If it is a new rule that you cannot defend your position then you may as well cancel the sport. All he did was defend the corner, he was in front so was entitled to do so.

 

[Bludd]

Bourdais incident was justified IMO, after all Bourdais DID have the blue flag/light on him from the pits, so he should have been the one giving room

They were fighting for position. He was in front. Why should he be blue flagged?

 

[Kaotik]

They were fighting for position. He was in front. Why should he be blue flagged?

Because that's what they do to people leaving pits at 80km/h when people are driving 250km/h next to them? The footage clearly shows that Massa was going at a LOT higher speed to the corner

 

[Bludd]

Because that's what they do to people leaving pits at 80km/h when people are driving 250km/h next to them?

But people have been fighting with other cars when they come out of the pits since forever.

The flashing blue lights are to warn the exiting driver of cars coming down the straight. What was Bourdais to do? Stop? Go wide and give Massa the position? No, they were fighting for position and Massa hit Bourdais. Should Massa be let go because he and Ferrari think they are entitled to pass a lesser car even if they are fighting for position? It is preposterous.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

how the hell can you fight for a position when you are going over 100kmph slower? Thats why the blue light is there. Someone's coming, he's faster (on this track anyway), watch out, or get out of the way because with such a speed difference you cant do anything anyway and it will just end in tears.

 

[pocketmoon66]

, or get out of the way .

Where would you have liked Bourdais to go ?

 

[chavvdarrr]

how the hell can you fight for a position when you are going over 100kmph slower? Thats why the blue light is there. Someone's coming, he's faster (on this track anyway), watch out, or get out of the way because with such a speed difference you cant do anything anyway and it will just end in tears.

I disagree, I may be wrong but few laps before or after Kimi fought for his position exiting pits and stand ahead of someone.

 

[Dave Baumann]

Charlie Whitings previous guidelines is that the car on the track should be wary of and give sufficient room to the cars exiting the pits.

 

[Bludd]

But it seems that whatever Charlie says, the FIA stewards disagrees with. They need to coordinate their understanding of the regulations or this kind of weird inconsistency will continue.

 

[DJ12]

how the hell can you fight for a position when you are going over 100kmph slower? Thats why the blue light is there. Someone's coming, he's faster (on this track anyway), watch out, or get out of the way because with such a speed difference you cant do anything anyway and it will just end in tears.

He wasn't, Massa was only slightly faster at the point he crashed into him. Unless you are going to claim Massa could go round turn 1 100kmph faster than Bourdain.

The second part of your post is irrelevant, Bourdain did not swerve violently to defend his position like many other drivers have done in the past he mearly kept going in the position he was which Massa clearly saw. Massa turned in on him, Massa was to blame. The only reason Bourdain was punished is because he's in an inferior car, we've already seen that when it's the other way around they don't do anything.