Or when the Falcon is ready to take over.
3 year warranty for all X360s.
- Thread starter Cheezdoodles
- Start date
Or when the Falcon is ready to take over.
____This whole situation is a total joke. Especially the part where people are commending Microsoft for the 3-year warranty. They shouldn't be thanked, they should be condemned.
____MS has been covering up and denying the problem all this time, likely from day one. They knowingly shipped a defective product just to edge out ahead of the competition. The only reason they have done anything at this point isn't the result of their desire to take care of their loyal customers, it's their desire to avoid lawsuits after being caught red-handed (or red-ringed, as it were).
____Let's be honest here, $1.5B for MS isn't nearly as big a loss as it would have been to replace all of them for being defective. They even managed to turn it into a PR by being so "generous" with the three year warranty. It would have been far better for their image if it wasn't so faulty in the first place.
____Frankly, I was going to buy one myself at some point for some of the exclusives, ignoring my better judgment and looking past the Microsoft I've known for years. However, this incident is a firm reminder of their true colors. And I suspect this situation is only going to get worse as the months wear on.
____MS has been covering up and denying the problem all this time, likely from day one. They knowingly shipped a defective product just to edge out ahead of the competition. The only reason they have done anything at this point isn't the result of their desire to take care of their loyal customers, it's their desire to avoid lawsuits after being caught red-handed (or red-ringed, as it were).
____Let's be honest here, $1.5B for MS isn't nearly as big a loss as it would have been to replace all of them for being defective. They even managed to turn it into a PR by being so "generous" with the three year warranty. It would have been far better for their image if it wasn't so faulty in the first place.
____Frankly, I was going to buy one myself at some point for some of the exclusives, ignoring my better judgment and looking past the Microsoft I've known for years. However, this incident is a firm reminder of their true colors. And I suspect this situation is only going to get worse as the months wear on.
Condemned for the 3 year extension or condemned for not doing enough? Or just plain "condemended"?
I'd love to see some proof of a "cover-up". I'm currently chaulking it up to manufacturing ineptitude. Microsoft's strengths lie in software, not hardware...
Can you do the math on this one? I'm not seeing how doing a complete recall of all consoles is cheaper than extending a warranty. Also, it's 1 billion, not 1.5. And saying, "it would have been better" is simply stating the obvious.
Their true colors is to sit on a manufacturing issue that eventually costs them a billion dollars? This makes no sense and is likely simply slashdot M$ drivel, but figured I'd give you a chance to clarify.
quest55720
Regular
Well lets see MS could of done nothing like sony and nintendo before them. I think the solution is more than fair. Is it late sure but at least users got a solution. This is a good thing IMO because it sets a president for the future. In the past it would of been a cover up never admitting the problem. I would of loved sony to of offered a 3 year warrenty on the first model PS1s and even early PS2s. I would of loved for Nintendo to of offered a 3 year warrenty on the NES and the cartrige slot problem. This is the first time that if I have a problem it don't cost me a dime. I would much rather wait a few weeks than to have to buy a new system like have many times in the past.
I have been an early adopter for almost of my life and have been screwed many times. Do I wish every system was built like a tank ie the SNES, Gamecube and saturn hell yes. This is the real world that is not going to happen. I have been screwed over by every game company out there. There are no innocents in this industry.
Mintmaster
Veteran
Please take a step back to see how ridiculously inane this statement is.
How can you puposely ship a defective product knowing how much it would cost to either repair all of them or face a lawsuit? Do you have any idea how much damage has been done to the XBox brand? You said yourself their image would have been better if they didn't have to do this in the first place.
No way in hell does Microsoft benefit from shipping a faulty product. Supply problems prevented holiday 2005 from being much of a factor. Early sales have the most loss per console too. Repair cost is huge, as it also means tech support, and shipping, and freebies.
It defies all logic to think this was intentional. MS would gladly take a 1-2 million unit sales hit if they could avoid this $1B+ problem.
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Okay, I probably should have enclosed it in rant tags. However, I stand by my statements.
1.) They should be condemned for letting it be so bad in the first place. I have no doubt that the failure rate would have been much lower if they'd taken a year longer to iron out the design flaws. In my opinion, they rushed it out without regard for the nasty inconvenience any flaws might cause their customers.
2.) In all the interviews where they were queried about the subject, they always said that it was around 3-5%. This is substantially lower, and far less damaging to their image, than the recent statistic being closer to 30-33%. With the number of repairs they've had to perform, and the number of retailers contacting them for support, they've had to have known about this problem for months. Yet they still kept saying that it was just 3-5% failure rate. Only when the retailers went public did MS start to admit to the problem being more than they let on previously. To me, that sounds like covering it up.
3.) I was saying it would have been cheaper to make sure they weren't defective in the first place by not having rushed the units out a year early. Also, the complete recall isn't meant to be a cheap solution, it is meant to be a complete solution. The number of cases where individuals who received refurbished replacements that failed yet again tells me that the main design of the unit is still flawed (something I can attest to from my own examinations of the 360's internals). So I think the warranty extension isn't a real solution, it's just a PR move to avoid the much larger costs of a real solution being forced by litigation. Now, it just means that the owners can go through the inconvenient process of sending it in and getting it replaced over and over again for the 4 years that the 360 is likely to be out.
As for the cost I mentioned, some sources I've heard said $1B, others said $1.5B.
4.) Their true colors being them treating hardware products about the same way as they treat their software products. It's exactly the same as with Vista, they're shipping a faulty product whether the customers want it or not, and then putting the customer through the inconvenience of having to deal with all those problems as MS tries to make the product usable after the fact.
That's the way I see it.
quest55720
Regular
You mean the way sony treated customers who had broken PS1s? You know the system you had to turn on its side or upside down to play after a while then just quit working. Those PS1s were just as shoddy as the 360 horrible failure rate until the new model came out. I ended up buying 3 damn PS1s because of shoddy hardware. I was out well over 300 extra dollars because of it. I still bought a PS2 at launch at least MS is offering a solution. I would of gladly taken MS solution instead of having to dig into my own pocket. Lets see buy a new system vs a few week return time on a repair.
Mintmaster
Veteran
Anyone who thinks MS should do a recall should read this again and again:
People who have a failed console will get an improved one. People that don't are fine with their current console. A recall does nothing but aggravate more customers. If I had a currently functional 360, I would most certainly prefer a 3 year warranty over a new unit with a 1 year warranty.
People who have a failed console will get an improved one. People that don't are fine with their current console. A recall does nothing but aggravate more customers. If I had a currently functional 360, I would most certainly prefer a 3 year warranty over a new unit with a 1 year warranty.
____I am not on Sony's side either. I buy the console that has the games, and point out flaws where I see them. I've condemned Sony in the past for underhanded things they've done (like the rootkit fiasco).
____The incidents you've mentioned were largely in the first year of the consoles. Here, the 360 is well into its second year, and is still exhibiting these problems en masse. Also, a failure rate of 33% is both exceedingly high and unprecedented for any console ever. That's not acceptable, in my opinion.
____Previously, despite my feelings about Microsoft, I was going to buy a 360 for the exclusives it had. Now that this whole mess has come to light, it just doesn't seem worth the enormous inconvenience that the purchase might bring.
quest55720
Regular
Inconvenience of sending in a machine maybe? Hell if it does happen this fall you will get a free up grade to the falcon. Hell I am rooting for my machine to take a crap after x-mass to get a free up grade. If making a phone call and shipping out your console is a major inconvience you must live one hell of a good life and must no purchase many things because in general things are cheap and poorly made these days.
Mintmaster
Veteran
What rock are you living under? MS is being condemned for it. There are articles all over the place about the issue, and the forums are all over it. TV shows are talking about it. Any limited praise they get is relative to doing nothing, and even that is very limited. I haven't seen one article praising MS.
The particular quote you're referring to is from a loooong time ago. Lots of people are only seeing this problem after a year or more with the console, so there's no reason to think the representative was lying when he said that.
Read my post above. A recall solves nothing, as it implies you must get the console fixed. Consumers win too, as the number of consoles that will fail after 3 years is likely far less the number of new consoles that will fail.
Get your anti-Vista sentiment out of here. There is no consensus whatsoever that Vista is a "faulty product". Are you a diehard Apple fan or something? Or do you think Linux would have fewer problems for the average user? Where is all this nonsense coming from?
http://www.dailytech.com/Xbox+360+Recalled+by+EB+Games+Australia/article8056.htm
Not a RRoD issue though, strange.
Not a RRoD issue though, strange.
Not to nitpick, but didn't they allow for free upgrades of anyone's older-gen PS1 because of it? None of my friends or I had problems, but they swapped theirs out when they had the opportunity. (I didn't, for some reason I can't remember. I think I just wanted to keep the split RCA jacks instead of getting the combined port.) Since then, they all had no problems, and mine only developed an issue reason the occasional burned disk.
The problem here is not that there's ANY problems, but that it's much more pervasive. While there have been tons of comments you can pick up online, I've never seen anything close to it in my local area. There's the occasional bum console, sure, but that's pretty much universal. (Less so the consoles with no moving parts--for instance I never saw a bum N64...) However, there are half as many I know who own a 360 as owned any PS generation, and there have been 3-4x as many problems. (Heck, NONE of them have had "no problems" with it, though I few only got "momentary 3-lights" they could recover from.)
I don't remember the specifics of whatever the deal was back in late '97 or so (I suppose it could have been store-prompted rather than Sony-prompted), that kind of free-trade-in for whoever wants should really go on with the 360 along WITH the extended warranty. Especially since that only covers the 3-lights right now, and it seems to design issues can crop up in other ways, too.
That's an interesting point. How many other consoles have had indicators for when they crap out? Are the red rings a smart addition to help solve user issues, or a simple indicator for MS to aid categorisation of their oft failing hardware for easy fix or replacement handling?
Knowing MS to be the ship it now, fix it later company they are in the PC space, I'd go with the latter.
I certainly haven't seen another console with specific error lights, and to me it suggests "we know these things might happen quite regually"
Doesn't 4 mean it's cooked itself for example?
3, mild dose of overheating maybe not fatal?
I certainly haven't seen another console with specific error lights, and to me it suggests "we know these things might happen quite regually"
Doesn't 4 mean it's cooked itself for example?
3, mild dose of overheating maybe not fatal?
You can't put in software diagnostics for alot of these failures after the fact. The hardware was designed with this in mind. Consoles are way too complicated to not have a POST and rudimentary diagnostics.
The original XBOX would FRAG and display error codes, and display amber if the display connector was not installed. It is far more likely that RROD is an extension to that functionality, than some stupid conspiracy theory.