Digital Foundry Article Technical Discussion [2021]

[Deleted member 11852]

Well then explain it in the video when you are doing the comparisons. Could this also not contribute to the fps difference in a minor way. You are doing yourself no favours when showing off screenshots like these and there's differences, it just looks like you are sucking up to MS, which I am sure you are not but it looks like it. It's an impression you are giving off.

Calm down man, you're coming over as incredibly aggressive and accusative.

 

[PSman1700]

I am not a Machine sadly

Seriously?

Just ignore him and others trying to find errors and disprove your excellent work. It happens from time to time here when another DF video appears and it doesnt fit their narrative.
All you do is let the facts and numbers talk.

Thanks for your work and your input on this forum (which is quite rare these days for obvious reasons).

 

[Vega86]

The PS5 Version suffers from Black crush - which will exaggerate detail at times while eliminating others. A known issue we logged with remedy while looking at the game pre-release.
Imo - it is best not to look for minor differences of colour and Variation or even pure detail as each shot I made required me to line up the Camera manually. They are not Pixel perfect across platforms, I am not a Machine sadly.

Do you happen to know if it's limited to Control? PS4 games on my console look like it's crushing blacks. Never had this weird look on my PS4. Already set it to Full.

 

[Dictator]

Here we go - to sooth some conspiracy theories. I just went back to Maintanence Access Corridor after restarting the Directorial Override Mission on both consoles, waited a full minute, and made screenshots. With the HUD so people can see which console at is, and without the HUD so people can see the image in full. Here it is possible to see that the texture this time I did it looks different on the PS5 version in fact. It looks like the game's texture streamer is imperfect. A whole lot of fuss over absolutely nothing. The versions are the same.
PS5:

PS5 with UI:

XSX:

XSX with UI:

Do you happen to know if it's limited to Control? PS4 games on my console look like it's crushing blacks. Never had this weird look on my PS4. Already set it to Full.

PS5 renders all games in an HDR container and then applies its own tonemaps down to SDR. So all games in SDR on PS5 will look different than normal SDR as designed by the developer on PS4 or PS4 Pro.

It is something that could possibly be producing a blacked crush look in SDR displayed back compat games.

 

[Vega86]

Seriously? You must know from watching DF that my investment in next gen consoles is purely intellectual and I quite literally only care about games on PC and the PC platform.

Wait. Are you Alex B?

 

[eloic]

Wait. Are you Alex B?

Yes, he is. You're late to the party, buddy.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Here we go - to sooth some conspiracy theories.

Any views on jewish space lasers?

 

[iroboto]

Well then explain it in the video when you are doing the comparisons. Could this also not contribute to the fps difference in a minor way. You are doing yourself no favours when showing off screenshots like these and there's differences, it just looks like you are sucking up to MS, which I am sure you are not but it looks like it. It's an impression you are giving off.

I direct you to the very first post of this very thread written by our mods. Please read carefully.

 

[Dictator]

Any views on jewish space lasers?

The mel brooks movie we never got

 

[Vega86]

Here we go - to sooth some conspiracy theories. I just went back to Maintanence Access Corridor after restarting the Directorial Override Mission on both consoles, waited a full minute, and made screenshots. With the HUD so people can see which console at is, and without the HUD so people can see the image in full. Here it is possible to see that the texture this time I did it looks different on the PS5 version in fact. It looks like the game's texture streamer is imperfect. A whole lot of fuss over absolutely nothing. The versions are the same.
PS5:

PS5 with UI:

XSX:

XSX with UI:

PS5 renders all games in an HDR container and then applies its own tonemaps down to SDR. So all games in SDR on PS5 will look different than normal SDR as designed by the developer on PS4 or PS4 Pro.

It is something that could possibly be producing a blacked crush look in SDR displayed back compat games.

Thanks. Holy. I knew I wasn't insane. I had to crank brightness in Demons' Souls Remake, God of War and Monster Hunter World. All those games I've tested look slightly abnormal on my sdr display. In some portions, I have to reset the brightness. It's annoying but eventually, I'll just get used to it but it won't ever be the same as it's always at the back of my mind that it looks kinda off.

I rarely had to adjust brightness settings on my PS4.

I'm talking about in game brightness settings though. I don't fiddle with the display's brightness much for my primary console display (sdr only).

 

[snc]

Thanks. Holy. I knew I wasn't insane. I had to crank brightness in Demons' Souls Remake, God of War and Monster Hunter World. All those games I've tested look slightly abnormal on my sdr display. In some portions, I have to reset the brightness. It's annoying but eventually, I'll just get used to it but it won't ever be the same as it's always at the back of my mind that it looks kinda off.

many games on ps5 looks too dark (wrc9 especially)

 

[Vega86]

many games on ps5 looks too dark (wrc9 especially)

Didn't like it when crushed blacks were prevalent on xb1. I don't like it on the ps5 too.
I guess this won't be fixed unless i buy a very good hdr display?

 

[snc]

Didn't like it when crushed blacks were prevalent on xb1. I don't like it on the ps5 too.
I guess this won't be fixed unless i buy a very good hdr display?

disabling hdr in console menu helps for some games in other just adjusting brighntes or gamma in game settings helps

 

[Deleted member 11852]

disabling hdr in console menu helps for some games in other just adjusting brighntes or gamma in game settings helps

Yup, this is what I've found.

 

[PSman1700]

Seeing the video again, the XSX advantage can be as large as 36% in some (heavier) areas which is not that far off from the Hitman 3 results. Also, its spending much of its time in the 50's opposed to the PS5's 40's.
First comment on YT by Lance McDonald:

''This is fascinating. It's important to remember that when photo mode is engaged, CPU load is absolutely miniscule compared to gameplay (something I learned while debugging the game myself), so this is basically just a fantastic measurement of the differential in pure graphics hardware at play here. Really cool test.''

Couldnt put it better, comment got over a thousend likes.

Though, the game isnt really all that CPU heavy, a 3700x class CPU clears this game 75+fps no problem on pc. Yes its higher clocked but still, i do not think the CPUs limit the GPUS all that much here.

 

[snc]

Seeing the video again, the XSX advantage can be as large as 36% in some (heavier) areas

I thought corridor of doom is most gpu heavy area and difference there is 3%

 

[iroboto]

I thought corridor of doom is most gpu heavy area and difference there is 3%

IIRC 6800XT also scores the same as PS5 and XSX. So it's clear there is a weird bottleneck that is suppressing AMD cards to not be able to perform well here for whatever reason. Whatever it is, the issue isn't linear with how strong the GPU is.

 

[snc]

IIRC 6800XT also scores the same as PS5 and XSX. So it's clear there is a weird bottleneck that is suppressing AMD cards to not be able to perform well here for whatever reason. Whatever it is, the issue isn't linear with how strong the GPU is.

but on 6800xt rt has higher settings that would probably kill console performance

 

[Dictator]

but on 6800xt rt has higher settings that would probably kill console performance

Yeah this one thing that must be stressed. The XSX and PS5 are using lessened ray length settings and half the resolution.
From what I know - any single bit of increasing RT load on RDNA 2, especially by increasing ray divergence (which will happen with ray length differences), or just increasing the rays... dramatically affects performance. That is why I had Turok come on screen there to say not to compare these results to the consoles, as the PC results have framerates that are dramatically affected by much heavier RT settings.

 

[PSman1700]

but on 6800xt rt has higher settings that would probably kill console performance

DF said that 6800XT doesnt perform as it should multiple times for this game. Corridor of doom shouldnt be used as a conclusive metric, which DF didnt do either.
They calculated an average and came to 16%. The corridor of doom might drag this number down somewhat since this scene somehow limits even a 6800XT which shouldnt happen.

Intresting is that in some cases the difference can be 36%, which is quite close to hitman 3's performance differentional, besides the XSX spending much of its time in the 50s and PS5 in the 40's fps range.
Also, bandwith might play a role somewhere. The faster CPU in the XSX shouldnt play much of a role in phote mode.

Yeah this one thing that must be stressed. The XSX and PS5 are using lessened ray length settings and half the resolution.
From what I know - any single bit of increasing RT load on RDNA 2, especially by increasing ray divergence (which will happen with ray length differences), or just increasing the rays... dramatically affects performance. That is why I had Turok come on screen there to say not to compare these results to the consoles, as the PC results have framerates that are dramatically affected by much heavier RT settings.

Oh wow is RT that heavy on RDNA2.