NGGP: NextGen Garbage Pile (aka: No one reads the topics or stays on topic) *spawn*

[Cjail]

to match Sony of course, the same that sony have done, match the amount of durango
how can you be so confident that changing memory chips take a year? (I think that the whole machine will take a year) and how are you so confident that the change is not already done?

just for info, near DAE there was another person who talks with him and know the same things, included specs and xbox next real name. just go to DAE twitter profile and search for MTW, and read what's writing
the very same way of DAE

if those are hints, durango is different from the old specs

Again with SuperDae.
Kotaku has published Durnago specs based on SuperDae info and says "the specs you're about to see here are those for the final retail units that consumers will be getting their hands on." and the specs have 8GB of DDR3.
16Gb dev kit for Orbis surfaces long time ago suggesting that the 8GB of GDDR5 is not a last minute change at all.
Kotaku itself said that Orbis had 8GB at one point.

 

[Xenio]

Again with SuperDae.
Kotaku has published Durnago specs based on SuperDae info and says "the specs you're about to see here are those for the final retail units that consumers will be getting their hands on." and the specs have 8GB of DDR3.
16Gb dev kit for Orbis surfaces long time ago suggesting that the 8GB of GDDR5 is not a last minute change at all.
Kotaku itself said that Orbis had 8GB at one point.

what's you point, that you already known that orbis have 8 GB gddr5 and that was so obvious?

came on, be serious.

 

[DJ12]

I bet they wish they didn't go after superdae now, his BS is just what Microsoft need after last night.

 

[Cjail]

what's you point, that you already known that orbis have 8 GB gddr5 and that was so obvious?

came on, be serious.

I didn't say that, I said a very different thing.

Now what you suggest is that MS should/could be able to do bring GDDR5 to Durnago at the last minute "like Sony" but I just pointed out how the most logical explanation is that Sony did not made a last minute change at all.
Those Orbis 16Gb dev kits are most likely the reason why PS4 now has 8GB; no last minute change, no miracle from Sony.
As for SueprDae as a source he has run his usefulness because what Kotaku's article says is not different than what DF & VGleaks said.
SuperDae wanted attention and got it.
He has now even admitted that the E-bay auction for the Duango dev kit was just a way to get publicity; read this.

 

[Xenio]

I didn't say that, I said a very different thing.

Now what you suggest is that MS should/could be able to do bring GDDR5 to Durnago at the last minute "like Sony" but I just pointed out how the most logical explanation is that Sony did not made a last minute change at all.
Those Orbis 16Gb dev kits are most likely the reason why PS4 now has 8GB; no last minute change, no miracle from Sony.
As for SueprDae as a source he has run his usefulness because what Kotaku's article says is not different than what DF & VGleaks said.
SuperDae wanted attention and got it.
He has now even admitted that the E-bay auction for the Duango dev kit was just a way to get publicity; read this.

you do not understand, as you don't know nothing before sony official event, you don't know nothing before microsoft official event
8 GB gddr3 was rumored as multiple gpu for durango is rumored, they was both hard to be real for us, one turned to be real and for durango nobody knows, so calm down

and I ask you to be serious but you want DAE to admit its crimes?
came on!

 

[Shifty Geezer]

BHaving motion control out of the box is unnecessary. My argument is that this will only likely happen if they can do it cheap, which they can by putting sensors into the console itself.

So what's your take on the revealed PlayStation Eye, a 'sensor bar' conifguration with stereocameras about 3" apart? Sony throwing money away on an expensive and inefficient solution?

 

[dragonelite]

Sony shocked me with 8gb gddr5.
Now microsoft can shock me with a 2.5Tflops gpu

I need my halo 5 too look good.

So what's your take on the revealed PlayStation Eye, a 'sensor bar' conifguration with stereocameras about 3" apart? Sony throwing money away on an expensive and inefficient solution?

Cant they use it to simple track body movement(upperbody and head) for something like Oculus Rift.
I know that spatial tracking was missing from oculus rift.

 

[Averagejoe]

PS4 probably will have at least 1.5 gigs more to use for games.
It's a big victory for the PS4.

Do to the OS right.?

 

[Averagejoe]

But what if the 720 is $100 cheaper and most people don't see a difference in games? Is it then still a win for Sony?

That is one scenario that could play out to alto i doubt it,MS want money and the 360 still is sold on its premium format for $300.

 

[DJ12]

So what's your take on the revealed PlayStation Eye, a 'sensor bar' conifguration with stereocameras about 3" apart? Sony throwing money away on an expensive and inefficient solution?

There were comments from the pre show akin to if you want it to work it must be in every box from the start and I agree with that.

I like some move games but I could've easily avoided them all, same with Kinect. Not this time round

 

[Shifty Geezer]

There were comments from the pre show akin to if you want it to work it must be in every box from the start and I agree with that.

My comment was specifically directed at DSoup who said that an external unit would be too costly and it'd far cheaper and more intelligent for Sony to put the cameras in the base unit. As for actual discussion of the value of PlayStation Eyes (I've just renamed it to differentiate from PSEye ), I'd rather hold that in a more relevant and intelligent thread.

 

[Averagejoe]

maybe they can let sony launch first to launch durango first months of 2014, or maybe the change is already on the work because we were talking about 1,5 years old specs

since yesterday I belevied that even doubling the amount of memory is not trivial (you know, different chip, different memory controller and so on) but sony do

Highly unlikely and that would not be just 1 month difference,it would be 6 to 8 months minimum if not 1 year,remember is not just changing your hardware is also getting good yields of that hardware you just change.

You are trying to be incredibly optimistic about Durango,changing hardware is not the same as adding more ram the xbox 360 added more ram and did not stall the machine 1 year,the PS3 had a blu-ray diode shortage and held the PS3 back basically 1 year.

 

[TrungGap]

Highly unlikely and that would not be just 1 month difference,it would be 6 to 8 months minimum if not 1 year,remember is not just changing your hardware is also getting good yields of that hardware you just change.

You are trying to be incredibly optimistic about Durango,changing hardware is not the same as adding more ram the xbox 360 added more ram and did not stall the machine 1 year,the PS3 had a blu-ray diode shortage and held the PS3 back basically 1 year.

This is absolutely correct and I want to expand on this. It's about sourcing (securing) the parts for launch/manufacturing...It's not something you do on a whim. This is not something that Sony change recently. Can't exactly walk down your local stores and order up a couple of millions 8GB of GDDR5 and have the order show up at your doorstep in a week or two.

 

[DJ12]

We can infer from bkilin that a lot of the stuff we saw last night is what Ms was banking on being the difference between the two consoles.

Let's be honest Kinect is probably going to be better than PS eyes but everything else is in Sonys favour.

More power, more 'available' memory, more 'available' CPU cores more cu's.

The social integration looked great although annoying in drivetime (I assume it won't pause every 3 seconds to challenge you though)

We'd all convinced ourselves that Sony was going for the core gamer and Ms for the more social aspects with Kinect etc. but last night we learned that Sony has gone for everything, covered all bases.

There is no sticking plaster fix as Durango is a well engineered machine so sticking a faster gpu would surely require a major redesign.

 

[Averagejoe]

to match Sony of course, the same that sony have done, match the amount of durango
how can you be so confident that changing memory chips take a year? (I think that the whole machine will take a year) and how are you so confident that the change is not already done?

just for info, near DAE there was another person who talks with him and know the same things, included specs and xbox next real name. just go to DAE twitter profile and search for MTW, and read what's writing
the very same way of DAE

if those are hints, durango is different from the old specs

Sony match them because all they had to do was increase ram size,not changing ram types of adding a more powerful GPU,fact if sony did this change was because of their own dev things and not because MS had 8GB.

Easy it will take a year first because the mother board you have is not make to work with GDDR5,which is different,so not only thy would have to change the ram they would have need to change the board,basically get a new one,because those DME and ESRAM are there for a reason,because the final design was based on DDR3 and not GDDR5,you can't just take GDDR5 and slap it on a DDR3 board and move on.

Durango will not have GDDR5 without launching in mid to late 2014,1 year advantage to sony would be all over before it begins.

If Dae knew something about the durango been more powerful he would have say it,he had nothing more to lose,in fact he basically promise new info about specs on Kotaku and deliver the same specs,he did not have anything to support that other than wishful thinking.

And in fact other people close had state that the specs did not change.

 

[Averagejoe]

Not sure if people read the MS patent on the DMEs, but the DME was supposed to have corresponding unit(s) inside the memory chip(s).

I assume that in order for that to work transparently, the memory controller would also need to be customized?

An amusing question on the PS4... does anyone else wonder if the box wasn't shown because they don't know how big it needs to be yet?

Na by now probably the design is done,remember that E3 is right around the corner,if they showed the machine what would they have left to create a splash vs anything MS show,there is a reason nothing more was shown probably a strategic move.

 

[Averagejoe]

We can infer from bkilin that a lot of the stuff we saw last night is what Ms was banking on being the difference between the two consoles.

Let's be honest Kinect is probably going to be better than PS eyes but everything else is in Sonys favour.

More power, more 'available' memory, more 'available' CPU cores more cu's.

The social integration looked great although annoying in drivetime (I assume it won't pause every 3 seconds to challenge you though)

We'd all convinced ourselves that Sony was going for the core gamer and Ms for the more social aspects with Kinect etc. but last night we learned that Sony has gone for everything, covered all bases.

There is no sticking plaster fix as Durango is a well engineered machine so sticking a faster gpu would surely require a major redesign.

Exactly great post.

Now i am not saying that MS can't change their GPU and upgrade their machine,but adding ram is not the same as changing ram types and adding a more powerful GPU,it shows that MS best interest wasn't a powerful console it was to build in Kinect.

If power was the main north,i am sure they would have got a 7970m or even better GPU and use it they have the resources for it.

 

[Arwin]

We've seen extremely .. nothing aimed outside of the core gamer, if you ask me. Only Mm and Johnathan Blow's projects may appeal outside that demographic.

But that was clearly not the point here. I think more casual stuff will come later.

 

[Jubei]

They have exactly the same RAM, assuming rumors are true. It remains to be seen how much each OS uses, past experiences shed poor light on Sony for eating up too much RAM for OS though, rather than MS.

This is assuming Microsofts Durango OS was built for a core gaming console and not a version of Windows. Even their Windows RT tablets have a minimum requirement of 2 GB RAM

 

[DJ12]

Read between lines Arwin ;-)

Eyes included, social aspect central to the console, sharing videos, being able to help noobs/recieve the help of ubber gamers. These are all things core gamers couldn't give a monkeys about.