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Old 11-Jun-2011, 15:05   #26
AlNets
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It's Unicron!!!!!

I don't think I'd mind playing the majority of the game with the gamepad then swinging my arm overhead just to throw a grenade. :P The lag might make it pointless though for online MP.
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Old 11-Jun-2011, 18:00   #27
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They can't do much worse than Bungie when it comes to story - that went downhill starting from Halo 2.

They had better bring home the bacon when it comes to MP though! No complaints with Bungie there.
And they'd better not take out 4 player splitscreen either
Can't disagree with you here. Halo had a great story, the rest were head scratchers. Well, I guess Reach made some sense, if you don't try to figure out how the Covenant got those HUGE carriers into atmo without being noticed.

Reach MP is the best of the bunch though imo.
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Old 11-Jun-2011, 21:11   #28
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Old 12-Jun-2011, 01:42   #29
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However, Mass Effect I think took much influence from Halo, especially considering the plot involving a "fore-bearing" race of some kind. Mass Effect's set of civilizations just add up to more layers. But then again, that type of civilization structure was done before Halo too, with franchises like Macross.
Please read some classic scifi starting with stuff like 2001... Video games and TV/anime series have all been mostly inspired by stuff written from the '30s. Clarke, Asimov, Heinlein, Herbert, Card, and so on. And most of these tropes are updated versions of even more ancient stories anyway. So I wouldn't say that ME has been influenced by Halo, more like they've both been inspired by all the great SF novels that their younger writers have read as kids.

Not to mention the totally blatant Aliens influences in Halo, of course.
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Old 12-Jun-2011, 08:57   #30
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Please read some classic scifi starting with stuff like 2001... Video games and TV/anime series have all been mostly inspired by stuff written from the '30s. Clarke, Asimov, Heinlein, Herbert, Card, and so on. And most of these tropes are updated versions of even more ancient stories anyway. So I wouldn't say that ME has been influenced by Halo, more like they've both been inspired by all the great SF novels that their younger writers have read as kids.

Not to mention the totally blatant Aliens influences in Halo, of course.
You forgot Frank Herbert I've actually read some of his stuff (first two Dune titles, plus half the third). Out of who you mentioned, I've only read half of Starship Troopers. I think Heinlein is rolling in his grave over Paul Verhoven's Starship Troopers movie (which originally had nothing to do with the book). He would appreciate the anime version though, it actually sticks to the book decently.

Of course Halo is influenced by Ringworld for the Halo rings among many other things.

I admit, that while I enjoy sci-fi stories very much, I'm not much of a fiction reader. I much prefer non-fiction related to aviation and history (I'm on a Greek history push right now). As interesting as sci-fi stories are, I would like to see more games take after classic pieces of literature, which I think are better representations of the human condition at their time of writing. It's not to say sci-fi isn't, but it's more or less trying trying to find solutions to hypothetical issues we may encounter in the future, though many of the stories are relevant to modern and current issues (Heinlein was very strong in this regard).

It's also important to remember that there are really only two kinds of plots:

a) Protagonist goes on a journey
b) Stranger comes to town

Virtually all stories are built around those two types of stories, often messing many together to create an overall story arch with many characters going on a mission/journey and many strangers coming to town. Mass Effect and Halo begin as classic "stranger comes to town" stories, with the protagonists embarking on journeys to destroy a threat later on. Since I'm on my first full run through of Mass Effect, my friend mentioned that he likened Mass Effect to Star Wars. In many ways, it is. In many ways, it is not.

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Old 13-Jun-2011, 05:56   #31
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I wonder how they'll handle multiplayer - build on the slower gameplay of Reach with the weaker Spartan IIIs or stick with continuity and do something similar to Halo 3's gameplay with higher jump height, no health/shield split etc.

Or whether they bring back armor abilities or not - I actually would prefer if they replaced all the AAs with sprint for most of the MP game modes as the lack of AAs makes for a purer experience.

It also means everyone is on an equal footing and you don't get people unexpectedly armor locking your rocket back at you and similar.
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Old 13-Jun-2011, 11:39   #32
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However, Mass Effect I think took much influence from Halo, especially considering the plot involving a "fore-bearing" race of some kind.
You'll actually find even more similarities between Mass Effect and Star Control 3: Great forerunner race (Protheans/Precursors) left their technology behind after being annihilated by an even more acient forerunner race (Reapers/Eternal Ones). And now they're about to rise from their hiding spot and wipe out the entire galaxy. Again.
And with both Mass Effect and Star Control 3 it's now up to a human led multi-race alliance (equipped with a one of a kind spaceship) to stop them.
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Old 13-Jun-2011, 11:41   #33
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I wonder how they'll handle multiplayer - build on the slower gameplay of Reach with the weaker Spartan IIIs or stick with continuity and do something similar to Halo 3's gameplay with higher jump height, no health/shield split etc.

Or whether they bring back armor abilities or not - I actually would prefer if they replaced all the AAs with sprint for most of the MP game modes as the lack of AAs makes for a purer experience.

It also means everyone is on an equal footing and you don't get people unexpectedly armor locking your rocket back at you and similar.
to armor lock.
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Old 13-Jun-2011, 15:05   #34
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And after they fight the Forerunners in the new trilogy there's always the Precursors left to be the subject of another trilogy.

One thing I never liked was the retcon of the events of the Fall of Reach in Halo Reach - much preferred the novels version of events leading to the finding of the Halo ring.



They can't do much worse than Bungie when it comes to story - that went downhill starting from Halo 2.

They had better bring home the bacon when it comes to MP though! No complaints with Bungie there.
And they'd better not take out 4 player splitscreen either
Thank God. So happy to see myself and a circle of friends are not the only ones to hold that opinion!
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Old 13-Jun-2011, 16:12   #35
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It also means everyone is on an equal footing and you don't get people unexpectedly armor locking your rocket back at you and similar.
So drop out Rocket, sword, all power items, vehicule and also all AA, only in this case you have everybody on an equal footing.
But maybe is not to be on an equal footing who interest you, but only to not be frustrating so very different.
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Old 13-Jun-2011, 17:58   #36
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Originally Posted by (((interference))) View Post
I wonder how they'll handle multiplayer - build on the slower gameplay of Reach with the weaker Spartan IIIs or stick with continuity and do something similar to Halo 3's gameplay with higher jump height, no health/shield split etc.

Or whether they bring back armor abilities or not - I actually would prefer if they replaced all the AAs with sprint for most of the MP game modes as the lack of AAs makes for a purer experience.

It also means everyone is on an equal footing and you don't get people unexpectedly armor locking your rocket back at you and similar.
I'd prefer a combo of CE and 2's mp pacing along with keeping armor abilities as it makes the gameplay more diverse and tactical.IF AA's are back in Halo 4, make sure that certain one's aren't overpowered or else it will be abused like armor lock.Armor lock is a good idea but flawed in execution by allowing the player's shields to fully recharge which is bullcrap.I believe 343i should add destructible enviornments like you see in BC2 and BF3 because it greatly adds to the immersion and gameplay.
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Old 13-Jun-2011, 18:14   #37
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So drop out Rocket, sword, all power items, vehicule and also all AA, only in this case you have everybody on an equal footing.
But maybe is not to be on an equal footing who interest you, but only to not be frustrating so very different.
No power weapons need to stay.
It promotes map movement dynamics.
You can hold the top of sword base but you won't get the power weapons the other will get.
So you either as a team have to split up one holding top level others go after power weapons or as a team go after the power weapons or wait for the enemy team to use them against your team. If the other team fucks then yeah you deserve to win.

But i rather have 343 make sprint a part of the armor and not a AA.
It should speed up the multiplayer a bit. And no Ooh shit AA like Armor lock.
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Old 14-Jun-2011, 00:39   #38
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IGN Interview

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IGN: Can you talk about what game engine Halo 4 will use?

Spencer: 343 obviously has partnered closely with Bungie for a while. We had been working with them on Halo: Reach and map packs. We started with the code base from Halo, so it's not something we had to re-roll from the beginning. [Chief Technology Officer] David Wu and the team behind the core engine tech inside of 343 have done a lot of work. Halo has always been a unique game with huge outdoor environments but also playing indoor environments at the same time. The technology base isn't 100 percent new, but a ton of work has gone into it by 343.
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Old 14-Jun-2011, 09:14   #39
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So drop out Rocket, sword, all power items, vehicule and also all AA, only in this case you have everybody on an equal footing.
But maybe is not to be on an equal footing who interest you, but only to not be frustrating so very different.
No, you need power weapons - but they are earnt by getting to the spawn first or killing the user (or if you're lucky you'll stumble across one).

The thing with armor abilities is that it makes the game unpredictable which makes it harder to play well - for example if a guy has a rocket launcher or sniper you normally have visual/audio warning of it - however with things like armor lock you can stick a guy or be about to successfully splatter him with a vehicle only for him to lock and completely negate your advantage (got by skill) in this situation.

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I'd prefer a combo of CE and 2's mp pacing along with keeping armor abilities as it makes the gameplay more diverse and tactical.IF AA's are back in Halo 4, make sure that certain one's aren't overpowered or else it will be abused like armor lock.Armor lock is a good idea but flawed in execution by allowing the player's shields to fully recharge which is bullcrap.I believe 343i should add destructible enviornments like you see in BC2 and BF3 because it greatly adds to the immersion and gameplay.
I think they should have standard AAs that are available to all players (no class based powers) like in Crysis - so perhaps everyone can use sprint and jetpack which'd drain a common energy meter.

Armor lock is terrible mainly because it slows down the gameplay so much (especially when you have a whole team doing synchronised armor lock BS in that room on Sword Base).

As for gameplay, I think ideally it would be more like Halo 3 with faster spartans and higher jump heights than Reach and no separate health.
But they should also keep precision weapons like the DMR (at similar strength and effectiveness) as I think the DMR/BR really made Reach's MP unique - a blend of Halo 3's frenetic close combat encounters and Reach's mid range gameplay would be the best IMO.

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Interesting that they didn't start with new tech - I wonder if they're building on the 3 engine or the Reach engine (since the game might have been in development before Reach launched) - though I suppose if it ain't broke.

Actually, while I thought Reach had pretty good graphics for a shooter with the size of its environments I just got BFBC2 for 360 and I am really impressed by how huge their maps are, with the amount of foliage present, persistent smoke, 24 vs 16 players, many more vehicles and then of course the destruction.
Even the mountains in background scenery seem quite high poly compared to similar things in Reach (or maybe it's just art).

Is there anything Reach does in particular that BC2 doesn't? (besides splitscreen and saved films)

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Old 14-Jun-2011, 17:46   #40
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Interesting that they didn't start with new tech - I wonder if they're building on the 3 engine or the Reach engine (since the game might have been in development before Reach launched) - though I suppose if it ain't broke.
If 343i has been working closely with Bungie, I would think they used the Reach engine as their base, no?

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Actually, while I thought Reach had pretty good graphics for a shooter with the size of its environments I just got BFBC2 for 360 and I am really impressed by how huge their maps are, with the amount of foliage present, persistent smoke, 24 vs 16 players, many more vehicles and then of course the destruction.
Even the mountains in background scenery seem quite high poly compared to similar things in Reach (or maybe it's just art).

Is there anything Reach does in particular that BC2 doesn't? (besides splitscreen and saved films)
AI for one.
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Old 15-Jun-2011, 03:24   #41
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If 343i has been working closely with Bungie, I would think they used the Reach engine as their base, no?
That's what I'd expect - unless 343 originally started building their tech on top of the H3 engine (if Bungie didn't give them the Reach engine until the game was nearly complete or similar).
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AI for one.
True, up to 40 AI on screen - is that enough to account for the difference?
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Old 15-Jun-2011, 11:11   #42
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That's what I'd expect - unless 343 originally started building their tech on top of the H3 engine (if Bungie didn't give them the Reach engine until the game was nearly complete or similar).


True, up to 40 AI on screen - is that enough to account for the difference?
Wouldn't be surprised if microsoft planned the reach engine so that you can easily take out the graphics and physics engine and replace them. So far those 2 components make halo games feel different oke its mostly the physics engine of Halo CE that people want back.
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Old 15-Jun-2011, 14:08   #43
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No, you need power weapons - but they are earnt by getting to the spawn first or killing the user (or if you're lucky you'll stumble across one).

The thing with armor abilities is that it makes the game unpredictable which makes it harder to play well - for example if a guy has a rocket launcher or sniper you normally have visual/audio warning of it - however with things like armor lock you can stick a guy or be about to successfully splatter him with a vehicle only for him to lock and completely negate your advantage (got by skill) in this situation.

Armor lock is terrible mainly because it slows down the gameplay so much (especially when you have a whole team doing synchronised armor lock BS in that room on Sword Base).
)
Armor Lock is very simple to counter… But you don't find how so you're bashing it!
So you're only drive by your frustration to don't have the kill you think it easy.
You can find the same type of bashing for all the AA in Reach, course "It's cheating, I come to slay a guy , and it's start to run, it's so cheating!! It's slow down the gameplay, 'cause I'm don't have the kill!", Jet-pack "The guys used it are so damn cheaters, they always leave the fight, slow down the gameplay", etc…

Try to change you fight style, it's the good way more than complain for peanuts. And I'm not a high profil player in Reach, don't have time to train. And personally "Duck" Spartan are more "frustrating" than "Statue" Spartans, one can move everywhere, the other is a very easy kill. And in fight moving is the win.

@Dragonelite: Power weapons are the easy way to win, the guy who got them and use them correctly got the more kill on all the maps. But we're accept this 'cause they here from the start, and we hope we got them to be "God" one time.
Try Armor Lock is very instructive to look and heard the reaction of players, always the same in 90% case, gamers are so predictable sometime.

And to be fair, I'm use Run AA in 65%, AL 20%, Stealth 10%, And others 5%.
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Old 15-Jun-2011, 18:28   #44
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IGN: Can you talk about what game engine Halo 4 will use?

Spencer: 343 obviously has partnered closely with Bungie for a while. We had been working with them on Halo: Reach and map packs. We started with the code base from Halo, so it's not something we had to re-roll from the beginning. [Chief Technology Officer] David Wu and the team behind the core engine tech inside of 343 have done a lot of work. Halo has always been a unique game with huge outdoor environments but also playing indoor environments at the same time. The technology base isn't 100 percent new, but a ton of work has gone into it by 343.
I dont understand, he says we started with the code base from Halo...Halo 1? I dont get it.

I was kind of hoping for an all new engine for H4, but then again I think it could look pretty nice with an upgraded Reach engine. Where does Corrinne Yu fit in all this? I thought she was leading the engine team on H4, or is it next gen Halo she's on? Or she's just an underling to David Wu?

I guess I just had this image that Corrinne Yu and team was developing an all new engine for H4.
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Old 15-Jun-2011, 22:42   #45
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I dont understand, he says we started with the code base from Halo...Halo 1? I dont get it.

I was kind of hoping for an all new engine for H4, but then again I think it could look pretty nice with an upgraded Reach engine. Where does Corrinne Yu fit in all this? I thought she was leading the engine team on H4, or is it next gen Halo she's on? Or she's just an underling to David Wu?

I guess I just had this image that Corrinne Yu and team was developing an all new engine for H4.
She is still leading the team and they are developing an all new engine for it. Follow her tweets and you would see that she really wants to talk about it and the different techs that they have developed for it. That said, I am sure that some part of the engine will bear heritage and have some codebase developed along side Bungie, whether it is Halo 3 or Reach I don't think it matters much as Reach is an evolution of Halo 3's engine and they look really different. My guess would be that at the start of development, they took the engine that was ready at hand (presumably Halo 3) as a base and then tour it apart, customising it, creating new techniques and crafting it to suit their need. Also Bungie recently handed over the Reach engine to 343i and my guess would be that they would have a look at it and try to learn and incorporate anything they deem to be useful to the creation of Halo 4.

So no it is probably not a brand new, from the ground up engine but it may well have been.....i guess we will see how different it will be when it is revealed.....my guess will be at the VGAs, and I think it will look stunning.

Anyway here is a list of all the known people working at 343i: http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/343_Indus...nown_Employees. There are are probably others but these are the ones that have been linked.

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Old 29-Aug-2011, 02:01   #46
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There's also been some Halo 4 info at Halofest, apparently will be called the Reclaimer trilogy and will be released over the next 10 years (thank God, i'd hate to see annualized releases).
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/20...laimer-trilogy

Apparently, they are rethinking the Forerunner art to make it more mysterious and alien and will be focusing on the Chief's personality and his relationship with Cortana.

Some concept art in this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vAKmu...layer_embedded
Looks pretty amazing - I like the more realistic approach.
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Old 29-Aug-2011, 13:47   #47
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I'm never going to get a Halo movie, am I? Sigh...
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Old 29-Aug-2011, 15:55   #48
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Yeah... despite the flaws in Halo 2, I really appreciated the cinematic presentation of the story and the lengthy cutscenes. I hope the folks at 343 are heading towards better story-telling than Bungie, especially with all the waypoint shorts and Halo Legends stories.

I hope they quit using numerical progression in the title! >_> This isn't the Final Fantasy series.
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Old 29-Aug-2011, 16:09   #49
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Story telling and direction was very good in halo 3 I think, held back only by the animation and models :s Most scenes were delivered beatifully.
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Old 29-Aug-2011, 18:26   #50
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Yeah... despite the flaws in Halo 2, I really appreciated the cinematic presentation of the story and the lengthy cutscenes. I hope the folks at 343 are heading towards better story-telling than Bungie, especially with all the waypoint shorts and Halo Legends stories.

I hope they quit using numerical progression in the title! >_> This isn't the Final Fantasy series.
Well one advantage that 343 have is they already know they have 3 games for the story. Should work much better than developing one game and extending the story for both 2 and 3 like Bungie did.

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Story telling and direction was very good in halo 3 I think, held back only by the animation and models :s Most scenes were delivered beatifully.
Both 3 and Reach had plot holes that should have been easily avoided. Halo 3's story was fine for the most part, but I always wanted an explanation as to how Cortana knew Gravemind would follow them to the Arc. Cortana's message said there was a way to stop the flood at the arc, but the plan to blow the newly created halo ring could only work if Gravemind followed them into the arc (which he did).

So did Cortana bait Gravemind into the Arc, knowing he was aware of this message she was recording, or was it by dumb luck that he followed them in there? It's stupid little voids like this that Bungie has left for the player to fill and I don't consider that good story telling.

The plot hole in Reach is centered around the copy of Cortana that you're escorting to the Pillar of Autumn.

So yeah, I really hope 343 don't leave out such stupid plot holes.
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