[Ruskie]

Some shots from Epics presentation.Didn't know where to put it so I made new thread.



LINK

-------------

ModUpdate:

April 6 Under the Hood

[Rangers]

More shots here

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost...64&postcount=2

Not as impressive as I'd hoped. They said it was going to be as awesome as the original brumak UE3 trailer/screens were. Maybe the video will be better.

[L. Scofield]

Damn!

[Mobius1aic]

Sub-surface scattering? Didn't Crytek beat everyone to the punch with that in CryEngine2 ?

[MfA]

Screw more detailed muscled monsters (human or otherwise) in crappy looking armour.

How about they get clothing and hair right? Now that would be a step forward. Oh wait that can't be leveraged on antique consoles whereas you can just throw lod and simplified shaders at this sort of stuff to get it to run.

Even when Epic tries to model a human in a jacket the jacket still looks like GoW armour ...

[Sonic]

I could get behind this. I especially like the lighting with the picture of the cars with headlights facing us.

Regarding what MfA said with cloth and hair. The hair could use a bit of work but it isn't horrible. Clothing is still something that doesn't look quite right, I don't know if it just needs overall higher resolution in textures, or if they shaders they use just aren't doing a good job of giving it an authentic cloth look.

[Mobius1aic]

The hair in those shots (in the link) look pretty damn good.

[Cyan]

I am not a big fan of UE3 but if with the new version they fix all the problems they have to bring a smooth experience to consoles when trying to add effects like MSAA, then I want to run on the hype train too.

Some of the pics are amazing and show techniques that Crytek has been doing for some time now. Thanks for sharing. I posted the pics elsewhere but this is a more appropriate thread in the context.

[Neb]

Originally Posted by Rangers

More shots here

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost...64&postcount=2

Thats utterly impressive heavy tech going on there and it looks like CGI. The resamblance to Blade Runner is great and visuals actually close to movie to. I'll bet that requires a beast of a system to run.

[Ruskie]

Originally Posted by Nebula

Thats utterly impressive heavy tech going on there and it looks like CGI. The resamblance to Blade Runner is great and visuals actually close to movie to. I'll bet that requires a beast of a system to run.

Yap,they look very CGish.Seems like they are finally fixing some things that UE3 is infamously known for.I mean on DOF and hair by that

[MfA]

Short hair looks fine ... it's not the rendering I'm objecting too. The problem is that I was kinda expecting the "next gen" to start handling animation problems. Physical cloth and hair ...

[zed]

Wow theyve upgraded it heaps heres a shot from 2004,
A way lower polygon count.

Crysis, uncharted, killzone cant hold a candle to these 2004 images

[HollovVpo1nt]

Epic said that this demo was running on a GTX 580, and that all the licencees already have this engine, becouse when Epic update the engines they do it for all licencees.

So.. what are the odds that Batman: Arkham City will look like that? :P

[jlippo]

Originally Posted by HollovVpo1nt

Epic said that this demo was running on a 3xGTX 580, and that all the licencees already have this engine, becouse when Epic update the engines they do it for all licencees.

Fixed it for you.

[eastmen]

Originally Posted by jlippo

Fixed it for you.

actually at neogaf the yare saying it was on amd radeon hd 5x00 hardware.

[Laa-Yosh]

Originally Posted by Mobius1aic

Sub-surface scattering? Didn't Crytek beat everyone to the punch with that in CryEngine2 ?

There's been a lot of different fake solutions ever since the first UE3 release. One early ATI Rubi tech demo had it too, probably the first (where they render a lightmap into texture space and blur it repeatedly).

I wouldn't call any of these subsurface scattering though, more like translucency or fake skin shading. Even the name SSS implies that you actually scatter light within the volume, which none of the realtime fakes can actually do.

[Laa-Yosh]

This looks more like an incremental upgrade than UE4 or anything radical. They're basically adding cosmetic features:
- bokeh DOF is a new post processing filter
- better shadows probably still don't mean a full dynamic lighting system or deferred rendering, just a new shadow algorithm (suggested by use of MSAA, although it also probably means they've done some architectural changes?)
- tessellation also doesn't have much of an effect on anything larger within the renderer
- reflection and skin shader stuff are probably just the old methods utilizing new DX11 shader features


Overall I find Frostbite 2 to be far more impressive so far. Better colors and contrast, very nice lighting, those visuals are really a step above practically everything else. This one is looking like "just" more of the same.

[jlippo]

Originally Posted by eastmen

actually at neogaf the yare saying it was on amd radeon hd 5x00 hardware.

... did I miss someone on the thread?
I'm pretty sure that quote from Rein says nv hardware.

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

You've got to watch out for these hyper-featured advertising reels. We've seen it time and time again that these engines houses can put out demos with amazing features, but we never see them in games. There's too much high end hardware required to get these images alone. No one runs them in a game, let alone a game that will sell on enough lower systems to make a financially viable product. No one makes games or the high end content that is only going to be seen by a fraction of a percent of their target audience.

So while these images look great, and while the engine can produce all these features and special effects, going by past history, we may not actually see them in games.

[Rangers]

Mark said this demo was running on 3 GTX 580's. Doesn't seem impossible for next gen hardware.

Also I thought the most interesting part was this

The coolest part of all? All this technology is in Unreal licensees hands today. When Epic updates, so does everyone else. The whole gaming industry’s been sort of reluctant about a next generation of consoles, but Epic – and the rest of the tech business – have other plans.

“If the next game consoles can’t do this, well, Apple increased their iPad by nine times today,” Rein said.

Seems almost a veiled threat we will force next gen!

[AlStrong]

Originally Posted by Laa-Yosh

- better shadows probably still don't mean a full dynamic lighting system or deferred rendering, just a new shadow algorithm (suggested by use of MSAA, although it also probably means they've done some architectural changes?)

They've gone deferred shading/lighting (not clear on which implementation, but it's not your forward renderer with deferred shadowing).

[MarkoIt]

I want to see the video, but this is tech demo, while Battlefield 3 was a pre-alpha gameplay...
I agree about seeing more of an upgrade of UE3 than a new engine.. For example, cloth are still low poly.. and the face doesn't look enough realistic.
I'm pretty sure that UE4 will have its own real-time G.I solution, and i expect also far better skin shading, and higher texture resolution..
Frostbite 2 is really the first and only next-generation engine as today..

[Laa-Yosh]

Originally Posted by AlStrong

They've gone deferred shading/lighting (not clear on which implementation, but it's not your forward renderer with deferred shadowing).

Is there something more about this on the net? Sure it can be done like in KZ2, but still, even light pre-pass doesn't agree with MSAA that much... Maybe it's more like Uncharted?

[AlStrong]

Originally Posted by Laa-Yosh

Is there something more about this on the net? Sure it can be done like in KZ2, but still, even light pre-pass doesn't agree with MSAA that much... Maybe it's more like Uncharted?

Not at the moment, I don't think. Light pre-pass or mini G-buffer approaches would certainly allow them to go with more materials though. One can only imagine what their artists would do if they had gone with the uber G-Buffer.

[Laa-Yosh]

Uber G-buffer means it has stuff like rgb specular color, glossiness, maybe even anisotropy and so?
Exceptionally good shaders will probably mean something better than a phong specular model though, cook-torrance and such, and better results on the reflection channel...