[Nesh]

Originally Posted by Shifty Geezer

Probably Sony's announcement.

Probably yeah. Any idea how reliable the number is?

Whatever the number though, it looks like they underestimated demand way too much because 2 months sold out without any replenishment is a shitload of lost sales.
How could they fall off so much? Their supply is either too slow or demand is crazy

[Prophecy2k]

Originally Posted by Arwin

On a related note, I noticed yesterday that gametrailers has a dedicated show / channel for motion gaming now, covering Kinect, Move and Wii.

I know Arwin... i saw that yesterday... thought it was an interesting new direction for the site... although i kinda felt like it was a bit of a troll on the Wii. It's like now that PS and Xbox have their motion gaming solutions out on the market, "we now have the REAL motion controllers"

Still... the presenter was HOT!!! And i think she def got my attention

[Shifty Geezer]

Originally Posted by Nesh

Probably yeah. Any idea how reliable the number is?

100% accurate regards what Sony have sold to retailers, but that doesn't tell us how many have gone to consumers; a matter of some debate here! It may be Sony underestimated demand, as they really haven't given Move massive backing and have spoken of slower growth. Possibly better to under produce and ramp up, then produce excess, but I don't know the ins and outs of stock management.

[mrcorbo]

Originally Posted by Shifty Geezer

100% accurate regards what Sony have sold to retailers, but that doesn't tell us how many have gone to consumers; a matter of some debate here! It may be Sony underestimated demand, as they really haven't given Move massive backing and have spoken of slower growth. Possibly better to under produce and ramp up, then produce excess, but I don't know the ins and outs of stock management.

There's the possibility that Sony didn't have a proper handle on how it needed to prioritize shipments on a regional basis and overshipped to some areas and undershipped to others. It would explain the discrepancies I've noted between US and EU availability. It should sort itself out soon enough and it will either be completely sold out everywhere or be easier to find everywhere.

[dobwal]

I don't see why some would ultimately judge the success of these two new motion control system based on short sales goals.

Its highly doubtful that Kinect or Move, regardless how successful, will extend the onset of the next generation by themselves. If Kinect turns out to be a massive success is MS going to stay with the 360 while Sony and Nintendo churn out next gen consoles? I doubt it. Putting Sony in a similar predictament and to me it would still seem doubtful that they too would give a next gen advantage to MS or Nintendo?

I think ultimately the main purpose of releasing Move and Kinect now is drive down the cost of offering these systems as standard features next gen. Its a win-win for both companies in terms of their future tech. You end up with more mature tech at the onset of the next gen who's R&D was sponsored by sales of first gen tech sold in the previous gen as accessories while starting off the new gen with a good portion of the developer base already experienced with the technology and incorporating it into games.

Its not like if Move or Kinect fails to generate real sales beyond this holiday, Sony and/or MS will forego motion tech in their next console. I think MS is pouring more into Kinect because it is a great idea that kind of differentiate their experience and looks a step beyond what the Wii introduced, but it also required a bigger investment than what Sony did with Move. Thereby, MS needs to generate more sales to see bigger early returns on their investment as well as drive down the cost of Kinect hardware. Sony bascially took existing tech and two plastic balls and created Move. The investment costs seem to revolve more around software than hardware development. MS on the other invested by buying the hardware as well as heavily investing in the software of Kinect.

It seems to me that level of marketing and advertising surrounding the two tech has been predicated by the route the two companies took to create the two tech more than driving sales enough to be considered the most successful accessories ever. Ultimately its not how well these techs takes off as current gen accessories but how well they as standard features in next gen push the PS4 and the Xbox3 when they are in mature forms (I don't those plastic balls make it into next gen) and have full developer backing.

[upnorthsox]

Originally Posted by dobwal

I don't see why some would ultimately judge the success of these two new motion control system based on short sales goals.

Agreed.

Its highly doubtful that Kinect or Move, regardless how successful, will extend the onset of the next generation by themselves. If Kinect turns out to be a massive success is MS going to stay with the 360 while Sony and Nintendo churn out next gen consoles? I doubt it. Putting Sony in a similar predictament and to me it would still seem doubtful that they too would give a next gen advantage to MS or Nintendo?

I agree that if one goes (MS or Sony) next-gen then the other will follow. However, if is looking to extend this gen anyway (Say Sony) and the other is entice by Move/Kinect sales to extend also, then they both may sit tight. Only for year though imo.

I think ultimately the main purpose of releasing Move and Kinect now is drive down the cost of offering these systems as standard features next gen. Its a win-win for both companies in terms of their future tech. You end up with more mature tech at the onset of the next gen who's R&D was sponsored by sales of first gen tech sold in the previous gen as accessories while starting off the new gen with a good portion of the developer base already experienced with the technology and incorporating it into games.

That's certainly one reason, the other imho is the battle for tween-an-under crowd with this gen HW after they've gone next gen. Kinda like how the PS2 went after the PS3 launch.

Its not like if Move or Kinect fails to generate real sales beyond this holiday, Sony and/or MS will forego motion tech in their next console. I think MS is pouring more into Kinect because it is a great idea that kind of differentiate their experience and looks a step beyond what the Wii introduced, but it also required a bigger investment than what Sony did with Move. Thereby, MS needs to generate more sales to see bigger early returns on their investment as well as drive down the cost of Kinect hardware. Sony bascially took existing tech and two plastic balls and created Move. The investment costs seem to revolve more around software than hardware development. MS on the other invested by buying the hardware as well as heavily investing in the software of Kinect.

Sony's hoping future games will continue to drive sales, MS is afraid those games wont be forthcoming and want the sales now while it's a hot item.

It seems to me that level of marketing and advertising surrounding the two tech has been predicated by the route the two companies took to create the two tech more than driving sales enough to be considered the most successful accessories ever. Ultimately its not how well these techs takes off as current gen accessories but how well they as standard features in next gen push the PS4 and the Xbox3 when they are in mature forms (I don't those plastic balls make it into next gen) and have full developer backing.

I'd say it more the marketing nature of the two companies, neither have stepped out of their element.

[patsu]

Originally Posted by patsu

For precision drawing/scribbling/writing on Wii…
http://www.engadget.com/2010/11/15/t...or-wii-review/

They have 2 video demoes in the link.

THQ: uDraw Initial Sell-Through 'Very Significant'
http://gamasutra.com/view/news/31766...ignificant.php

Following the launch of THQ's Wii-exclusive drawing peripheral uDraw, CEO Brain Farrell said the tablet controller is living up to commercial expectations with "very significant" initial sell-through.

The exec didn't provide specific sales figures, but THQ previously forecast shipments of 1.25 to 1.3 million units of uDraw through the end of the current fiscal year, ending March 2011.

"We are working diligently to try and [beat forecasts] based on very significant sell-through we've seen in the first two weeks," said Farrell at this week's Credit Suisse Group Technology Conference.

uDraw, launched November 14, is a drawing tablet for Nintendo Wii that comes bundled with the "art-based video game" uDraw Studio, and sells for $69.99. In November, just after the device's launch, THQ saw a share price hike as investors were apparently confident in the product's marketing and sales.

...

Sony, can I have a table-top 2D drawing app for PS Move now ?

… and don't forget those image analysis apps I mentioned !

Beat Sketcher is really the tip of an iceberg.

[upnorthsox]

Originally Posted by patsu

THQ: uDraw Initial Sell-Through 'Very Significant'
http://gamasutra.com/view/news/31766...ignificant.php




Sony, can I have a table-top 2D drawing app for PS Move now ?

… and don't forget those image analysis apps I mentioned !

Beat Sketcher is really the tip of an iceberg.

Sony doesn't need it tied to Move, it can be its own Bluetooth device.

That's a great idea btw, maybe this is my million $$$ idea.

[Shifty Geezer]

Originally Posted by patsu

THQ: uDraw Initial Sell-Through 'Very Significant'
http://gamasutra.com/view/news/31766...ignificant.php

Wacom must be pissed.

[patsu]

*I* am pissed.

My virtual throat is dry after pleading for something like this + the image analysis apps for so many months.

Originally Posted by upnorthsox

Sony doesn't need it tied to Move, it can be its own Bluetooth device.

That's a great idea btw, maybe this is my million $$$ idea.

Argh, too many controllers. I know a pen is more natural, and the Wii folks don't mind yet another controller, but doing with Move may have other interesting angles.

[Shifty Geezer]

Seriously, Wacom had tablet games for a few years, and have a whole section of tablet apps for their latest Bamboo range, on a platform everyone has (PC), offering generally better computer input than a mouse in plenty of cases making it much better value than the chunky Wii tablet. Every sale of uDraw is a lost sale for Wacom.

[patsu]

Actually... scratch that. Since Sony uses standard WiFi, USB and Bluetooth interfaces, add an abstract pen input API to the Move SDK. Let the users choose whether they want to use Move, a real tablet or even iPad.

[Shifty Geezer]

That makes more sense, seeing as Wacom tablet are supported as input devices. But how do you design for it as an optional interface?

Edit: Or are you thinking of a control mapping system, where any Move game could have inputs routed through the device, so Move X,Y,Z becomes graphics tablet's x,y pos and pressure?

[patsu]

In an over-simplified sort of way... Yes !

[tuna]

I went to gamestop today, they had four Move bundles, no single move controllers and 6 navigation controllers. They also had four kinects. I also heard some people talking about Kinect.

(I live in Sweden.)

[patsu]

King Fu Live releasing today:
http://blog.us.playstation.com/2010/...ron-evolution/

[patsu]

ESRB: Ubisoft working out 'Fit in Six' exercise game for Wii and PS3:
http://www.joystiq.com/2010/12/10/es...e-for-wii-and/

According to the rating board's description, the title is a fitness game that has players doing personalized "yoga, Pilates, cardio, dance, and kickboxing exercises." That sounds an awful lot like programs inside Ubisoft's Your Shape: Fitness Evolved, but, you know, without the branding.

[patsu]

Make Hatsune Miku Move And Dance With Kinect:
http://www.siliconera.com/2010/12/14...e-with-kinect/



The skeleton tracking runs on Windows OpenNI @ 60fps and uses Kinect. This one would be very useful for Playstation Home !
(Legs don't work yet, but probably better to be computer generated to save playing space).

[2real4tv]

cnn video on Kinect
http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/tec...ras.cnn?hpt=C2

[AzBat]

Katherine Egbert at Jefferies & Co. is saying that Kinect "is on pace to be the fastest-selling device of all time."

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...ct-2010-12.DTL

Tommy McClain

[Silent_Buddha]

Originally Posted by 2real4tv

cnn video on Kinect
http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/tec...ras.cnn?hpt=C2

Haha, I like Microsoft's response. It wasn't hacked because we deliberately left the data stream unprotected so people can access it.

Always found it amusing that people were running around saying that Kinect was hacked when that was the farthest thing from the truth.

Regards,
SB

[Shifty Geezer]

We knew it wasn't hacked from day 1. That was poor reporting by the media (who'd'a thunk it...). It was just an open driver, same as EyeToy and ASIO4ALL other device drivers.

[patsu]

Originally Posted by Silent_Buddha

Always found it amusing that people were running around saying that Kinect was hacked when that was the farthest thing from the truth.

Microsoft created the perception themselves because they didn't like the idea at first:
http://www.techeye.net/software/micr...kinect-drivers

Not sure what safeguards the home-brew folks had to tear down, but MS tried to block them from creating open source drivers:

“Microsoft does not condone the modification of its products,” a Microsoft spokesperson told CNET. “With Kinect, Microsoft built in numerous hardware and software safeguards designed to reduce the chances of product tampering. Microsoft will continue to make advances in these types of safeguards and work closely with law enforcement and product safety groups to keep Kinect tamper-resistant.”

[Silent_Buddha]

That sounds like a bit of miscommunication or creative reporting as MS were clearly focused on preventing modification to Kinect itself or the Kinect to X360 interface. Even the quote by the MS spokeperson was quite clear about modifications to Kinect (one of it's products). As well to "keep it tamper resistent."

Absolutely nothing regarding the use of the data streamed from the Kinect device. So as long as the Kinect hardware isn't modified and the internal Kinect runtimes (on the device) aren't modified, they are just peachy keen.

In other words, not MS that created the perception, but apparently creative use of quotes by certain media outlets and perhaps intentional misinterpretation to increase page views as well as notoriety for Adafruit by making a mountain out of a molehill.

Or just pure miscommunication. For example, if a news outlet asked MS about it's stance towards someone "hacking" Kinect, they may have assumed some sort of modification to Kinect or internal tampering, hence the reply.

Regards,
SB

[Silent_Buddha]

Uh...

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13772_3-20...ag=mncol;posts

Heh, I wonder if this will do for Kinect what it did for VHS and DVD.

Regards,
SB