[JPT]

I am curious about the business model of supporting Burnout Paradise with continued updates vs releasing "Burnout Paradise 2", ie does new free updates create more/enough new sales (+ in game advertising) to sustain the update model?

And was the releasing of the game as a PSN download a successful thing?

From what I have been able to see/understand they earn money on 3 things:

1. Sales of copies of the game, disc and psn version.
2. Paid DLC (which has started to appear I believe)
3. In game advertising, ref reports about Obama paying $30K to advertise in game.

I know not tech questions, but questions at least

[grandmaster]

I think it's safe to say that there won't be a Burnout Paradise 2 for the foreseeable future, and the game/brand will be kept alive with DLC updates and revision packs like The Ultimate Box.

This model presumably suits Criterion, frees up development resources for the Need for Speed game they are allegedly developing and also gives EA valuable feedback on how PSN/XBL can work with their typically "non-online" properties. In short, even if for some reason Burnout is losing money, it will be more than compensated by the value of the info they gain and the mega-sales they'll get from a Criterion-made NFS.

[Cornsnake]

I'd also like to know this. I think they have been doing very well so far, and have put out a lot of DLC.

There was the Paradise Bikes pack, the recently released Cop and Robbers pack, and some individual special cars. Next week they are also going to release new DLC in the form of a new island that connects to paradise city. Complete with new cars, hidden jumps/gates, and standard races.

I've bought the PSN version, making it my first full game that's not on a disc. I thought I would prefer to have physical copies of my games, but I'm glad I gave it a try now. It's kinda nice to have it immediately available on the HDD.

I bought the game a half price and got the bikes pack which was also available at half price. I thought the bikes pack was ok for price. The special cars I think are to expensive at 10 euro each. If the new island comes at a fair price I'll probably get that too.

I wouldn't mind the keep expanding the game with DLC instead of making a sequel. Sequels to racing games are usually more of the same anyway.

I'd also like to know how big a team you need for this kind of DLC, compared to the team you need for a sequel? I imagine the team would be smaller. Which make me wonder what else they've been doing. Making Black 2 perhaps.

[grandmaster]

The bikes were free, weren't they?

[Cornsnake]

Originally Posted by grandmaster

The bikes were free, weren't they?

I bought a pack containing all 2008 DLC and the first 2009 DLC, which as far as I see is just the bikes.

Edit: I just had another look in the PSN store. The pack I bought is contains 2 online packs and the bikes and trophy support. Of these only 1 online pack can be bought separately. Maybe they are just wrongfully listing the bikes like something can buy, just like it lists the trophy support.

[-tkf-]

Originally Posted by JPT

I am curious about the business model of supporting Burnout Paradise with continued updates vs releasing "Burnout Paradise 2", ie does new free updates create more/enough new sales (+ in game advertising) to sustain the update model?

And was the releasing of the game as a PSN download a successful thing?

From what I have been able to see/understand they earn money on 3 things:

1. Sales of copies of the game, disc and psn version.
2. Paid DLC (which has started to appear I believe)
3. In game advertising, ref reports about Obama paying $30K to advertise in game.

I know not tech questions, but questions at least

My 5 cents, if you keep your product "fresh" you save money on creating the "2". DLC´s can be done with the production pipeline already in place, requires fever people. I guess some actually have a brain at Criterion and found out that putting "free" stuff out keeps the Product alive = continues sales and keeps the product fresh = more lifetime DLC´s purchases.

I wouldn´t be to surprised if there is a 2 in the works, but with the money coming in from the first there isn´t any heavy preasure on producing a fast sequel.

I would call it the best of both worlds, i love my Burnout and the support and i pay them for the DLC´s they also put out.

[Silent_Buddha]

Add to that if developing a new engine for BP2, the artists and level designers won't have much to do. DLC allows you to keep people working that would otherwise be idle/laid off.

You don't need your engine programmers for building DLCs and you don't need your artists/level designers when building a new engine.

Regards,
SB

[obonicus]

Bikes and night/day are free. I think all the 2008 DLC is free, it's from 2009 on that they started to charge. Toy cars, movie cars, the party pack, the island (not out yet).

[Grall]

I don't really see the NEED for BP 2. The game looks great, plays great, even though it's been out a good while now.

It's also the only racing game I'm able to play; I don't have to stress about finishing in the top 3 or else it's game over, as is the usual par per course in computer racing games. I can do whatever I want, whenever I want. Usually I just cruise.

[catisfit]

Originally Posted by JPT

I am curious about the business model of supporting Burnout Paradise with continued updates vs releasing "Burnout Paradise 2", ie does new free updates create more/enough new sales (+ in game advertising) to sustain the update model?

I don't know, but their update philosophy has definitely generated a lot of goodwill from gamers around the franchise, which won't harm sales of the sequel when it eventually makes an appearance.

EA have Criterion leading the line in their NFS resurrection plan. They really want industry and hardcore consumer mindsets to change like they have for FIFA, from cynical apathy to real enthusiasm and acclaim. To be fair to EA, they didn't really have to do that because they were making money on these cash cow franchises regardless, but I hope Burnout isn't lost in the process.

[standing ovation]

Criterion is probably working on the pieces to the IDE puzzle. They've got a VERY interesting multi-platform development model; and downloadable content may be a way of testing it. As new packs are added, different parts of the game engine are being rebuilt.

EA will probably use this tech to squeeze more revenue out of a project while trimming its production costs.

[grandmaster]

There is no Burnout Paradise 2 in development now, by the way.

[-tkf-]

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/te...radise-article

I guess someone got some inside information

[fearsomepirate]

Burnout makes no economic sense at all. With that many cars getting destroyed every day in the city, it's soon to go bankrupt!

[standing ovation]

Originally Posted by -tkf-

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/te...radise-article

I guess someone got some inside information

Nowadays, actually reading the source IS insider information!

[obonicus]

Originally Posted by fearsomepirate

Burnout makes no economic sense at all. With that many cars getting destroyed every day in the city, it's soon to go bankrupt!

The cars are driverless, so I assume it's Skynet crashing cars together.

[Joshua Luna]

Got this recently (thinking there was hot seat coop). Utterly shocked at the amount of DLC--maybe because I am biased, but I would have preferred a complete sequal with splitscreen.

[obonicus]

Doesn't the party dlc have hot seat coop?

[catisfit]

Originally Posted by Joshua Luna

Got this recently (thinking there was hot seat coop). Utterly shocked at the amount of DLC--maybe because I am biased, but I would have preferred a complete sequal with splitscreen.

I think we've covered the technical infeasability of splitscreen in that environment, but I'd lap up a sequel in a new city for sure. BP is still one of my favourite games of the generation.

[Billy Idol]

it would make economic sense if they make Black 2, because I would buy this game immediately

[Joshua Luna]

Originally Posted by catisfit

I think we've covered the technical infeasability of splitscreen in that environment, but I'd lap up a sequel in a new city for sure. BP is still one of my favourite games of the generation.

More like "time consuming and not a worthwhile investment with online services so common." Seeing games like PGR4 and FM3 do splitscreen doesn't bode well for the arguement that it isn't technically feasible--they would have to do what every generation does: cut down on LOD, possibly cut framerate in half. But you would find splitscreen gamers more than willing to accept 30fps splitscreen (some games, like Halo and CoD don't even do full splits!) and lower LOD/resolution.

[catisfit]

Originally Posted by Joshua Luna

More like "time consuming and not a worthwhile investment with online services so common." Seeing games like PGR4 and FM3 do splitscreen doesn't bode well for the arguement that it isn't technically feasible--they would have to do what every generation does: cut down on LOD, possibly cut framerate in half.

Well, I thought we'd covered it

PGR4/FM3/GT5P/Wipeout HD/Motorstorm Pacific Rift/you name it. All closed circuit racers and so splitscreen can be implemented as you say, by reducing trackside detail and/or halving framerate for the 60fps games in the list.

Burnout Paradise is a streaming sandbox. The technical requirements for splitscreen in this environment are completely different. You can half the framerate and lower the detail to save the costs of rendering the world twice, but you also need to have twice as much of the world in memory at the same time, and to be streaming twice as much from disc at the same time.

[Yemeth]

Without the support Burnout Paradise got from their developers (free patches etc.), I would never buy it (even though I bought it for "only" 20 CAD).

I highly doubt that late buyers is a small thing when you support your title properly.

So, IMO, the made some smart moves while supporting this games so long after the release (and with so many free patches/additions). My only mistake was not buying the editions with all the DLC in it as I have no PSN store in my country (and do not plan do circumvent it anymore with other stores as Sony should fight for getting my money and not I to spent it on them).

The thing that amazes me most is how they approach the multiplatform development, fantastic...