[Dave Baumann]

Starter for the 2009 Season thread. New defending champion, new rules and load of new stuff.

To kick thing off, a first look at the 2009 car styling:

[Bludd]

I always chuckle when I see that rear wing. It looks silly.

Who will start the season with KERS? Maybe we should have a poll.

[chavvdarrr]

who thinks that there will be more than 1 team using KERS in first start?
I'm not sure if there will be even 1 :S

[Bludd]

I am pretty sure BMW will run.

[Davros]

Is kers not mandatory ?

[Bludd]

Nope.

[infinity4]

I am sure everyone will use it if it does make the difference in races.
BMW focused solely on this last season we all know this. Now it is payback time!

[DJ12]

BMW always have the most powerful engines, I doubt KERS is going to make that much difference on it's own for them.

[tongue_of_colicab]

If they have a working KERS system that is. If rumors are true for example things at Ferrari arnt going so smooth. OTOH Honda seems to have a good one apparantly and Toyota is doing something totally different than the others (williams to btw I read, something with flywheel stuff, I didnt read much into it).

That picture is of the current Williams fitted with the front and rear wing for next year, so its not the total new car. I personally think the cars looks terrible. That rear wing is just sooo ugly and the front wing looks like a ironing board.

some more (and bigger pics)









Some explanation about the flywheel system for F1 (looks really small btw, and they say it can give 80bph for 6secs a lap which I think is pretty impressive) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PcIt...eature=related

Thing I dont understand about the new aero rules though is why they just didnt do like in the early 90's. I know I said this before, but those cars basically had everything what the FIA wants to do again only they looked about 100 times cooler than what we probably are going to end up with now looking at the Williams pic.

[infinity4]

Originally Posted by DJ12

BMW always have the most powerful engines, I doubt KERS is going to make that much difference on it's own for them.

well difference relatively to other teams is what matters.
this thing is new and they have been bragging about it as if they are going to win them their championship next year, so let's see.

[DJ12]

Their car is the weak link not power. If they haven't dramatically improved the chassis KERS is not going to turn them into genuine winners.

[tongue_of_colicab]

Well that is not totally true either. Just look at RBR and STR. Same cars but the STR just did better because they had the most powerfull engine.

I dont think BMW's chassis was really the problem, nor the engine. Probably more a aero case.

[dizietsma]

The rear wing looks high but not as high as some of the wings we had 30 odd years agon where they were about 6 feet above the cars.

If KERS is a way of trying to connect F1 cars to road cars then I think a more sucessful approach would be to get rid of these sort of wings completely. No road car will ever have a rear wing or front like that. Time to just get rid of them all together and rely on mechanical grip and engines that last 6 races and cost less. No wings and about 650bhp ? Yes I think that would lead to exciting racing with slick tyres and no electronic aids.

[chavvdarrr]

I read somewhere that according to Ross Brown, with KERS one can be 0.3sec per lap faster (due to machine is heavier with it on-board)
And on some tracks there won't be any gain...

[Bludd]

Originally Posted by dizietsma

The rear wing looks high but not as high as some of the wings we had 30 odd years agon where they were about 6 feet above the cars.

If KERS is a way of trying to connect F1 cars to road cars then I think a more sucessful approach would be to get rid of these sort of wings completely. No road car will ever have a rear wing or front like that. Time to just get rid of them all together and rely on mechanical grip and engines that last 6 races and cost less. No wings and about 650bhp ? Yes I think that would lead to exciting racing with slick tyres and no electronic aids.

But then they wouldn't be as fast going round corners. This, paired with a low weight and high power makes F1 cars unique. If you take away all the front and rear wing, you'll get the single-seat racers of the 50s. Granted, at the time those cars were fast, but now with the Pagani Zondas, Ascari A10s and Koenigseggs of the world, you'd just make a light car with no grip. Top Gear proved that to be able to corner quickly with a Koenigsegg without a rear spoiler, you need a rear spoiler.

Actually, you have a series with 650 bhp cars and no wings, it's called V8 Supercars and the cars they race are based on road cars.

Also, you can buy road cars with rear spoilers, for example the Porche 997 GT3 RS.
If you mean you can't buy say a Toyota Prius or a Ford Mondeo, or a Land Rover, with a rear spoiler, well you are of course correct.

[Bludd]

The BMWs will be the cars to watch during the next test in Jerez.

Also, some differing car designs up through the years at ITV F1.

[tongue_of_colicab]

lol there are some very ugly cars in there But those suspension mounted wings are awsome, like lets have the cars very low to the ground, get some sticks and put the wings 2 meters into the air.

[Bludd]

That car looked like it was a mobile scaffold. All it needed was a guy with some paint up there and we'd have the fastest house painter in the world.

[RobertR1]

These car look hideous. I hope they actually do allow for more passing as a justification for having these abortions out on the track.

[Bludd]

That's why the mock race between the BMWs at the next Jerez test will be so interesting.

[DJ12]

Like Heidfield will be able to give Kubica a race.

Wake me up when Massa and Raikkonen do the same (assuming Kimi still sucks, so is closer to being Massa's equal rather than far better)

[Bludd]

You don't understand. They are going to find out how the new aero bits affect the car following the other one. 2008 spec cars have really big problems following close to another car due to the so-called dirty air. The Toyotas were particularly bad to follow, according to many drivers.

[DJ12]

No you don't understand, if Kubica has to drive slow so Heidfield can keep up, it's not an accurate test, also it's not going to prove anything is Heidfield leads either as Kubica could keep up with him anyway, even in the last years car.

I might give us an indication in regard to the changes, but it's not going to prove it's made a difference as there is a massive gap in talent.

[Bludd]

I don't agree with you and I don't think it will be Kubica and Heidfeld. I think Christian Klien will be in one of the cars, but I don't know who will drive in the other car.

All they need to do is drive quickly through fast corners where downforce is important. If the following driver doesn't lose downforce, it's a good test.

[Bludd]

Get well, Mark Webber.

Webber injured in road accident

Webber has surgery on broken leg

Red Bull: Webber will be fit for Melbourne