[Richard]

Originally Posted by Arnold Beckenbauer

It looks like the shadows aren't filtered. The same crap you can see in Battlefield 2 or NFS Most Wanted on every older Radeon (because of lacking PCF support).

WRT Most Wanted, you mean when the shadows are cast across a vehicle right? Because on the ground they were properly filtered IIRC (Radeon X850).

[Arnold Beckenbauer]

Originally Posted by Richard

WRT Most Wanted, you mean when the shadows are cast across a vehicle right? Because on the ground they were properly filtered IIRC (Radeon X850).

http://www.ixbt.com/video/itogi-vide...ics-nfsmw.html
It looks unfiltered on all Radeons.

[Richard]

Originally Posted by Arnold Beckenbauer

http://www.ixbt.com/video/itogi-vide...ics-nfsmw.html
It looks unfiltered on all Radeons.

Ah okay, nevermind then, I thought you meant the MW shadows looked like the ones from BF2. For reference, I was talking about this, using one of the shots from your link: when the tree shadows are cast across the red car in the centre of the screenshot, the shadow "edges" are sharp whereas in the ground they are soft.

[Dr Evil]

Originally Posted by Arnold Beckenbauer

It looks like the shadows aren't filtered. The same crap you can see in Battlefield 2 or NFS Most Wanted on every older Radeon (because of lacking PCF support).
BF2:
http://www.abload.de/img/screen0017byf.jpg

That doesn't really look like the X360 version of Far Cry 2 though, which shadows look like they are rasterized.

[Dr Evil]

Originally Posted by grandmaster

Some Far Cry 2 action.

Shot1:
360: http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/1149/3601es6.jpg
PS3: http://img360.imageshack.us/img360/4088/ps31py7.jpg

The shadows are nasty looking, I noticed that when I played the game, I have a 100" screen currently and at that size the shadow artifacts look pretty bad. The X360 version is sharper and draws more on the screen though.

[DrJay24]

It looks like the dithering effect that we saw in GTA4.

[grandmaster]

Quincunx is incorporated in hardware in nVidia graphics chips.

Here's Street Fighter HD Remix on 360. There is something a bit odd at 1080p... almost as though the art has been vertically scaled - badly.

Shot1:
720p: http://img392.imageshack.us/img392/3794/720p000dg0.jpg
1080p: http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/5567/1080p000bz9.jpg

Shot2:
720p: http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/304/720p001hg0.jpg
1080p: http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/7285/1080p001fj0.jpg

Shot3:
720p: http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/5999/720p002zs0.jpg
1080p: http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/3112/1080p002sj6.jpg

Shot4:
720p: http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/1277/720p003ul8.jpg
1080p: http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/305/1080p003fe4.jpg

[user542745831]

Originally Posted by MazingerDUDE

just dled Super SF2 HD Remix
http://www3.telus.net/public/dhwag/SF2HD1080P.jpg
there seems to be some kind of dithering artifact going on around edge of characters at 1080P
http://www3.telus.net/public/dhwag/SF2HD720P.jpg
seems smoother at 720P, but with of course, a lot less details
could this be a bug?
PS3 version BTW

Originally Posted by grandmaster

Here's Street Fighter HD Remix on 360. There is something a bit odd at 1080p... almost as though the art has been vertically scaled - badly.
Shot1:
720p: http://img392.imageshack.us/img392/3794/720p000dg0.jpg
1080p: http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/5567/1080p000bz9.jpg
Shot2:
720p: http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/304/720p001hg0.jpg
1080p: http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/7285/1080p001fj0.jpg
Shot3:
720p: http://img184.imageshack.us/img184/5999/720p002zs0.jpg
1080p: http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/3112/1080p002sj6.jpg
Shot4:
720p: http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/1277/720p003ul8.jpg
1080p: http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/305/1080p003fe4.jpg

So the game is suffering from that at 1080p on both consoles? PS3 and Xbox 360?

And what about the black bars at the left and right side of the picture of your screenshots grandmaster? Is the game pillarboxed?

If yes, what could be the reason for that? To compensate overscan of some displays?

But why at 1080p, too then? Most 1080p displays should support 1:1 display.

Strange.

[AlStrong]

Originally Posted by grandmaster

There is something a bit odd at 1080p... almost as though the art has been vertically scaled - badly.

A poorer scaling algorithm, but at the same time, the image isn't blurred... a curious trade-off. Looking at the 720p shots closely, it seems the problems are still there, but are amplified (more noticeable) at 1080p. :s Perhaps a problem with the sprite technology they're using?

The environments appear to be fine (and even sharper than 720p upscaled to 1080p using a lanczos filter), so they're likely drawn at 1:1 pixel ratio.

[Arwin]

Strange. What's the size of the game as download?

[Arwin]

The 1080p shots from the PS3 seem to be completely different from the 360 version though - the PS3's 1080p is proper 1080p, but the 360 I don't know what's happening there, something really weird.

[grandmaster]

The 360 download is around 380-390MB by the way.

[lbartley]

Originally Posted by grandmaster

The 360 download is around 380-390MB by the way.

That's a little interesting, usually the PS3 file sizes are larger...

[Arwin]

Originally Posted by grandmaster

The 360 download is around 380-390MB by the way.

Well then it probably shouldn't be the source material/art - the PS3 is 303MB apparently.

[vanquish]

BTW Gamespot has done their annual PS3/360 graphics comparision article
http://au.gamespot.com/features/6201...opslot;title;1

The discussion is mostly non-technical (eg. comparing SCIV: "The Xbox 360, however, has superior flowers") there are a few interesting tidbits.

However in the COD5 comparision they mention that 'the Xbox 360 maintains its antialiasing advantage, which you can see in the disappearing antenna in the second set of shots' which incidentally is something I pointed out a while back.

Originally Posted by vanquish

PS3http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/383/codps3006rx4.jpg
360http://img409.imageshack.us/img409/6...d360006gi9.jpg
The boot and lower leg of the dead soldier in the foreground. This pic also seems to show that the 360 has slightly better (perhaps through implementation) AA, notice the slightly more complete tree branches, next to the burning building in the top right of the screen. Though it could be just LOD or a one off thing

As both versions use 2xMSAA, is it down to differences in sample patterns between Xenos and RSX, or is it just a quirk that occurs in certain scenes?

[grandmaster]

I'm not going to buy the PS3 version just to grab it (can't say I'm really THAT impressed with the 360 one to be honest), but the weirdo scaling method seems to be in MazingerDUDE's shots as well. Where there should be smooth lines, there are odd dimples, just as on 360.

It's as though vertical resolution is being stretched and rather then blur, they're doubling the odd line.

The pillaring is there by default by the way. I'm actually wondering if scaling down vertically will cure the sprites of their problems.

[AlStrong]

Originally Posted by grandmaster

It's as though vertical resolution is being stretched and rather then blur, they're doubling the odd line.

It may be worth noting that the oddity has a 5-5-6 regularity. (5-pixels from a pixel of the double pixel wide column to the next, 5-pixels to the next occurrence, then 6 pixels to the next, and then it starts again)

Originally Posted by grandmaster

I'm not going to buy the PS3 version just to grab it

They don't offer a demo?

I'm actually wondering if scaling down vertically will cure the sprites of their problems.

It does but... hm...

[grandmaster]

That sounds like a 'nearest neighbor' Photoshop resize technique... it means that more than 12% of the character detail has been lost.

There's no playable demo that I can see on the US PSN, and it's not available at all in the EU.

[Rotmm]

Originally Posted by grandmaster

There's no playable demo that I can see on the US PSN, and it's not available at all in the EU.

I'd wait until tomorrow, as Thursday is PSN day for demo's, movies and the like.

[Gradthrawn]

Originally Posted by Rotmm

I'd wait until tomorrow, as Thursday is PSN day for demo's, movies and the like.

Not for Thanksgiving. Update day was yesterday.

[rekator]

Originally Posted by grandmaster

That sounds like a 'nearest neighbor' Photoshop resize technique... it means that more than 12% of the character detail has been lost.

There's no playable demo that I can see on the US PSN, and it's not available at all in the EU.

So the game is not a 1080p native?
If yes, why not using the hardware scaler of the 360? Who give good results.
On PS3 I understood the need to implement a good software scaler, but in this game it's seem to not be good?
And I don't think that SF2 use all the resourcse of the PS3 so you have room for made a really good software scaler, like the DVD upscale of the PS3.

[grandmaster]

Originally Posted by rekator

So the game is not a 1080p native?
If yes, why not using the hardware scaler of the 360? Who give good results.
On PS3 I understood the need to implement a good software scaler, but in this game it's seem to not be good?
And I don't think that SF2 use all the resourcse of the PS3 so you have room for made a really good software scaler, like the DVD upscale of the PS3.

The framebuffer is 1080p. It's a 1080p game. The backgrounds are full 1:1 1080p.

However, the character sprites have every fifth or sixth line doubled. I mean, if we can spot it, I'm sure the programmers would have done do too.

I'm wondering if it's a space-saving measure.

[user542745831]

Originally Posted by grandmaster

The framebuffer is 1080p. It's a 1080p game. The backgrounds are full 1:1 1080p.

If you look at what AlStrong wrote:

Originally Posted by AlStrong

Looking at the 720p shots closely, it seems the problems are still there, but are amplified (more noticeable) at 1080p. :s Perhaps a problem with the sprite technology they're using?

The environments appear to be fine (and even sharper than 720p upscaled to 1080p using a lanczos filter), so they're likely drawn at 1:1 pixel ratio.

It sounds as if he is saying or supposing, that the backgrounds are upscaled from 720p to 1080p when in 1080p mode.

Which is correct?

Furthermore:

The game isn't really 1080p, isn't it? Or at least not 1920 x 1080p. The horizontal resolution actually should be less because of those relatively big black pillarbox bars at the left and right side of the picture, shouldn't it?

Same seems to go to 720p mode, as those relatively big black pillarbox bars at the left and right side of the picture are there, too.

Originally Posted by grandmaster

I'm wondering if it's a space-saving measure.

Could those pillarbox bars be a space saving measure, too?

Or do you think it's 'only' there to compensate overscan on some displays?

And, another question :

What exactly do you mean with space saving measure? Do you mean saving space for the actual PSN/XBLA download? Or some kind of hardware requirements saving because of 'hardware stress' or something like that?

Can't imagine the latter case, because both, PS3 and Xbox 360 should be cappable of drawing/rendering/what ever the game at full 1080p without much problems, shouldn't they?

[AlStrong]

Originally Posted by user542745831

Which is correct?

Sorry, I meant that the environments in the 1080p shots were sharper than the 720p shots scaled to 1080p using a lanczos filter, which the hardware scaler would have used by default. Even upscaling the 720p shots the same way would not have given the character aliasing issues; the 1080p shots are still clean, not blurry. And then, the fact that the environment does not exhibit the same character aliasing issues tells me something else is going on. Environments appear drawn as best as can be.

On a side note there was some neat discussion on sprite rendering on current gen consoles awhile back: http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?t=37705

[grandmaster]

When he says they're likely drawn at a 1:1 pixel ratio, I think from the grabs we can be fairly sure he's referring to 1080p, not 720p. Indeed, he's saying they're sharper than upscaled 720p.

I've no idea why the sidebars are there to be honest. The original SSF2T was 4:3 of course but I see no reason why these bars are there in an 'HD' remake. There already is a display option similar to Warhawk's for compensating for overscan so it's not there for that reason. It may well simply be that they did not want to generate more background scenery over above SSF2's original compositions, but that seems to be stretching reason a bit.

You're right about 1920x1080 of course, but 1080p - strictly speaking - refers only to the amounts of lines, not the precise horizontal and vertical resolution. You could work out the resolution simply by cropping the bars in Photoshop or whatever.