Beyond3D Forum

Dr. Ffreeze · 02-Jun-2005, 23:37

Hi All,

So there I was talking, thinking, dreamin, and I think I want to make a tank. Well, not really a tank, but a tracked vehicle. Something like a Go-Kart but more like a Go-Tank. =)

Many different options to work with like engine, tracks, steering, and suspension. No idea if it will ever get built because of costs and we have a little one on the way but I still enjoy the exercise of design.

I was kind of thinking about using two long 160" snowmobile tracks, 5HP to 10HP engine, differential, skid steering, torque converter, and double wishbone suspension. A friend was thinking more along the lines of using an old car engine with an automatic transmission for much more horsepower but I have concerns about size and weight. I would prefer to keep the frame shorter than the tracks.

It would be a sweet fun project to build and a hoot to drive. Snow, dirt, grass, and MUD! hahah

Anyone else seen something like this done? Anyone have any thoughts or ideas?

Guden Oden · 02-Jun-2005, 23:56

Aren't snowmobile tracks a bit wide to have two of in parallel? Battletanks don't have tracks THAT wide... The thing would be wider than it's long! Also, with tracks that size (and two of em) you'd need to gear a 5HP engine awfully low to be able to turn... Handling would be terrible methinks, it would snag on every rock and tree if you tried to take it out into terrain.

MasterBaiter · 03-Jun-2005, 00:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guden Oden

The thing would be wider than it's long!

Hey! You been lookin in my pants!?!

Just build a Tiger and be done with it!
Sounds like an interesting project though... I'd be inclined to suggest buying an old bug and using it as a baseline platform.

nutball · 03-Jun-2005, 00:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by MasterBaiter

[Just build a Tiger and be done with it!

Nope. Build a Panther, and paint it pink.

Have you ever seen a panther that is pink?

Quote:

Sarge: Err... yeah... we gots our tank blowed up
Captin: Ooo Kayy, teh M1 Abrams is the best tank in the world (apart from tha thing that them limey Brits have which is teh pwnz0r), so what's your excuse?
Sarge: Well, we didn't think it was a tank
Captin: Why not
Sarge: Well, it didn't look like a tank
Captin: What colour was it, dumb-fuck
Sarge: Pink

Tr4f1ka · 03-Jun-2005, 00:27

ever watched scrap-heap challenge on discovery channel? dont let the idiot hosts bother you, that show can give you many ideas! :P

and yeah, i think you should like, buy an old vw bug or something and just hardmod it to tank

Dr. Ffreeze · 03-Jun-2005, 05:41

MasterBaiter,

The next engine above a 5HP~10HP was a VW Bug engine. Small, light weight, 50HP ish stock, and plenty of after market hopup parts. Upon further research they don't have an automatic option in the early models so it doesn't look as interesting. Any thoughts on other than the auto stick for VB Bug engines?

The next engine up from that would just be some old beater car's front wheel drive engine. A stock '94 Eclipse has around 92HP, but the concern is not only the extra cost but also the extra size and weight. As Guden Oden pointed out length and width are an issue, but then again so is HP and low end torque.

/ponder

Thankx for the feed back guys.

Dr. Ffreeze · 03-Jun-2005, 06:02

Guden Oden,

They are very wide, about 15" or so but this will make for very low PSI for snow travel or mudding. It is one of my real concerns about being wider that it is long, that is one of my major concerns with double wishbone suspension as it makes the vehicle even wider. I am not really sure how much suspension it will need. I was thinking of making a scale modle using RC car shocks to see how well my suspension would work but they are about as expensive as life sized go-kart shocks.

I need a welder and not sure I am willing to spend $200 ~ $500 so maybe I do need to do some CAD work and some scale modle work to further prove out my ideals.

I am fearful that a 5HP engine will be way underpowered. I don't think it will be very safe driving it very fast with skid steer, so that will help some by being able to gear it extra low. I still think a VW Bug engive would be great but I really would like an automatic transmision. With all the low end torque of a Bug engine or better I would love to go mudding with it! =)

I also think handling would be terrible. I am not sure that is something that could be fixed at any high rate of speed. Then again I think M1 tanks go around 60MPH so maybe I just don't see how they do it and I need to research more.

_xxx_ · 03-Jun-2005, 07:38

The bug engine is good because it requires no fluid cooling. But frankly, I'd go for a hi-power go-kart and pimp that up. The easiest option, although not so elegant.

Captain Chickenpants · 03-Jun-2005, 12:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tr4f1ka

ever watched scrap-heap challenge on discovery channel? dont let the idiot hosts bother you, that show can give you many ideas! :P

and yeah, i think you should like, buy an old vw bug or something and just hardmod it to tank

Ever see the xmas special where they had three teams (British, French and American) and they had to make planes? It was bloody fantastic!

CC
-------------------------------------------
Flickr

Guden Oden · 03-Jun-2005, 12:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain Chickenpants

and they had to make planes?

How many people died when they tried to test-fly them?

{Sniping}Waste · 04-Jun-2005, 05:00

Please add a POTATO CANNON to the tank for more fun.

covermye · 04-Jun-2005, 06:43

If you build a tank from scratch, it'll have to be better than this one:

http://www.big-boys.com/articles/homemadetank.html

soylent · 04-Jun-2005, 07:57

blah, that doesn't hold a candle to the guy who was in the news a few years ago for going postal and armor plating a tractor(no hatch, sealed in), smashing up a lot of other peoples property and cars for having for percieved wrongs and killing himself.

Clashman · 04-Jun-2005, 09:06

I seem to remember a case where a guy near my hometown hijacked a real tank and was driving it crazy like all on the highway. Then he got stuck on a median and the cops came and killed him.

Guden Oden · 04-Jun-2005, 13:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by covermye

If you build a tank from scratch, it'll have to be better than this one:

GAHH. I would not have driven through that house with no armor plating on that vehicle! Looks like a perfect opportunity to impale oneself on a beam or somesuch... OMG.

Other than that, it looked pretty cool I have to say.

covermye · 04-Jun-2005, 13:59

Quote:

Other than that, it looked pretty cool I have to say.

Finally... I was worried you guys were seriously unimpressed with the machine. I thought it kicked mucho ass, regardless of whether he drove it through the house without armor.

Impressive is the acceleration and speed of that thing. Damn...

RussSchultz · 04-Jun-2005, 15:35

That was from a video: "Rednecks gone wild".

Geoff321 · 04-Jun-2005, 20:59

Trickiest part of the design would be the transmission. If you're thinking small it might be worth having two engines, one for each track. Otherwise it'd be a right mare to move. Also, 5-10hp isn't nearly enough for skid-steer. Look at maybe 25-50 (but if I were doing it, I'd get a full litre engine from say a Fiat Panda, dead cheap and reliable. A couple of them would smoke).

With two engines you could do it with a fixed first gear and a beefy centrifugal clutch. Then all you need is two throttles, and you've got yourself a control system. If you wanted you could rig up some cams and pulleys to make it single peddle for speed, and steering wheel for turning, but I can't see the point.

Sounds quite fun, but you'd better live near a scrap yard and be a good welder if you want to get it running. Also, rubber tracks are definately the way to do it. I have no idea where you'd get them from.

covermye · 04-Jun-2005, 21:03

Simpler than that: One engine, two pump hydrostat. Just like my Grasshopper lawn mower, but beefier. You then have fully independent speed control for each track on a lever. Piece of cake.

You could use salvaged hydrostats from a couple of old, junked tractors.

Geoff321 · 04-Jun-2005, 21:57

Actually, yes, thats a very good idea. Go hydrostatic.

Dr. Ffreeze · 06-Jun-2005, 05:41

covermye,

Kick ASS link! haha, that so rocks! =)

Does anyone know where I can get more info on that build. I looks a bit lager than what I had in mind.

More later but good feedback. =)

covermye · 06-Jun-2005, 18:01

Quote:

Actually, yes, thats a very good idea.

I got a million of 'em.

(Ideas... not hydrostats)

covermye · 06-Jun-2005, 18:03

Dr. Ffreeze: You're from Northern Indiana, aren't you? I thought I remembered that from way back...

If so, and you're serious about the project, I'm only about an hour South of South Bend... maybe we need to brainstorm on this...

Dr. Ffreeze · 06-Jun-2005, 18:31

covermye,

I am from Muncie, IN, but got a job way out in Boise, ID so the drive is a bit long (30hours nonstop). I am serious but not sure how much finances will be there. I think we (me and a bud I work with) can at least get the track assembly built. That should not be too expensive and require lost of design. It might even take a few revisions to get it right.

Dr. Ffreeze · 06-Jun-2005, 18:35

All,

Here are some links to a few interesting tracked vehicles..

www.litetrax.com
www.argoatv.com

02-Jun-2005, 23:37	#1
Dr. Ffreeze Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 335	So I want to build a tank... =) Hi All, So there I was talking, thinking, dreamin, and I think I want to make a tank. Well, not really a tank, but a tracked vehicle. Something like a Go-Kart but more like a Go-Tank. =) Many different options to work with like engine, tracks, steering, and suspension. No idea if it will ever get built because of costs and we have a little one on the way but I still enjoy the exercise of design. I was kind of thinking about using two long 160" snowmobile tracks, 5HP to 10HP engine, differential, skid steering, torque converter, and double wishbone suspension. A friend was thinking more along the lines of using an old car engine with an automatic transmission for much more horsepower but I have concerns about size and weight. I would prefer to keep the frame shorter than the tracks. It would be a sweet fun project to build and a hoot to drive. Snow, dirt, grass, and MUD! hahah Anyone else seen something like this done? Anyone have any thoughts or ideas?

02-Jun-2005, 23:56	#2
Guden Oden Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 6,201	Aren't snowmobile tracks a bit wide to have two of in parallel? Battletanks don't have tracks THAT wide... The thing would be wider than it's long! Also, with tracks that size (and two of em) you'd need to gear a 5HP engine awfully low to be able to turn... Handling would be terrible methinks, it would snag on every rock and tree if you tried to take it out into terrain. __________________ Top one reason why capital punishment is immoral and wrong: You can release an innocently convicted man from jail, but you cannot release an innocently convicted man from death.

03-Jun-2005, 00:27	#5
Tr4f1ka Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Croatia Posts: 14	ever watched scrap-heap challenge on discovery channel? dont let the idiot hosts bother you, that show can give you many ideas! :P and yeah, i think you should like, buy an old vw bug or something and just hardmod it to tank __________________ HARDCORE

03-Jun-2005, 07:38	#8
_xxx_ Naughty Boy! Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Stuttgart, Germany Posts: 5,008	The bug engine is good because it requires no fluid cooling. But frankly, I'd go for a hi-power go-kart and pimp that up. The easiest option, although not so elegant. __________________ I have thought some of nature's journeymen had made men, and not made them well, they imitated humanity so abominably.

04-Jun-2005, 09:06	#14
Clashman Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Minneapolis Posts: 672	I seem to remember a case where a guy near my hometown hijacked a real tank and was driving it crazy like all on the highway. Then he got stuck on a median and the cops came and killed him. __________________ "So long as people have no basis of comparison, they'll never know they're oppressed."

03-Jun-2005, 05:41	#6
Dr. Ffreeze Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 335	MasterBaiter, The next engine above a 5HP~10HP was a VW Bug engine. Small, light weight, 50HP ish stock, and plenty of after market hopup parts. Upon further research they don't have an automatic option in the early models so it doesn't look as interesting. Any thoughts on other than the auto stick for VB Bug engines? The next engine up from that would just be some old beater car's front wheel drive engine. A stock '94 Eclipse has around 92HP, but the concern is not only the extra cost but also the extra size and weight. As Guden Oden pointed out length and width are an issue, but then again so is HP and low end torque. /ponder Thankx for the feed back guys.

03-Jun-2005, 06:02	#7
Dr. Ffreeze Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 335	Guden Oden, They are very wide, about 15" or so but this will make for very low PSI for snow travel or mudding. It is one of my real concerns about being wider that it is long, that is one of my major concerns with double wishbone suspension as it makes the vehicle even wider. I am not really sure how much suspension it will need. I was thinking of making a scale modle using RC car shocks to see how well my suspension would work but they are about as expensive as life sized go-kart shocks. I need a welder and not sure I am willing to spend $200 ~ $500 so maybe I do need to do some CAD work and some scale modle work to further prove out my ideals. I am fearful that a 5HP engine will be way underpowered. I don't think it will be very safe driving it very fast with skid steer, so that will help some by being able to gear it extra low. I still think a VW Bug engive would be great but I really would like an automatic transmision. With all the low end torque of a Bug engine or better I would love to go mudding with it! =) I also think handling would be terrible. I am not sure that is something that could be fixed at any high rate of speed. Then again I think M1 tanks go around 60MPH so maybe I just don't see how they do it and I need to research more.

04-Jun-2005, 05:00	#11
{Sniping}Waste Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Garland TX Posts: 833	Please add a POTATO CANNON to the tank for more fun.

04-Jun-2005, 06:43	#12
covermye Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Monon, IN Posts: 40	If you build a tank from scratch, it'll have to be better than this one: http://www.big-boys.com/articles/homemadetank.html

04-Jun-2005, 07:57	#13
soylent Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Sweden Posts: 165	blah, that doesn't hold a candle to the guy who was in the news a few years ago for going postal and armor plating a tractor(no hatch, sealed in), smashing up a lot of other peoples property and cars for having for percieved wrongs and killing himself.

04-Jun-2005, 15:35	#17
RussSchultz Professional Malcontent Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: HTTP 404 Posts: 2,855	That was from a video: "Rednecks gone wild". __________________ Sigmatel, R.I.P. Me[X-------:--------]You

04-Jun-2005, 20:59	#18
Geoff321 Junior Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 0	Trickiest part of the design would be the transmission. If you're thinking small it might be worth having two engines, one for each track. Otherwise it'd be a right mare to move. Also, 5-10hp isn't nearly enough for skid-steer. Look at maybe 25-50 (but if I were doing it, I'd get a full litre engine from say a Fiat Panda, dead cheap and reliable. A couple of them would smoke). With two engines you could do it with a fixed first gear and a beefy centrifugal clutch. Then all you need is two throttles, and you've got yourself a control system. If you wanted you could rig up some cams and pulleys to make it single peddle for speed, and steering wheel for turning, but I can't see the point. Sounds quite fun, but you'd better live near a scrap yard and be a good welder if you want to get it running. Also, rubber tracks are definately the way to do it. I have no idea where you'd get them from.

04-Jun-2005, 21:03	#19
covermye Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Monon, IN Posts: 40	Simpler than that: One engine, two pump hydrostat. Just like my Grasshopper lawn mower, but beefier. You then have fully independent speed control for each track on a lever. Piece of cake. You could use salvaged hydrostats from a couple of old, junked tractors.

04-Jun-2005, 21:57	#20
Geoff321 Junior Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 0	Actually, yes, thats a very good idea. Go hydrostatic.

06-Jun-2005, 05:41	#21
Dr. Ffreeze Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 335	covermye, Kick ASS link! haha, that so rocks! =) Does anyone know where I can get more info on that build. I looks a bit lager than what I had in mind. More later but good feedback. =)

06-Jun-2005, 18:03	#23
covermye Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Monon, IN Posts: 40	Hey Dr. Ffreeze... Dr. Ffreeze: You're from Northern Indiana, aren't you? I thought I remembered that from way back... If so, and you're serious about the project, I'm only about an hour South of South Bend... maybe we need to brainstorm on this...

06-Jun-2005, 18:31	#24
Dr. Ffreeze Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 335	covermye, I am from Muncie, IN, but got a job way out in Boise, ID so the drive is a bit long (30hours nonstop). I am serious but not sure how much finances will be there. I think we (me and a bud I work with) can at least get the track assembly built. That should not be too expensive and require lost of design. It might even take a few revisions to get it right.

06-Jun-2005, 18:35	#25
Dr. Ffreeze Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 335	All, Here are some links to a few interesting tracked vehicles.. www.litetrax.com www.argoatv.com

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