[zurich]

You've probably all heard.. but I figured I'd start a thread about it.

Brute Force == 2003

and now, Panzer Dragoon == 2003

Ughghhgghhh... to say I'm miffed would be putting it mildly. I really dont think Blinx, MechAssault, and Kakachocho-whatever fighting game will hold the fort this Christmas.

If anything, atleast 2003 wont be dead till September (as usual).

zurich

[Ozymandis]

It does suck.

[Blade]

The good thing about it is that those games will now be more polished than they would've been.

That's just about the only upside.

[Goldni]

Yeah BF looked incredible but the framerate of the demo I saw looked sluggish so now maybe they can smooth it out. Right now actually I could use a delay or two. Never thought I'd be saying that. But there is soooo much coming out this fall and winter (especially on the GCN side) that I'm already broke from preordering.

[Teasy]

Ouch that's just weakened XBox's christmas lineup significantly. If it wasn't already behind GameCube's it is now.

[Qroach]

Ouch that's just weakened XBox's christmas lineup significantly. If it wasn't already behind GameCube's it is now.

Teasy, that was a pretty fanish comment, I don't even know why you'd bother commenting on it considering how you NEVER considered the Xbox line up for christmas to be strong or at least stronger than GC. So why do it now?

IMO it's still better than the GC lineup now that SMS is out, and there's onyl a few heavy hitters left this year. There's too many titles I'm after this Christmas. All those xbox live supported games are gonna sell like hotcakes IMO. Who knows, if the acquisition works out, perhaps Rare has something that will be released this fall.

[Ozymandis]

Originally Posted by Teasy

Ouch that's just weakened XBox's christmas lineup significantly. If it wasn't already behind GameCube's it is now.

This might shock you Teasy, but I agree. Over the rest of the year I'll be buying for Cube Mario Sunshine, Star Fox Adventures, Metroid Prime, Resident Evil Zero, and Phantasy Star Online Ep1&2. For Xbox it will be ToeJam&Earl3, Steel Battalion, and either Shenmue II or Unreal Championship.

Stupid delays. Of course, I'm getting more than 10 Ps2 games, so I'll survive

[Teasy]

Teasy, that was a pretty fanish comment

There's nothing fanish about it at all. This has weakended XBox's christmas lineup significantly and I believe this will change allot of people's opinions on which lineup is stronger (Ozy changed his mind now). If I'd wanted to be a fan-boy and annoy people I would have put a on the end or something, however I didn't because that was a genuin opinion.

I don't even know why you'd bother commenting on it considering how you NEVER considered the Xbox line up for christmas to be strong or at least stronger than GC. So why do it now?

Why do you think I said "If it wasn't already behind GameCube's it is now"? As in I thought it was worse already but some people thought it wasn't because of games like Brute Force and Panzer Dragoon.

IMO it's still better than the GC lineup now that SMS is out

I suppose its not strictly part of the Christmas lineup as it has just been released. But I think the lineup in general (not just stuff being released at Christmas) for GameCube will be allot better then XBox's by Christmas.

Who knows, if the acquisition works out, perhaps Rare has something that will be released this fall.

Rare aren't exactly quick to make there game. I doubt you'll see a finished XBox game for quite some time.

This might shock you Teasy, but I agree.

It does shock me a little bit yeah But as I said I did think this would change allot of people's minds on which lineup was stronger.

[Johnny Awesome]

I still think that:

Buffy the Vampire Slayer
Sega GT 2002
Quantum Redshift
MechAssault
Blinx
Transworld Snowboarding
Superman
Dead or Alive Xtreme Volleyball
Unreal Championship
Metal Gear Solid 2: Substance
Ghost Recon
Whacked!
Kakuto Chojin
Toejam & Earl
Shenmue 2
Splinter Cell

is better than:

Super Monkey Ball 2
Super Mario Sunshine
Starfox Adventures
Animal Crossing
Metroid Prime
Phantasy Star Online
RE Zero

and comparable to:

SOCOM
Kingdom Hearts
Sly Cooper
Tekken 4
Grandia Xtreme
GTA: Vice
Contra
Ratchet & Clank
Suikoden III
Shinobi
Tomb Raider

It doesn't really make much difference though, since most people will only be looking at 3 games anyway. All three platforms have lineups that cater well to their demographics and should sell just fine.

[Qroach]

There's nothing fanish about it at all. This has weakended XBox's christmas lineup significantly and I believe this will change allot of people's opinions on which lineup is stronger

As I said before, you have NEVER considered XBox to have a stronger lineup, while arguing constantly with anytone that thinks that. Now understand, you wouldn't even consider it. So even the thought that it "might" have had a stronger lineup now,coming from you, is nothing more than a fanish comment wuith a specific purpose IMO.

I suppose its not strictly part of the Christmas lineup as it has just been released. But I think the lineup in general (not just stuff being released at Christmas) for GameCube will be allot better then XBox's by Christmas.

I still don't agree, we should leave it at that.

Rare aren't exactly quick to make there game. I doubt you'll see a finished XBox game for quite some time.

6 years between usper mario titles? Obviously neither is Nintendo, I wonder where they get that habit from.

It does shock me a little bit yeah But as I said I did think this would change allot of people's minds on which lineup was stronger.

Looking at the list above, my mind hasn't changed at all.

[Goldni]

First of all the Cube's lineup was stronger even when BF and PD was coming out for Xbox this fall imo. Just because you can lise several games than Cube games does'nt mean a thing. I'd rather have 4 to 6 big nice quality titles for ANY system over a bunch of so so's. Hey dont flame me that' just my two cents.

EDIT: Besides to be fair the fall list should read more like this:

Xbox:
Xbox Live
Blinx
Toe Jam & Earl
Splinter Cell ( non exclusive though so ??)

Ps2:
GTA4
Star Wars Game

Gamecube:
Animal Crossing
Phantasy Star Online 1 & 2
RE0
SFA
Godzilla (my sleeper pick it'll be bigger than you think)
Star Wars Game

[Qroach]

See, that's the difference between the fans of console. Unlike some people I like to play "LOTS" of high quality titlesm which I'm getting, instead of settling for only a few.

[iscariot]

Goldni, why bother even listing a PS 2 list if youre gonna purposely leave out all it's hitters

[Dural]

Originally Posted by Goldni

First of all the Cube's lineup was stronger even when BF and PD was coming out for Xbox this fall imo. Just because you can lise several games than Cube games does'nt mean a thing. I'd rather have 4 to 6 big nice quality titles for ANY system over a bunch of so so's. Hey dont flame me that' just my two cents.

EDIT: Besides to be fair the fall list should read more like this:

Xbox:
Xbox Live
Blinx
Toe Jam & Earl
Splinter Cell ( non exclusive though so ??)

Ps2:
GTA4
Star Wars Game

Gamecube:
Animal Crossing
Phantasy Star Online 1 & 2
RE0
SFA
Godzilla (my sleeper pick it'll be bigger than you think)
Star Wars Game

There are a heck of a lot more big titles coming out fox Xbox this fall;

Sea Dogs II
MechAssault
Unreal Championship
House of the Dead III
DOAXBV
Shenmue 2
MGS2:S
Transworld Snowboarding
Steel Battalion
Kakuto Chojin(I expect this to be delayed)

[Johnny Awesome]

I didn't leave out any big exclusive PS2 titles to my knowledge. Devil May Cry 2 and The Getaway have been pushed back to 2003. Splinter Cell on Xbox is just as exclusive as Phantasy Star Online is for Gamecube and I included it because it will probably move hardware.

[Teasy]

As I said before, you have NEVER considered XBox to have a stronger lineup, while arguing constantly with anytone that thinks that. Now understand, you wouldn't even consider it. So even the thought that it "might" have had a stronger lineup now,coming from you, is nothing more than a fanish comment wuith a specific purpose IMO.

Are you not listening or what? I said "If it wasn't already behind GameCube's it is now".. meaning the XBox lineup is even more obviously worse then GameCube's then it was before. At now point did I suggest that I thought the lineup before these delays wasn't worse then GameCube's lineup, I've always thought that.

6 years between usper mario titles? Obviously neither is Nintendo, I wonder where they get that habit from.

How many other games has Nintendo released since SM64.. allot. The fact is Rare take forever making games, but in the end there games are very polished. Maybe that will change and MS will just rush them into releasing instead, would you be happy with that though?

Johnny:

I see you've imported some new games into your list in place of those delayed ones. Superman, DOA Volleyball and Transworld Snowboarding?, are you serious? Also Ghost Recon and Metal Gear Solid 2: Substance are also on PS2 and we are talking about exclusive lineup's here.

I'd also have serious reservations about calling Blinx a big title, also Buffy and Sega GT are both getting allot of average reviews and wasn't Kakuto Chojin delayed?, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt with those.

So that leaves:

Buffy the Vampire Slayer
Sega GT 2002
Quantum Redshift
MechAssault
Blinx
Unreal Championship
Whacked!
Kakuto Chojin
Toejam & Earl
Shenmue 2
Splinter Cell

Once again your GameCube list was extremely understated, here's a better list:

Super Monkey Ball 2
Super Mario Sunshine
Starfox Adventures
Animal Crossing
Metroid Prime
Phantasy Star Online
Resident Evil Zero
Die hard Vendetta
Godzilla
Golden Sun
Mario Tennis (I'm pretty sure this is still on schedule for 2002)
Evolution Worlds
Mario Party 4
Wario World

[Glonk]

Pissing contests aren't fun for anyone.

Who has the biggest list?! Ohhh, it's such an intense competition.

Who the hell cares -- why don't we wait until after Xmas before bickering about who had the better lineup.

[Qroach]

I'd also have serious reservations about calling Blinx a big title, also Buffy and Sega GT are both getting allot of average reviews and wasn't Kakuto Chojin delayed?

Ugh! This is typical. You don't call Blinx a big title because you simply don't want to (and don't bother bringing up the stuff written at Xengamers since they obviously didn't really have aclose look at the game). You say it's not a big title, and you list games like Die hard Vendetta, Godzilla, and Wario World as big GC titles? gimme a break! it really looks like you're scrambling for some titles that other platforms don't have instead of naming games that will move consoles.

Buffy got great reviews, and Sega GT is a better racing game then you'll find on the GC. Meanwhile Mario tennis doesn't have a release date yet. Evoloution worlds looks horrible for an RPG imo, I wouldn't call it a big name title at all.

[Teasy]

Ugh! This is typical. You don't call Blinx a big title because you simply don't want to (and don't bother bringing up the stuff written at Xengamers since they obviously didn't really have aclose look at the game). You say it's not a big title, and you list games like Die hard Vendetta, Godzilla, and Wario World as big GC titles? gimme a break!

I said I had serious reservations about calling Blinx a big title, but did I take it out of the list?.. no.

Buffy got great reviews, and Sega GT is a better racing game then you'll find on the GC.

I looked at quite a few places, IGN, GameSpot for instance, and Buffy seems to be getting in the low 8's all the time, not great IMO. Sega GT seems to be getting mid 8 from most sites, again not great. But once again did I take them out of the list?.. no.

Meanwhile Mario tennis doesn't have a release date yet. Evoloution worlds looks horrible for an RPG imo, I wouldn't call it a big name title at all.

Mario Tennis is still scheduled for this year.

I don't know what your complaining about, I left all of those games that I said I didn't think were big titles in the list. If all the average and unknown titles weren't in the XBox list my GameCube list would have looked a little bit different, as in it would have only had big well known titles.[/quote]

[Calibre]

I looked at quite a few places, IGN, GameSpot for instance, and Buffy seems to be getting in the low 8's all the time, not great IMO. Sega GT seems to be getting mid 8 from most sites, again not great. But once again did I take them out of the list?.. no

Teasy you are so incredibly pedantic, not to mention just outright wrong.

Buffy and SegaGT are both being heralded as great games across many review sites and more importantly, by the gamers themselves. By the way, over at Gamespot an "8.3" translates in their own terms to "great". Funny about that..

And hang on, didn't both those games rate higher than SMS's "8.0"? Does a game have to be ranked 90%+ for your holiness to even consider it worthwhile?

[Goldni]

Well I wont participate in this pissing match anymore but Sega GT is an average racing game at best. We've had alot of ppl taking it back at SE. Now Buffy is pretty decent game. We'll see how it all turns out. I think both systems will have a good Christmas. I just hope they can turn the PS2 tide some this season.

[Ozymandis]

Goldni, your Ps2 list is laughable. These are the Ps2 games I'll be getting this holiday:

Armored Core 3
Summoner 2
Gungrave
Kingdom Hearts
Tekken 4 (likely)
Duel Saga (Legaia 2)
.hack
Wild Arms 3
Shinobi
Auto Modellista (likely)
JoJo's Bizarre Adventure

No less than 11 games

[Johnny Awesome]

The real contest is going to boil down to:

PS2:

GTA: Vice
Tomb Raider
Sly Cooper

Xbox:

Blinx
Splinter Cell
Unreal Championship

Gamecube:

Metroid Prime
Super Mario Sunshine
Resident Evil Zero

On that score, I think that all three platforms are pretty solid, but I give the edge to the PS2. The Xbox has a strong multi-player lineup though and Nintendo has their bases covered.

Marketing is going to make a big difference this year.

[iscariot]

well I wouldnt dismis RedFaction 2 either. The first one sold almost half a million and the sequal has been showing improvements in every area imaginable. It will be the system's token FPS this autumn.

And even tho Sly will most likely be the best platformer of the year, I don't think it will sell all that well. $ony seems to be concentrating on marketing R&C much more heavily

[Teasy]

Teasy you are so incredibly pedantic, not to mention just outright wrong.

Err, what's pedantic about mentioning some review scores I happened to see for a game? I remember a few people in this forum saying they were disapointed with the scores Sega GT was getting, and buffy has gotten low 8 to mid 7 scores on nost sites I've seen.

Buffy and SegaGT are both being heralded as great games across many review sites and more importantly, by the gamers themselves.

Really?, Buffy's average review rating is 79%. Sega GT's average review rating is 83%. And since you like to compare that one bad Mario Sunshine score to these games SMS's average review score is 93%.

And hang on, didn't both those games rate higher than SMS's "8.0"?

Heh, yeah there's a difference between a couple of sites on the whole of the net giving a game a lowish score and most sites giving it a lowish score.

At the end of the day I left both of those games on the list, I just said that I didn't think they were exactly big games that's all, its not big deal.