[peh]

Hello All,
As a long time reader and first time poster, I'd first like to thank the members of this forum for contributing to, in my estimation, the most informed and balanced 3D hardware/software info destination anywhere.

Given the above, I felt that this would be the best place to ask the following:

I am currently riding my computer into the ground, attempting to squeeze a few last months of gaming out of it until I purchase a new one. As I plan to upgrade sometime in late fall, and given the impending or recent release of many PS2.0 games, I feel that a video card upgrade will ease my computer more gently into retirement as a web/photoshop only machine.

My current specs are: (yes I cry... constantly)
Pentium 4 1.5 gHz
512 mb RAM
GeForce 4 Ti 4600 128 mb
300 W PS

A few notes:
I have generally tended to upgrade every 2 generations, buying the fastest card available on its debut so as to stave off the effects of obsolescence as best as possible.

While I will spare you my upgrade history, suffice it to say that I was quite the nVidia fanboy after the demise of 3dfx. This of course until the R300 > NV30 repeated trouncing and PR manipulation by nVidia (which isn't to say that this didn’t occur before the NV30, or that ATi doesn't do it too, but this was something of a watershed moment for me).

I have thus hesitated to upgrade, hoping the nVidia would regain its "crown". I won't argue either side as far as this generation is concerned, but I have a relatively small powersupply, many powered peripherals and no extra room in my case for a 1.9999 slot solution (j/k). Also, ATi's "adaptive" filtering algorithm doesn't bother me all that much, as I'll probably need as much GPU horsepower as possible given my processor limitations.

My Question (FINALLY):
Would the performance delta between an X800XT and an X800Pro be large enough in light of my CPU limitations to warrant the extra $100? While I can afford to buy an XT, it seems silly to do so if I will only receive single digit percentage increases in framerate.

Also keep in mind that this card will not be transferred to my new computer when I purchase it, so the it does not have to be a "forward thinking" purchase (another argument against NV40).

Thanks for your help and sorry for the novella,

peh

[jvd]

why ? thats all i have to ask

both the x800pro and x800xt are way over kill for that system . You will not be able to see any performance diffrences .

i believe your best off just getting a 9600pro for a 100$ or so mabye a 9800pro for 200$

If your not going to upgrade for a few more months you'll most likely be moving to pci-e motherboard none of which the x800pro or x800xt works on

[peh]

I was hoping you wouldnt say that...

Thanks for the input though. Your dire predictions may motivate me to accelerate my timeline somewhat.

And goto bed jvd!

Thanks again

[PowerK]

Originally Posted by jvd

both the x800pro and x800xt are way over kill for that system . You will not be able to see any performance diffrences .

You maybe right.

But it also depends on resolution as well as settings he plays games at. At 1600x1200 (and higher), CPU doesn't make any differences. As long as he has modern mainstream CPU. (2 GHz and upwards). Almost every benchmark proves this.

I mean no one buys the top of the line graphic cards to play games at low resolutions like 640x480 ~ 1024x768. The most important benefit they provide is the ability (horsepower) to play games at high resolution with AF + AA. At those settings CPU hardly makes any differences.

But the thing is that his CPU is 1.5 GHz which is really old, and it very likely bottlenecks X800 series even at 1600x1200....

[Tahir2]

I bet it uses SDRAM too..

[rainz]

Originally Posted by peh

Also keep in mind that this card will not be transferred to my new computer when I purchase it, so the it does not have to be a "forward thinking" purchase (another argument against NV40).

WHY ? and WHY ? You are too rich for that ? Takes too long ? Too lazy ? i dont get it .. You were ready to buy a X800 Pro now and a X800 XT with the new comp and throw the old X800 Pro in the garbage ?

RainZ

[MasterBaiter]

Save your money and just get a new motherboard, mem, processor, and video card. You'd be wasting it any other way. If you don't upgrade.... do what JVD said. :?

[jvd]

for 400$ or under you can get a athlon xp 2500 , nforce 2 mobo , 512 megs of ram and a 9600pro .


Would get much better perfromance than getting an x800xt and putting it in.

[Quitch]

I concur, a graphics boost is the last thing you need. Frankly, you've fallen far enough behind that it's time to start considering a new system.

[peh]

Originally Posted by rainz

WHY ? and WHY ? You are too rich for that ? Takes too long ? Too lazy ? i dont get it .. You were ready to buy a X800 Pro now and a X800 XT with the new comp and throw the old X800 Pro in the garbage ?

RainZ

Well I'd likely buy a PCI-E mobo for my new comp, and I don't plan on scrapping this comp in any way, just want to be able to play Farcry etc. on it for 4 months or so, then move more performance hungry apps to a newer comp.

I'm running Rambus, but that's a headache compared to DDR. Also first run P4's have half the cache that later ones do, plus I'm relegated to 400Mhz FSB. So yes... this computer is very much on its last legs.

Thanks for the input guys, looks like ill spring for a 9800 on sale or something, then throw the extra cash I've been saving at really decking out my next pc.

[Quitch]

By then the 64-bit version of Windows might be out and you can get a proper upgrade, PCI-Express, 64-bit, BTX...

It's going to be a good time to replace the system soon.

[kyleb]

Originally Posted by jvd

for 400$ or under you can get a athlon xp 2500 , nforce 2 mobo , 512 megs of ram and a 9600pro.

make it 500$ and you have enough to spring for a 9800pro and a good powersupply to go with it.

[Mendel]

I would also suggest you buy a new system. GPU purchase now would be nice if you moved it to your new system later but since that is not the case, go for new cpu+mobo+memory+gpu+power supply.

Well, I have my own upgrade question too, didn't think it would be worth own thread so posted here.

I'm wondering which way I should go from here:

I have a p4c 3GHz, which is ok for the moment I guess, but I also have an asus p4s800 which doesn't allow me to use hyper threading (crashes)
It also has only single channel memory interface and whats the worst... wither the memory is failing or its the motherboard again but using my ddr400 speced memory as anything higher than ddr333 results in reboots. It's not my power supply because I have a nice 400W power supply and I have already changed it 3 times and problem stays.

When run in non hyperthreading, ddr333 single channel mode the system is however perfectly stable.

My current videocard is radeon 9700 nonpro flashed as pro and now finally again even clocked as pro since i just added a card slot cooler (that works even better than i thought and even keeps my hard drives cooler for some reason)

Now my upgrade route possibilities probably are something like:

1 upgrading motherboard, should be quite cheap, for around 100 euros maybe, i would get double channel memory, provided my memory chips are ok and the fault causing reboots was indeed with motherboard. This involves however quite a bit of work, formatting my 300 gig of total hard drive space and reinstalling os etc.

2. upgrading video card. Should be major investment for about 400 euros or so maybe. I just bought a frigging car for 200 euros and I considered that a major investment! Come on, a ton of metal with complex engine and stuff is cheaper than few hundred grams of video card equipment... oh well... Anyways. Im running out of fillrate in Painkiller and shader processing power in far cry. I also fear for half life 2 and doom3 experience would be severely pixellated if I would not upgrade soon...

3. Waiting and going for major system change.

Maybe if I could somehow resist the temptation and wait for like a year and then jump to the AMD64 bandwagon. By that time I would probably get enough of a processor speed bump and just maybe possibly could also get a dual pcie motherboard for it and get dual nv48, r500 or whatever will be fastest at that time.

4. Get a playstation 2

Already got gamecube and xbox, but...well, what can I say... I *NEED* transformers and r type final.


Which route should I go?

[jvd]

first off transformers sucked and i'm a big die hard fan .

Second of all get a new mobo with good overclocking features .

YOu should be able to get the 3.0c up to 3.5-3.6 provided your memory makes it that high.

That should basicly max out your 9700pro

You could even look into a vga silencer (can get as cheap as 8 but normaly 15$) and might be able to get more out of the 9700pro.

That should let u play doom 3 and half life 2 for a good amount while only spending a 100$ ish on the upgrade.

save up your money

when btx comes out then make the full system upgrade.


not much sense in doing a big update if a new standard is coming out .

My friend got me a a64 3000+ which in my friends system is doing 2.6 ghz and that should keep me going for a long time with my x800xt .

I wont make the jump again till dual core athlon 64s are out in about a year and a half or so and then make another full system upgrade when a dx 10 card comes out .


right now pci-e wont give you a boost , so there is no point in it . Not when u need a new chip , ram , gpu .

[Nappe1]

Mendel: if it makes any difference, I am about to upgrade too. system right now is:
- 4 years old IEWIN case with a bit newer 300W PSU
- MSI K7T Turbo (KT133A chipset)
- 512MB PC-133 SDRAM
- Palomino Athlon XP1700+
- Philips Seismic Edge.
- Radeon 9700nonpro (the wierdo edition with stock clocks: 300 MHz core / 267 MHz memory)

and what I have already ordered:
- ASUS A7V880 (or MSI KT880 Delta depeding which one will be available sooner.) (KT880 chipset)
- 512 MB of DDR400 memory (2 x 256MB Kingston. YAY DDR! Here I come! )
- Athlon XP2600+
- new CompuCase with 375W Silent PSU.

I am not going to change my GFX card and I am expecting a bit more than few fps jump at least on CPU dependent games. the reason for the upgrade? well, the old computer has started not to boot as cold in the first try. It used to work fine but in this and last week it has had a problems in cold boot.

[Mendel]

Originally Posted by Nappe1

Well, the old computer has started not to boot as cold in the first try. It used to work fine but in this and last week it has had a problems in cold boot.

Hmm, a bit odd reason for a full system upgrade but whatever, it's not like you wouldn't benefit from it anyways.

Funnily I had some such problems too recently but for whatever reason, reorganizing my hard drives (physically inside the case) helped.

Finally I don't think it helps much anymore since you already ordered but 512 really isn't enough. I guess I'll pm you about it more in our native language

edit: oh and jvd... any particular motherboard/chipset that you would recommend?

[Quitch]

Originally Posted by Mendel

Hmm, a bit odd reason for a full system upgrade but whatever, it's not like you wouldn't benefit from it anyways.[

Oh hush, it's not a reason, it's an excuse