[liolio]

I read article earlier this year about how scientists were loosing hope for its discovery, but they finally got it it seems

They gonna have a big higgs bosom party at the CERN and it seems to attract champagne bottles as a magnet too. Such an awesome particle lol

[pjbliverpool]

Great news! This is a big day for science.

[Alexko]

Originally Posted by liolio

They gonna have a big higgs bosom party

Now I don't know who this Higgs lady is, but that sounds like my kind of party.

[Dr Evil]

but seriously can someone give a summary or a good link to one?

[Davros]

Originally Posted by Dr Evil

but seriously can someone give a summary

Yes!!!

For people you're trying to impress:
"The Higgs boson is an elementary scalar particle first posited in 1962, as a potential byproduct of the mechanism by which a hypothetical, ubiquitous quantum field – the so-called Higgs field – gives mass to elementary particles. More specifically, in the standard model of particle physics, the existence of the Higgs boson explains how spontaneous breaking of electroweak symmetry takes place in nature."

For harassed, sleep-deprived parents:
"If the constituent parts of matter were sticky-faced toddlers, then the Higgs field would be like one of those ball pits they have in the children's play area at IKEA. Each coloured plastic ball represents a Higgs boson: collectively they provide the essential drag that stops your toddler/electron falling to the bottom of the universe, where all the snakes and hypodermic needles are."

For English undergraduates:
"The Higgs boson (pronounced "boatswain") is a type of subatomic punctuation with a weight somewhere between a tiny semicolon and an invisible comma. Without it the universe would be a meaningless cloud of gibberish – a bit like The Da Vinci Code, if you read that."

For teenagers studying A-level physics:
"No, I know it's not an atom. I didn't say it was. Well, I meant a particle. Yes, I do know what electromagnetism is, thank you very much – unified forces, Einstein, blah blah blah, mass unaccounted for, yadda yadda, quarks, Higgs boson, the end. It was a long time ago, and I'm tired. Change the channel – we're missing Come Dine With Me."

For a member of the Taxpayers' Alliance:
"Its discovery is a colossal, unprecedented, almost infinite waste of money."

For a child in the back seat of a car:
"It's a particle that some scientists have been looking for. Because they knew that without it the universe would be impossible. Because without it, the other particles in the universe wouldn't have mass. Because they would all continue to travel at the speed of light, just like photons do. Because I just said they would, and if you ask 'Why?' one more time we're not stopping at Burger King."

For religious fundamentalists:
"There is no Higgs boson."

[UniversalTruth]

Originally Posted by Davros

For a member of the Taxpayers' Alliance:
"Its discovery is a colossal, unprecedented, almost infinite waste of money."

Unless the given discovery changes the world to a better place* for all humans, then it is simply meaningless.

*for a better happy life experience.

Originally Posted by Mize

See! Science proved that God exists. 'nuff siad.

[Mize]

See! Science proved that God exists. 'nuff siad.

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

Originally Posted by Mize

See! Science proved that God exists. 'nuff siad.

From Wikipedia:

The Higgs boson is often referred to as the "God particle" by the media, after the title of Leon Lederman's popular science book on particle physics, The God Particle: If the Universe Is the Answer, What Is the Question? While use of this term may have contributed to increased media interest, many scientists dislike it, since it overstates the particle's importance, not least since its discovery would still leave unanswered questions about the unification of quantum chromodynamics, the electroweak interaction, and gravity, as well as the ultimate origin of the universe. Higgs is an atheist, and is displeased that the Higgs particle is nicknamed the "God particle", because the term "might offend people who are religious".

Lederman said he gave it the nickname "The God Particle" because the particle is "so central to the state of physics today, so crucial to our understanding of the structure of matter, yet so elusive,"but jokingly added that a second reason was because "the publisher wouldn't let us call it the Goddamn Particle, though that might be a more appropriate title, given its villainous nature and the expense it is causing."

[pjbliverpool]

Originally Posted by UniversalTruth

Unless the given discovery changes the world to a better place* for all humans, then it is simply meaningless.

How can knowledge about the true nature of existence ever be meaningless? Its why billions of people believe those made up stories about creation called religions. What we are learning here is actually the real story. Even if it has no practical uses (which seems highly unlikey - the electron says hello) then the knowledge alone is of huge value imo. I'd have thought someone called Universal Truth would have been more sympathetic to that idea

[Davros]

ps: simplified explanation
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-18712914

[UniversalTruth]

Originally Posted by pjbliverpool

How can knowledge about the true nature of existence ever be meaningless?

Does it answer the question "Why?", "What is the reason of this existence?" ?
A meaningful and very precious discovery would be if all people are given access to free energy so they no longer torture themselves with paying enormous ridiculous amounts of money like true slaves.
Can you imagine how many millions of people have nothing to eat, while you, the americans put so much food in the trash? Or spending billions of dollars on very doubtful initiatives?

http://www.alienscientist.com/forum/...nergy-physics&

Originally Posted by pjbliverpool

Its why billions of people believe those made up stories about creation called religions.

The true story can be read in many books, you don't have to wait for such boring "discoveries".

Originally Posted by pjbliverpool

Even if it has no practical uses (which seems highly unlikey - the electron says hello) then the knowledge alone is of huge value imo.

We are yet to see it but when- we don't know.

Originally Posted by pjbliverpool

I'd have thought someone called Universal Truth would have been more sympathetic to that idea

No comment on this one. Too personal and I always wonder why you tend to pay so much attention on this.

[itsmydamnation]

Originally Posted by UniversalTruth

Can you imagine how many millions of people have nothing to eat, while you, the americans put so much food in the trash? Or spending billions of dollars on very doubtful initiatives?

those people could always drag themselves out of the stone age like everyone else did, they seem to rather kill each other and play lord of the flies. reality is without many of the technologies developed by the first world the third world would have it far worse (see the Asian green revolution etc).

given that our ability to do anything is governed by physic's any increase in understand is a benefit.

[Gubbi]

Originally Posted by UniversalTruth

Does it answer the question "Why?"

Ask a foolish question. - Robert Sheckley's finest.

Originally Posted by UniversalTruth

"What is the reason of this existence?" ?

You mean you don't know ?

Cheers

[pjbliverpool]

Originally Posted by UniversalTruth

Does it answer the question "Why?", "What is the reason of this existence?" ?

No, but it tells us more about the nature of existence, which is one step closer to understanding the reason for existence. You can't just jump from step one to step 10, you have to pass the intermediate steps first.

A meaningful and very precious discovery would be if all people are given access to free energy so they no longer torture themselves with paying enormous ridiculous amounts of money like true slaves.

How o you think such discoveries (which would almost certainly lie in the field of physics) can be made without a better understanding of physics? Aliens aren't going to come down and hand this knowledge to us on a plate, we nee to learn if for ourselves. Who's to say that a better understanding of the Higgs won't lead to a free energy source? Or if not the Higgs itself then the discoveries that follow on from it that could never have been made without first understanding the Higgs?

Can you imagine how many millions of people have nothing to eat, while you, the americans put so much food in the trash? Or spending billions of dollars on very doubtful initiatives?

I'm not actually Amercian, but can you imagine if other "questionable initiatives" had been cancelled due to the cost in the past? There are probably hundreds of examples but the hunt for the electron is one of the best so I'll use it again. What would have happened if humanity gave up that hunt because it was a waste of resources with no (at the time) obvious benefit to mankind?

The true story can be read in many books, you don't have to wait for such boring "discoveries".

Don't follow you sorry.

[Dooby]

Originally Posted by UniversalTruth

the whole post

I'm left hoping you're trolling.

Are you just expecting to discover everything by accident? Free energy for everyone! Fantastic. Yet without doing *some* directed research into areas of energy production/manipulation, how do you expect this to occur?

Penicillin is probably the best known example of accidental discovery but there aren't many this serendipitous. You mention food (for some unknown reason other than to "prove" a tangential point in this thread about a particle) so lets carry that on. Lots of food is preserved all around the world by irradiating it. The discovery that lead to this was an experiment dealing with electrostatic charge in a vacuum (which itself was fairly undocumented at the time), when X-rays were found. Further work into this field revealed other forms of radiation, all of which are used in some form even in our homes now. Food and medicines wouldn't even be available to those who have them now if it hadn't have been for accidental but DIRECTED investigations.

Long story short: It's not up to you, me or even the guys working on "whatever", to decide what should be worked on. I want people working on as much stuff as possible. If you think that stopping an "expensive" (which is bollox) experiment like CERN would help starving people, you're just flat out wrong.

What needs to happen is *MORE* money given to any and all projects like this. *THEN* you may get your wish of unlimited energy, though I thinking hoping for "free" is another fairytale ending.

[Davros]

Originally Posted by Dooby

ILots of food is preserved all around the world by irradiating it.

and lets not forget that everyone who grows their own food must by law take it to their local irradiation center

[digitalwanderer]

[digitalwanderer]

Originally Posted by UniversalTruth

The true story can be read in many books, you don't have to wait for such boring "discoveries".

Could you list a few of these books? I'm very confused by your statement.

[Chalnoth]

Originally Posted by Dr Evil

but seriously can someone give a summary or a good link to one?

Well, the Higgs Boson is the final undetected piece of the Standard Model of Quantum Mechanics.

The Standard Model describes what we believe to be the basic building blocks of the universe (quarks, electrons, photons, gluons, and some other particles...but not dark matter!). But one problem with this theory is that the mathematics becomes nonsensical the moment you try to give a particle mass. That seems like a rather odd feature: nearly everything we are familiar with has mass, so how can this theory possibly be correct if nothing is allowed to have mass?

The solution within the Standard Model is to say that the masses of particles arise out of an interaction. And this interaction requires the existence of a particle, dubbed the Higgs Boson, after the scientist who pointed out the need for such a particle back in 1964. Until now, this particle had yet to be detected.

So the detection of the Higgs is a pretty big deal, as it is the last piece of an otherwise exceedingly successful theoretical model of quantum mechanics. Perhaps even more exciting is that there is some hint that the Higgs detected at the LHC may not be exactly a standard model Higgs: one of the decay rates seems a bit off. But we don't yet have the statistics to definitively say it's a bit different, but if it is different, then this particle may finally be a hint as to where we can start looking for the next theory beyond the standard model.

For there has to be a theory beyond the standard model, as there are aspects of the universe that the standard model doesn't adequately describe, such as why there was more matter than anti-matter, or what dark matter is, because dark matter certainly isn't made of anything in the standard model. Plus, the standard model just doesn't play nicely with gravity, and we are as yet unsure how to reconcile gravity with the standard model. So any new experimental deviation from the standard model is exciting in that it may give us hints as to which direction we should turn for a deeper understanding of the universe.

But as of yet we just can't be sure the Higgs detected at the LHC is simply the expected standard model Higgs, or something a bit different.