[Dooby]

*spawn* from Borderlands 2 thread.

Originally Posted by I.S.T.

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2012...crolls-online/

How I felt reading his responses:

"Say 'absolutely' again. Say 'absolutely' again, I dare you, I double dare you motherf****r, say 'absolutely' one more Goddamn time!"

He didn't convince me in the slightest.

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

Yeah, you can ask all the "hard questions" you like, but it's meaningless if you let the interviewee dodge, spin, and weasel his way out of the truthful answer he's trying to avoid.

[Richard]

Originally Posted by Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.

Yeah, you can ask all the "hard questions" you like, but it's meaningless if you let the interviewee dodge, spin, and weasel his way out of the truthful answer he's trying to avoid.

But don't their dodges ultimately answer the questions?

[homerdog]

I think, they are steering the company from almost certain success with the way they have been doing things to almost certain failure in trying to compete with WoW. They must be honest with themselves, because if this is Just Another MMO then the Elder Scrolls license won't float it for long and it is destined to fail like all others have. Hell Star Wars couldn't even save TOR.

[Grall]

MMOs have been seen by greedy misinformed company execs as some kind of moneypie they would love to just guzzle down, and that's why we've seen so many half-assed attempts at competing with Blizzard over the years. Unfortunately, it's not that simple... MMOs with a monthly subscription is an incredibly tricky proposition, I think everybody should be amazed off planet earth entirely that WoW managed to hold onto up to 12 million customers for years.

If your MMO isn't as polished, with content as deep and diverse as WoW's (not saying it's neccessarily all that deep - just speaking in relative terms here) then people will start to feel cheated pretty quick. They keep paying over and over every month for a game that doesn't feel finished, so they'll tire, drop the subscription and the game will start to sink.

EA/Bioware must be feeling this trend pretty harshly to turn around so quickly and announce plans for F2P in record time for a new MMO. It's not even been out for six months has it?

[hughJ]

It's pretty telling from the interviews that guy has given that the game really doesn't possess any qualities worth getting excited about. You would think that if you were genuinely proud or excited about a product of yours, you'd be just gushing about how great X, Y, and Z are and how they've never been done before, or never been done as well.

It's *not* enough to look at your IP as your big selling point. If the first words out of your mouth when you're given an opportunity to brag about your game is to spend most of it talking about the "lore" and game world and how it's related to past Elder Scrolls successes, then you've already lost. IP is only worth a small amount in getting people to pick the game up off the shelves, and about zero to do with keeping them past the first month of subscription. Look at the shining example of WoW. WoW's success has nothing to do with the IP. Essentially zero. What percentage of WoW's past and present player base do they think had actually played any of the Warcrafts, or knew anything at all about the back story? 5%, if that?

[Grall]

Isn't it too soon for Bethy to reveal all the awesome stuff their MMO can do...? When's this thing supposed to come out anyway?

Usually, you'd want to keep the precise details of your gameplay under wraps until comfortably close to release, so that you don't spoil all your secrets and are able to keep the speculation-hype-machine rolling for as long as possible under its own steam. Once you start feeding that fire with actual, bona fide details about your game, then you can't keep the pressure up should you run out of fuel. So it's advantageous to not blow everything too quickly, or you'll risk doing a software equivalence of Osborne Computer Corporation...

[swaaye]

Originally Posted by Grall

Usually, you'd want to keep the precise details of your gameplay under wraps until comfortably close to release, so that you don't spoil all your secrets and are able to keep the speculation-hype-machine rolling for as long as possible under its own steam.

Bethesda tends to masterfully do exactly that. Pepper some mind-tingling terminology in previews, show 5 carefully chosen screenshots per year, make some equally hand-crafted videos, etc.

[Richard]

People have been demanding multiplayer in TES since Morrowind because they have this huge world, with lots of quests and they still feel lonely at times, or they want to experience the game with others. I'm probably wrong, but I feel they don't want raids and mobs and holy trinity and all that meta-game jargon. They don't even, probably, want a _massively_ multiplayer TES. They only want to play with others, go on some hard quests, kind of like Diablo. Make a party and just go find adventure.

What people wanted: Skyrim (or Oblivion) except with dungeon crawling with their friends, compare inventories and modded outfits and faces, probably trade with them.

What they made: WoW clone with the words "Elder Scrolls" sprinkled throughout.

[Scott_Arm]

I have no interest in an MMO Elder Scrolls. Just give me 2-4 player co-op, more interesting loot, more meaningful exploration and some improved combat/magic.

[RobertR1]

I hope this bombs. Thanks to WoW I will not get anymore Warcraft sequels. Don't want the same for TES.

[swaaye]

Woulda thunk that Bethesda would've noticed the various community attempts to graft multiplayer onto their games.

Actually I'm not sure this game is an idea from Bethesda, but perhaps instead a scheme entirely from Zenimax.

[Grall]

Originally Posted by Richard

What people wanted: Skyrim (or Oblivion) except with dungeon crawling with their friends, compare inventories and modded outfits and faces, probably trade with them.

What they made: WoW clone with the words "Elder Scrolls" sprinkled throughout.

I'd want the first option too. Don't really want another WoW, but maybe this game distinguishes itself enough that it doesn't fall into that trap.

No other game's been able to out-WoW WoW, and I totally don't expect even Bethesda to manage to succeed there. What remains is to come at the problem from a new angle, somehow, which isn't easy. It's been tried many times and if not exactly failed, so at least meh'd every time.

[I.S.T.]

Originally Posted by swaaye

Woulda thunk that Bethesda would've noticed the various community attempts to graft multiplayer onto their games.

Actually I'm not sure this game is an idea from Bethesda, but perhaps instead a scheme entirely from Zenimax.

*sigh* why do people keep forgetting this.

Zenimax was founded years after Beth by Beth people. It is effectively a publisher Beth owns.

[swaaye]

I've read up on it now. I was unaware of that.

Check this out:

ZeniMax Media Board of Directors currently consists of the following: Robert A. Altman, Chairman and CEO of ZeniMax; Ernest Del, President of ZeniMax Media; film producer Jerry Bruckheimer; Michael Dominguez, Managing Director, Providence Equity Partners Inc.; Leslie Moonves, President & CEO of CBS Corporation; Cal Ripken, Jr. President & CEO of Ripken Baseball, Inc.; Robert S. Trump son of Fred Trump,and President of Trump Management Inc,also Harry E. Sloan,Chairman of Global Eagle Acquisition Corporation.

Interesting to see who's in on their mini empire.

Anyway, I remember somebody over there saying Todd Howard's team doesn't do MMOs. This was said back when the rumor of TES MMO surfaced around a year ago. I wonder if that is still true and he's working on a new singleplayer game, or if it was bullshit, or if things have changed...

[aaronspink]

Originally Posted by swaaye

Anyway, I remember somebody over there saying Todd Howard's team doesn't do MMOs. This was said back when the rumor of TES MMO surfaced around a year ago. I wonder if that is still true and he's working on a new singleplayer game, or if it was bullshit, or if things have changed...

That is why they started Zenimax online, so that Bethesda could do single player/non-MMO and they could expand into mmos without changing that. Lore, etc, splits between ZMO and BGS but everything else is split.

[green.pixel]

Originally Posted by Scott_Arm

I have no interest in an MMO Elder Scrolls. Just give me 2-4 player co-op, more interesting loot, more meaningful exploration and some improved combat/magic.

They should look upon New Vegas for proper quest design and writing.

[neino]

I just want to say ,Please don't be a WoW clone!

[solarmystic]

Hmm.. after watching some previews, and seeing how suspiciously similar it is to yet another WoW clone.... I wonder, why do they keep on serving up the same regurgitated leavins that people are mostly sick of?

The market is ripe for something brand new, something fresh... watching WoW clone MMOs like TOR tank after a measly few months on the market (it lost 25% of its subscribers leaving speculators to wonder whether it'd be F2P in the coming year or so..), haven't they learnt anything?

[Malo]

That's why my wife and I bought lifetime subscriptions on The Secret World. Very different, makes you think for a lot of quests, even research information. And it's not generic fantasy shit.

[ToTTenTranz]

There was already a thread for The Elder Scrolls Online.


Yeah, it's weird how so many MMORPGs go down the toilet so fast and yet they keep popping up everywhere.


Being able to receive one or two players in our game for some coop and prepare the story accordingly, would have been so much better received.

I guess every company is trying to move into that damned free-to-play business model.

[Grall]

I don't do "free to play". I don't relish having my tit squeezed regularly for more cash just so I can progress in the game. I'll pay for something once, not more than that, and certainly not over and over.

Well, OK, WoW is the exception because I've had a lot of fun playing that game in the past, and it's a predictable cost. There's no "pay to win" option in WoW, something that's quite common in F2P titles.

[MfA]

In the end three faction warfare really isn't that much better than two faction ... it's still zerg vs zerg, near consequence free, with very little reward/recognition for taking up the mantle of leadership.

Three faction is becoming the most popular cop out to actually fixing the problems of world PvP in most MMOs ... nearly everyone has caught on to the fact that near consequence free zerg vs zerg world PvP has no long lasting appeal, but a lot of people still think 3 factions solves it for some silly reason.

The sad thing is that at the same time they are using nearly the same broken world PvP as WoW (just +1 faction) and battlegrounds, they refuse to copy Arena ... which despite all the hate is popular for good reasons ... and is hated for very petty reasons ... if the big guys want to keep copying WoW why don't they just do it right for fucking once?

[Grall]

Originally Posted by MfA

they refuse to copy Arena ... which despite all the hate is popular for good reasons ... and is hated for very petty reasons

LOL! Now that was a biased statement if ever I saw one.

Arena is hated in WoW because it's done nothing but fuck up the game for nearly six years, all for catering to a tiny minority of the player base, and a wish to market the game as an esport by blizzard management.

[aaronspink]

Originally Posted by MfA

The sad thing is that at the same time they are using nearly the same broken world PvP as WoW (just +1 faction) and battlegrounds, they refuse to copy Arena ... which despite all the hate is popular for good reasons ... and is hated for very petty reasons ... if the big guys want to keep copying WoW why don't they just do it right for fucking once?

You want arena, get a couple of people together, go off into the wilderness and fight, done. Arena is quite possibly the worst idea ever.