Beyond3D Forum

bbot · 19-Nov-2003, 02:36

This article by pbs.org's Cringely seems to say that future versions of Xbox, along with .NET, will be an important part of Microsoft's future.

http://www.pbs.org/cringely/pulpit/pulpit20031113.html

DeadmeatGA · 19-Nov-2003, 03:55

Whoever wrote that article is reading into things too much... .NET is for where portability matters and performance is a second consideration; gaming is unsuited for .NET migration, nor do I see Power5 as being instrumental in shaping the future of Windows and .NET. IBM won simply because they were running under-capacity and was willing to cut a deal with MS.

Vince · 19-Nov-2003, 04:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeadmeatGA

gaming is unsuited for .NET migration

Chris Egerter. 6.20.03. His B3D Column: "3D with .NET"

RaolinDarksbane · 19-Nov-2003, 05:22

Quote:

...... .NET is for where portability matters......

.NET and portability?...... does not comprehend.....

I have always thought that .NET is only for Windows platform. Then again, I don't understand much about this .NET thing.[/list]

Jabjabs · 19-Nov-2003, 05:48

Quote:

gaming is unsuited for .NET migration

From all the developers I've talked to, all xbox developers are forced to use .NET software.

kaching · 19-Nov-2003, 06:05

It's an interesting article. Insinuating that MS is deliberately failing (essentially), or at least underachieving, in many markets...I can't envision it being as much of a success story for MS as Cringely suggests, but maybe investors can.

Qroach · 19-Nov-2003, 10:10

yeah visual studio. net.

DeadmeatGA · 19-Nov-2003, 18:28

Vince, from your source...

Quote:

Will commercial games be written in .NET? Probably not at this point,

DeadmeatGA · 19-Nov-2003, 18:29

Quote:

.NET and portability?...... does not comprehend.....

Since MS claims to make .NET runtime environment on Linux and CE, it surely adds to "portability".

Vince · 19-Nov-2003, 18:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeadmeatGA

Vince, from your source...

Quote:

Will commercial games be written in .NET? Probably not at this point,

Deadmeat, from the english language....

Note differences. Write that down.

EDIT: Before some smartass corrects me, I used past for a reason as opposed to present tense.

Vince · 19-Nov-2003, 18:45

Lesson2: Selective quoting to prove a fallicious point.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeadMeatGA

"Will commercial games be written in .NET? Probably not at this point,"

Notice the comma at the end? How odd.... The mechanics of sentance structure would seem to lead one to believe that the comma was creating a shift in direction - but why not quote that? Ahh... the beauty of selective quoting!

Quote:

Originally Posted by [url=http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6541

Actual Post[/url]] However recently the demand for .NET support has increased. Porting 50-60 examples to VB and C# is a time consuming process, but rewarding to see them working in other languages.

There are lots of .NET languages popping up, Cobol, Fortan, Python, and Perl to name a few. When done right it is possible to expose nearly all of the API to languages I never thought would be supported.

Will commercial games be written in .NET? Probably not at this point, but the work I've done so far shows that this is entirely possible when using a managed wrapper over a C/C++ engine DLL.

Wow, thats some damn good quoting there DMGA... A+ for you!

DeadmeatGA · 19-Nov-2003, 18:54

Vince, do you not understand that performance-oriented software code will never go to intepretated route for the very reason of performance?

Tahir2 · 19-Nov-2003, 19:06

Quoting something out of context and then not quoting something in its entirety is a criminal offence and the perpetrators need to be prosecuted with the full power of the forum moderators.. heh.

Not that DMGA is the only one guilty of this heinous grime [sic].

I have to admit though DGMA you should apologise for that and promise not to do in the future. It's really bad (TM). Plus if you tried anything like that at a professional level you can kick your ass goodbye out of that job.

Otherwise... I dont get it, if MS is forcing people to develop with VS >NET then where is the argument that .NET is not possible or in use at this time? Or is VS .NET another beast (Qroach?).

Sonic · 19-Nov-2003, 19:45

Quoting something without using the full sentence and what the man meant does little to prove your point Deadmeat. It would be best if you use the opinion or facts of someone that supports your argument.

I do not think .NET would be a completely effective tool when it comes to making games. Regular developer's tools are fine for now and the current languages will probably go on the way to next gen systems. C# would be interesting to see implemented into games though. Can Xbox take advantage of anything that C# can provide of C++?

Windfire · 20-Nov-2003, 03:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sonic

C# would be interesting to see implemented into games though. Can Xbox take advantage of anything that C# can provide of C++?

C# is an awesome language IMHO. A great blend of the power you want, but dropping some of the ugly aspects of Java and C++.

Of course, I use it for developing business software. I've actually got several example projects with DirectX and C# but to be hones, the overhead of the .Net framework simply is too high for the kinds of games you want to make on a console.

Regarding portability... The entire concept of the MSIL and JIT compiling points towards the concept of portability... It just so happens that the Windows platform is the only platform that supports .Net at this point.

akira888 · 20-Nov-2003, 03:28

I have heard that there is a Linux CLR currently being developed. Anyone else know anything?

19-Nov-2003, 02:36	#1
bbot Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 642	Xbox and Microsoft's plan for the future This article by pbs.org's Cringely seems to say that future versions of Xbox, along with .NET, will be an important part of Microsoft's future. http://www.pbs.org/cringely/pulpit/pulpit20031113.html

19-Nov-2003, 03:55	#2
DeadmeatGA Naughty Boy! Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 391	... Whoever wrote that article is reading into things too much... .NET is for where portability matters and performance is a second consideration; gaming is unsuited for .NET migration, nor do I see Power5 as being instrumental in shaping the future of Windows and .NET. IBM won simply because they were running under-capacity and was willing to cut a deal with MS. __________________ "I can't imagine how you will actually program it" - Tim Sweeney, Epic. "I just don't see that Cell is revolutionary, except in its marketing impact," - Peter Glaskowsky - Chief Editor, Microprocessor Report

19-Nov-2003, 18:54	#12
DeadmeatGA Naughty Boy! Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 391	.... Vince, do you not understand that performance-oriented software code will never go to intepretated route for the very reason of performance? __________________ "I can't imagine how you will actually program it" - Tim Sweeney, Epic. "I just don't see that Cell is revolutionary, except in its marketing impact," - Peter Glaskowsky - Chief Editor, Microprocessor Report

19-Nov-2003, 19:06	#13
Tahir2 Itchy Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: United Queendom Posts: 2,859	Quoting something out of context and then not quoting something in its entirety is a criminal offence and the perpetrators need to be prosecuted with the full power of the forum moderators.. heh. Not that DMGA is the only one guilty of this heinous grime [sic]. I have to admit though DGMA you should apologise for that and promise not to do in the future. It's really bad (TM). Plus if you tried anything like that at a professional level you can kick your ass goodbye out of that job. Otherwise... I dont get it, if MS is forcing people to develop with VS >NET then where is the argument that .NET is not possible or in use at this time? Or is VS .NET another beast (Qroach?). __________________ Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so - Douglas Adams

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19-Nov-2003, 06:05	#6
kaching Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 109	It's an interesting article. Insinuating that MS is deliberately failing (essentially), or at least underachieving, in many markets...I can't envision it being as much of a success story for MS as Cringely suggests, but maybe investors can.

19-Nov-2003, 10:10	#7
Qroach Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 3,859	yeah visual studio. net.

19-Nov-2003, 19:45	#14
Sonic Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 1,580	Quoting something without using the full sentence and what the man meant does little to prove your point Deadmeat. It would be best if you use the opinion or facts of someone that supports your argument. I do not think .NET would be a completely effective tool when it comes to making games. Regular developer's tools are fine for now and the current languages will probably go on the way to next gen systems. C# would be interesting to see implemented into games though. Can Xbox take advantage of anything that C# can provide of C++?

20-Nov-2003, 03:28	#16
akira888 Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Houston Posts: 652	I have heard that there is a Linux CLR currently being developed. Anyone else know anything?

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