[Ivan]

As everything seems to be tied with console generations from now on, i can't imagine new Crysis happening to the PC gaming. Do you think we'll see a new push forward on PC before new generation of consoles?

[woundingchaney]

no

If anything the level of scalability may change/increase but for the next couple of years I imagine most everything will be console centric. Though this does have its advantages. It makes for longer hardware shelf life for one and titles do prosper from having a larger budget with the funding for 3+ platforms coming into play. I dont see another game really pushing the tech. edge until there is a shift in the console cycle. Even without the consoles there has been somewhat of a trend for pc games to target lower level hardware for the game to reach a larger portion of the pc gaming population.

[pjbliverpool]

Originally Posted by woundingchaney

no

If anything the level of scalability may change/increase but for the next couple of years I imagine most everything will be console centric. Though this does have its advantages. It makes for longer hardware shelf life for one and titles do prosper from having a larger budget with the funding for 3+ platforms coming into play. I dont see another game really pushing the tech. edge until there is a shift in the console cycle. Even without the consoles there has been somewhat of a trend for pc games to target lower level hardware for the game to reach a larger portion of the pc gaming population.

Agreed, although there will be a small level of progression. In a year for example Crysis will no longer be pushing hardware that hard. I expect we will see a few titles at its level between now and the next gen consoles but very few if any which go beyond it. Most titles will simple be high res, slightely enhanced versions of the console games though.

Clear Skies is an exmaple of a game that has pushed the same kind of tech envelope as Crysis.

[homerdog]

Originally Posted by pjbliverpool

Agreed, although there will be a small level of progression. In a year for example Crysis will no longer be pushing hardware that hard. I expect we will see a few titles at its level between now and the next gen consoles but very few if any which go beyond it. Most titles will simple be high res, slightely enhanced versions of the console games though.

Hoho, Crysis is far from being conquered. There are still no single GPU systems that can pull off very high at 1080p+ resolutions - and this is without AA. There is also a CPU limitation that is rarely exposed since most folks are so GPU limited, but it will take probably the next "tick" from Intel to fully satisfy Crysis in physics heavy scenes.

I expect Crysis to remain the most demanding game on PC until the next gen consoles start to hit. Nothing else I've seen looks to dethrown Crytek's masterpiece, visually at least.

[Skinner]

I'm wondering the same thing. With the consoles stealing away the efforts from PC gaming I see the border is reached with Crysis (sorry for the babelfish language )

Right now I don't know a game in development which is pushing beyond Crysis

[Skinner]

Originally Posted by homerdog

Hoho, Crysis is far from being conquered. There are still no single GPU systems that can pull off very high at 1080p+ resolutions - and this is without AA. There is also a CPU limitation that is rarely exposed since most folks are so GPU limited, but it will take probably the next "tick" from Intel to fully satisfy Crysis in physics heavy scenes.

I expect Crysis to remain the most demanding game on PC until the next gen consoles start to hit. Nothing else I've seen looks to dethrown Crytek's masterpiece, visually at least.

Warhead DX9 Ultra high (with evenshadermod) does , (1920x1440 16 AF 8xAA) 50 fps (timedemo 1 Ambush) on 2x HD4870X2 quadfire

Edit, saw you said one GPU, well, maybe one MSI GTX280 SC@700 does the trick

[suryad]

Originally Posted by Skinner

Warhead DX9 Ultra high (with evenshadermod) does , (1920x1440 16 AF 8xAA) 50 fps (timedemo 1 Ambush) on 2x HD4870X2 quadfire

He said single gpu systems. That look like 4 gpus to me...and I can play at that settings on my 8800 Ultra setup just no AA. Oh and I get like 40 fps.

[homerdog]

Originally Posted by Skinner

Warhead DX9 Ultra high (with evenshadermod) does , (1920x1440 16 AF 8xAA) 50 fps (timedemo 1 Ambush) on 2x HD4870X2 quadfire

Lolicakes!! I think you're proving my point

[Neb]

Originally Posted by Skinner

Warhead DX9 Ultra high (with evenshadermod) does , (1920x1440 16 AF 8xAA) 50 fps (timedemo 1 Ambush) on 2x HD4870X2 quadfire

Yep an a single 280gtx or HD4870 does quite good to!

Benchmark/playthrough on youtube

[pjbliverpool]

Originally Posted by homerdog

Hoho, Crysis is far from being conquered. There are still no single GPU systems that can pull off very high at 1080p+ resolutions - and this is without AA.

A GTX 280 is already close to that level of performance, certainly GT300 or whatever major revision is next from NV should easily be able to handle that, never mind what we can see 2 years from now.

I'm not saying Crysis still won't be pushing hardware, but rather that because far more powerful will then be more mainstream, developers can afford to make games with Crysis like performance characteristics that are playable by the mainstream.

There is also a CPU limitation that is rarely exposed since most folks are so GPU limited, but it will take probably the next "tick" from Intel to fully satisfy Crysis in physics heavy scenes.

Nah, Nehalems got more than enough power to handle Crysis, have you seen the benchmarks of it with Tri SLI? Its virtually doubling Penryns performance.

[homerdog]

Originally Posted by pjbliverpool

A GTX 280 is already close to that level of performance, certainly GT300 or whatever major revision is next from NV should easily be able to handle that, never mind what we can see 2 years from now.

Actually I will be (pleasantly) surprised if GT300/RV870 will be able to push Crysis at 1920x1200 with 4xAA at acceptable (>30 minimum) framerates. And who said anything about 2 years from now?

Originally Posted by pjbliverpool

I'm not saying Crysis still won't be pushing hardware, but rather that because far more powerful will then be more mainstream, developers can afford to make games with Crysis like performance characteristics that are playable by the mainstream.

Mainstream cards have a long way to go before they can keep up with Crysis on maxed settings. Also consider the console limitation, as that seems to weigh more heavily on devs' minds than available PC hardware. Even if we had GTX280 level cards selling for $100, if a console is the lead platform we aren't going to get Crysis. Far Cry 2 is the poster child here.

Originally Posted by pjbliverpool

Nah, Nehalems got more than enough power to handle Crysis, have you seen the benchmarks of it with Tri SLI? Its virtually doubling Penryns performance.

These benches indicate that the CPU limit is still alive and well in Crysis. The i7 965 can *only* pull 55FPS at 1920x1200 with not even closed to maxed out settings. Perhaps SLI is hammering the CPU more than a single more powerul GPU would, but I suppose we won't know until some time next year. I would be interested to see these tests run at enthusiast settings with 4xAA.

[Kyyla]

Originally Posted by woundingchaney

no

If anything the level of scalability may change/increase but for the next couple of years I imagine most everything will be console centric. Though this does have its advantages. It makes for longer hardware shelf life for one and titles do prosper from having a larger budget with the funding for 3+ platforms coming into play. I dont see another game really pushing the tech. edge until there is a shift in the console cycle. Even without the consoles there has been somewhat of a trend for pc games to target lower level hardware for the game to reach a larger portion of the pc gaming population.

Personally I think this is a good thing. Monster GFX cards consuming 400W of power isn't sustainable. It has also made PC gaming more affordable. A 100$ GPU will do you just fine for most games on sale today.

[V3]

What about that Project Offset, will that become a game or just tech demo ?

[slapnutz]

Originally Posted by V3

What about that Project Offset, will that become a game or just tech demo ?

I wouldnt be suprised if PO comes out the same time as Intels Larrabee (sp) GPGPU Ray Tracing yadda yadda GPU in 2010. (since intel bought the PO company)

[PhilB]

Originally Posted by Ivan

Do you think we'll see a new push forward on PC before new generation of consoles?

Unfortunately, no. It's not a new idea that the next big leap will probably coincide with the release of the new console generation (PS4, Xbox 720) as it did when the 360 came out. The only people who I see pushing the envolope are Crytek, and unless Crytek does something next year similar to Warhead (pushing the graphics even further) then I don't we'll see anything significant. That's not to say the games coming out now look bad or anything, though. Just nothing at the Crysis level of graphics.

[Skinner]

Well, maybe Carmack does it with Doom4 and Rage

[Malo]

Originally Posted by Skinner

Well, maybe Carmack does it with Doom4 and Rage

Isn't his next tech focused on pushing the development boundaries rather than the graphics ones? Especially since it's all about multiplatform support from the start.

[Neb]

Originally Posted by Malo

Isn't his next tech focused on pushing the development boundaries rather than the graphics ones? Especially since it's all about multiplatform support from the start.

Only Doom4 will take more use of the PC hardware according to Carmack who said it would look way better in comparision. Rage should look quitethe same between platforms +/- AA and AF. So Rage should run good on budget while being maxed out.

[Ivan]

Originally Posted by Nebula

Only Doom4 will take more use of the PC hardware according to Carmack who said it would look way better in comparision. Rage should look quitethe same between platforms +/- AA and AF. So Rage should run good on budget while being maxed out.

Even that was connected to console tech - he said that Doom 4 will look much better because "it's a 30hz game and we can do much more than in 60hz game like Rage", and not because high-end PCs can do it.


Carmack was God for many PC gamers and look what is he doing now. I understand that business decision, but he's became almost irrelevant in industry, because he never made THAT good games, but at least he pushed on technical side.

It seems like the only advantage my favourite PC has now are mouse and keyboard. Even losing the advantage of technical superiority isn't my biggest problem, i really like to see nice graphics etc, but more important problem is that PC as a platform is completely out of developers' focus. I miss smaller games being PC centric, not only the biggest titles. I miss everything being PC centric and being able to choose from many good games in genre. You can say "Oh, there are many pc games comming out, everything's fine...", but just compare this wit situation from 1998.-2004. for example.

Now we can wait for larrabee or something similar to change things, but until then next generation of consoles will be on it's way and certainly won't be inferior, average console game will use it's tech almost to the max, not to mention big budget exclusive games, and on the other side on pc developers will have to wait until enough people accept that new concept, sell enough larrabees to start even counting on it etc etc.... As allways, it will end with a few tech-demo games ...

I'd like to hear more opinions, this is the best place to talk about stuff like this

[homerdog]

Yes I realized this soon after posting

[hoom]

Empire:Total War.
http://www.totalwar-zone.de/games/et...enshots/16.jpg
http://www.totalwar-zone.de/games/et...enshots/19.jpg
http://www.totalwar-zone.de/games/et...enshots/28.jpg

There are some things that PCs do with ease but which a console can't even dream of.

[homerdog]

Originally Posted by hoom

Empire:Total War.
http://www.totalwar-zone.de/games/et...enshots/16.jpg
http://www.totalwar-zone.de/games/et...enshots/19.jpg
http://www.totalwar-zone.de/games/et...enshots/28.jpg

There are some things that PCs do with ease but which a console can't even dream of.

Why? Memory limitations? Lack of CPU power? Lack of GPU power? No mouse? No HDD (in 360's case)?

All of the above?

[pjbliverpool]

Originally Posted by homerdog

Why? Memory limitations? Lack of CPU power? Lack of GPU power? No mouse? No HDD (in 360's case)?

All of the above?

If its going to be any of those, it would be memory limitations and CPU capability. The rest can be over come with compromises.

What kind of CPU does Rome TW require though? I'm guessing its not that high end.

[hoom]

The rest can be over come with compromises.

You mean consolitis.
Consolitis = break or remove the things that PCs do easily but consoles can't even dream of doing.

[corysama]

Originally Posted by pjbliverpool

If its going to be any of those, it would be memory limitations and CPU capability. The rest can be over come with compromises.

What kind of CPU does Rome TW require though? I'm guessing its not that high end.

I don't see a lot of unique content in those screenshots. Just of bunch of the same models and textures instanced hundreds of times. If R:TW doesn't come to consoles it's because gamepading from your couch is a crappy way to play RTSs compared to mousing with your face inches from the screen.