Beyond3D Forum

Dave Baumann · 12-Jul-2002, 09:05

NVIDIA recently held their annual stockholders meeting and during it their CEO, Jen-Hsun Huang, reaffirmed that NV30 would be on a .13um silicon process as it was "impossible to make on .15um" and that it would also be here this fall.

Rumours of it being on any other process appear to be just that, rumours.

Evildeus · 12-Jul-2002, 13:41

Hmmm what's that?

Anonymous · 12-Jul-2002, 14:23

You can find the girl there: http://highend3d.com/artists/artist.3d?au=Alceu&iid=55 3D with Maya, textures with Photoshop, Image Completion Time: Many months

A perfect date for this new CG-Shader-man of NVidia's?

Dave Baumann · 12-Jul-2002, 15:25

A few notes made from the meeting repeated at Fool:

http://boards.fool.com/Message.asp?mid=17499507

Quote:

They mentioned the NV30 several times, and showed references to it on several slides. One of the slides showed a schedule for chip releases, and it showed the NV18 and NV28 showing up in what appeared to be the August/Sept time frame, and NV30 appearing in Oct/Nov (approximate, the slide was marked in quarterly increments). The slide also mentioned how many transistors were on each chip:
NV18: 81 million
NV28: 86 M
NV30: 120 M

They stated that they thought the NV30 was going to be the biggest revolution in 3D graphics in the last 10 years.

At a later part of the presentation, they stated that NV30 was on TSMC's 0.13um process that had copper interconnects. It was an FSG process (i.e. no low-k dielectrics were being used). I believe that Jen Hsun said the only part coming this Fall that was 0.13um was the NV30, the other parts are 0.15um. Also, the NV30 would fully support DX9.

VitruvianMan · 12-Jul-2002, 16:46

Lets hope this is less hype and marketing and more "honesty" about performance if there is such a thing in the 3d market anymore.

Anonymous · 12-Jul-2002, 18:47

This NV18 transistor count seems a bit strange. Is this investor meeting available as Real Audio?

Pete · 13-Jul-2002, 09:24

Considering NV25 is ~60mil and NV17 is ~35mil IIRC, those numbers are huge leaps. If they're right, we're certainly looking at two DX8 parts; the question is, are we looking at extra pipes/shaders/texture units, as well?

ben6 · 13-Jul-2002, 19:01

yeah that transistor counter is strange 31 million more than Geforce3 , 23 million more than Geforce4 . I wonder if they're doing a 4 vertex shader array ala Parhelia?

Chalnoth · 14-Jul-2002, 08:06

The most logical use for the extra transistors would be for increased caches (Or other performance optimizations) and the inclusion of the GeForce4 MX's video features (And possibly also in combination with the .13 micron process in order to make this part very cost-effective).

I suppose it's also possible that the NV28 is an attempt at a "DX8.5" part, possibly just in case the NV30 doesn't pan out as planned. I doubt the extra transistors would be used for more pipelines or something of the sort, but we'll see.

Gunhead · 14-Jul-2002, 15:09

Well it's going to be 8 pipelines. And the pixel shaders eat up plenty of real e. So?

Chalnoth · 14-Jul-2002, 15:22

Many people have been stating that the NV30 will have 8 pipelines. I still doubt it, given support for 64-bit color could double (or nearly so) the pixel pipeline size. Plus, there's the addition of many more PS/VS features. I also believe that the T&L power will be massively improved.

And do not be surprised if neither the R300 nor the NV30 turn out to hugely outperform today's video cards in older benchmarks.

Gubbi · 15-Jul-2002, 12:22

If NV30 is supposed to be a DX 9 chip, it will have to support the floating point data types that this implies. This means every single blending/calculation stage has to be upgraded from integer to floating point. This can easily eat up ALOT (as in 21 million transistors). Data paths need to be wider too.

Cheers
gubbi

Anonymous · 16-Jul-2002, 02:31

hmm new 3dfx technology

Anonymous · 31-Oct-2002, 02:38

This card will be speedy as nuts but... well we'll see!

Anonymous · 01-Nov-2002, 13:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gubbi

...means every single blending/calculation stage has to be upgraded from integer to floating point. This can easily eat up ALOT (as in 21 million transistors). Data paths need to be wider too.

Cheers
gubbi

The NV30 opengl docs say no support for blending in Floating point buffers. The NV guys over at the opengl forum claim that it would have taken too of the tranny budget.

Is floating point buffer blending part of DX9 ??

Mephisto · 02-Nov-2002, 10:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by pocketmoon_g

Is floating point buffer blending part of DX9 ??

No.

Anonymous · 20-Nov-2002, 06:04

NV30's only problem is their memory bandwidth! Not that memory bandwidth counts dor everything! See Paraphelia,but still. Otherwise the latest official nv30 specs should make it certain 2 blow everything away on the market! Including your wallet!

12-Jul-2002, 09:05	#1
Dave Baumann Gamerscore Wh... Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 12,947	NV30 NVIDIA recently held their annual stockholders meeting and during it their CEO, Jen-Hsun Huang, reaffirmed that NV30 would be on a .13um silicon process as it was "impossible to make on .15um" and that it would also be here this fall. Rumours of it being on any other process appear to be just that, rumours. __________________ Expand. Accelerate. Dominate. Tweet Tweet!

12-Jul-2002, 14:23	#3
Anonymous Senior Member Join Date: May 1978 Posts: 3,263	The girl You can find the girl there: http://highend3d.com/artists/artist.3d?au=Alceu&iid=55 3D with Maya, textures with Photoshop, Image Completion Time: Many months A perfect date for this new CG-Shader-man of NVidia's?

31-Oct-2002, 02:38	#14
Anonymous Senior Member Join Date: May 1978 Posts: 3,263	NV30's marketing strategy sucks! This card will be speedy as nuts but... well we'll see!

20-Nov-2002, 06:04	#17
Anonymous Senior Member Join Date: May 1978 Posts: 3,263	This forum is a bit outdated! NV30's only problem is their memory bandwidth! Not that memory bandwidth counts dor everything! See Paraphelia,but still. Otherwise the latest official nv30 specs should make it certain 2 blow everything away on the market! Including your wallet!

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12-Jul-2002, 13:41	#2
Evildeus Senior Member Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 2,657	Hmmm what's that?

12-Jul-2002, 16:46	#5
VitruvianMan Registered Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 7	Lets hope this is less hype and marketing and more "honesty" about performance if there is such a thing in the 3d market anymore.

12-Jul-2002, 18:47	#6
Anonymous Senior Member Join Date: May 1978 Posts: 3,263	This NV18 transistor count seems a bit strange. Is this investor meeting available as Real Audio?

13-Jul-2002, 09:24	#7
Pete Moderate Nuisance Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 4,653	Considering NV25 is ~60mil and NV17 is ~35mil IIRC, those numbers are huge leaps. If they're right, we're certainly looking at two DX8 parts; the question is, are we looking at extra pipes/shaders/texture units, as well?

13-Jul-2002, 19:01	#8
ben6 Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 863	yeah that transistor counter is strange 31 million more than Geforce3 , 23 million more than Geforce4 . I wonder if they're doing a 4 vertex shader array ala Parhelia?

14-Jul-2002, 08:06	#9
Chalnoth Join Date: May 2002 Location: New York, NY Posts: 12,678	The most logical use for the extra transistors would be for increased caches (Or other performance optimizations) and the inclusion of the GeForce4 MX's video features (And possibly also in combination with the .13 micron process in order to make this part very cost-effective). I suppose it's also possible that the NV28 is an attempt at a "DX8.5" part, possibly just in case the NV30 doesn't pan out as planned. I doubt the extra transistors would be used for more pipelines or something of the sort, but we'll see.

14-Jul-2002, 15:09	#10
Gunhead Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: a vertex Posts: 354	Well it's going to be 8 pipelines. And the pixel shaders eat up plenty of real e. So?

14-Jul-2002, 15:22	#11
Chalnoth Join Date: May 2002 Location: New York, NY Posts: 12,678	Many people have been stating that the NV30 will have 8 pipelines. I still doubt it, given support for 64-bit color could double (or nearly so) the pixel pipeline size. Plus, there's the addition of many more PS/VS features. I also believe that the T&L power will be massively improved. And do not be surprised if neither the R300 nor the NV30 turn out to hugely outperform today's video cards in older benchmarks.

15-Jul-2002, 12:22	#12
Gubbi Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 2,544	If NV30 is supposed to be a DX 9 chip, it will have to support the floating point data types that this implies. This means every single blending/calculation stage has to be upgraded from integer to floating point. This can easily eat up ALOT (as in 21 million transistors). Data paths need to be wider too. Cheers gubbi

16-Jul-2002, 02:31	#13
Anonymous Senior Member Join Date: May 1978 Posts: 3,263	hmm new 3dfx technology

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