I'd be really surprised if either company would release another debacle along the lines of the 5800.

One card or another will be faster or slower depending on design decisions, but it won't be a case where X card will be so horrible at running Directx Y that it requires massive game individualized shader replacements in order to run at a somewhat acceptable speed.

In fact, thank goodness, I see a trend by both companies to focus on Image Quality while balancing speed gains against that.

Personally I think the future of high end 3D accelerators isn't in how fast they are compared to the competition, but how good the Image Quality is compared to the competition while running at an acceptable speed.

Of course, "acceptable speed" is inherently subjective and while some people can't stand anything that won't benchmark at least 60+ FPS, a lot of us are also perfectly fine with games running around 20-30+ FPS depending on the type of game.

Heck, in something like EQ2 I'm perfectly fine raiding even at 12-14 FPS, and that considering I'm the MA that the entire raid's DPS goes though.

Then again, if I'm playing an FPS 25+ is a must. And if I'm competing at a LAN party, then 40+ is a must for me to comfortably rank in the top 3 consistently.

So as I see it. 5800 was a one time blemish that neither of these 2 graphics companies will probably repeat. Of course, now that I said that...it'll probably happen. :grin: :lol: :razz:

No, I expect in the future we'll continue to see increased speed as in the past, but we'll also an increased emphasis on increased IQ from both companies.

Regards,
SB

I surprises me that someone could say something as bold, coming from a popular website like that. Seems like ethics are going down no matter where you look.

Also, seems to me like nVidia is still hoping that ATI releases a catastrophic product, just like the nv30. Its like the want to be even, since they are still not emotionally recovered from that knock out blow they had back then. It does not matter if they are on top at the moment lol.

Kyle is an absurd Nvidia fanboy. I've called him out on it on his board in the past.

The last one was when he declared that R600 would require 300 watts..it's like he's actively looking for angles to bash the R600 when he writes any story about it.

I think the reason they are showing it off on barcelona is it will give it the best platform to show the r600 on, at least for editor's day, benchmark numbers will be inflated a bit. Barcelona should be a very solid platform.

I agree on that point Razor but it's certainly more than that. I think this launch perhaps more than any other in the past is aimed at OEM's to show AMD's ability to launch and support an entire platform from top to bottom. And also to showcase stream computing to the extremely high margin stream computing market.

I think an entire platform will do more to boost marketshare for AMD than just another fast CPU or just another fast video card. OEM's want a competitve product from AMD as it gives them a better platform (pun intended) and position for negotiating prices with Intel. And if AMD can pull off an entire platform, they stand to gain a lot of ground among the OEMs which directly drives marketshare.

Regards,
SB

I agree. AMD is "re launching" it self as a company. They are going to bring out a massive product line from top to bottom with wide availability their for showing confidence to investors, OEM's, and consumers.

the constant delays show the exact opposite of confidence to this consumer

actually its using 2.5 or what ever the hell version that old engine is at. Basically the same as UT2004 or a newer splinter cell game and im not having any stability issues with that game and my 8800. Recently some creeping and shimmering textures in certain locations but thats all i can complain about.

Keep in mind that there's technically been only one official delay.

id imagine anyone buying a 500+ video card is well aware of the many unofficial r600 delays and this "one time launch" doesnt make any of them more prone to prefer amd. delaying to launch together is probably the worst marketing idea ive ever seen.

I would like to ask this question to everyone? Feel Free to vote :)
http://snappoll.com/poll/184674.php


Thanks :)

Why are you so worried about R600's launch? you need to replace your 8800 THAT badly?

I for one did not know that a commitment to purchasing a R600 was required in order to be able to participate in discussions regarding the launch strategy.

i love technology, so regardless of whether or not i buy an r600, i RLY want to see what it brings to the table.

It was introduced during that mass Elitist movement in the early 90's when massive ISA cards that cost more than life insurance started flooding the market. :wink:

Personally, i've waited so long now for R600 (and slapped myself countless times for even considering purchasing a G80) that I think I could actually wait...oh I don't know, 3, maybe 4 lifetimes? For it to come out. I just want my R600. Out of curiosity, once it's actually released, do you think we'll all move to properly calling it the x2900? Because I honestly think R600 sounds better, and i've been calling it that for so long i'm really used to it...

I agree, R600 sounds better - I still refer to my X1950's as my R580's, cause it sounds better, and isn't as much of a mouthful. :smile:

r600 is just better to type.

No, I think without a doubt the "worst marketing idea I've ever seen" award goes to nVidia for its truly awful 18-month PR period post the R300 launch and prior to nVidia shipping nV40...;) During that time we saw just how bad marketing could really be, and how low it could go. By comparison, this is nothing. (You don't see ATi proclaiming that "We don't believe that G8x represents the future of 3d gaming," do you? You don't see ATi publicly withdrawing from benchmarks, or criticizing game developers for their game demos, or any of the other shameful PR tactics nVidia uselessly employed--to its own detriment--during that period, do you?)

Also, "unofficial delays" amount only to some website somewhere either making up a story about R600's release date, or else repeating a rumor that somebody else on some other web site made up about R600's ship date, and then crying "It's late!" when the made-up dates come and go without the product shipping. I think that most of the people smart enough to accumulate enough cash to buy R600 when it ships, or a G80 for that matter, would also be smart enough enough not to pay attention to "unofficial delays" of any kind. They just don't count.

But I will regrettably stipulate that there remain a few people even today who still believe that they can accept everything they see written on an Internet web page as the Gospel truth, whether it's "official" or it isn't...;)

bwahaha, awesome :lol:

Though, I have to say Walt, THAT marketing idea probably helped nVidia the corporation and their shareholders quite a bit....just not the consumer. *shrug* for what it's worth.

Do you think it worth to wait for ATI/AMD to release the R600 ...
 

... or it makes more sense to get a new DirectX 10 graphics card now?

I have to admit I'm surprised by the poll results here (>3800 votes):

http://www.xbitlabs.com/

which currently show:

• I’ll wait for R600 before making a purchase decision - 1360 (35.8%)
• I’ll get a new DX10 board as soon as the price is right - 615 (16.2%)
• I already own a GeForce 8800 - 434 (11.4%)
• It worth to wait till the games that take advantage of DX10 emerge - 1016 (26.7%)
• I am satisfied with my integrated/low-end graphics adapter - no plans for a new one - 375 (9.9%)

What's surprising is a lot of people are still waiting for R600 before deciding. Will they wait another ~5 weeks or will G84/86 tempt them?...

Jawed

Correction: SP1 does not include DX10 support for FS10. There is a seperate DX10 patch being developed that will be released sometime after SP1 (now sadly not expected until 2008).

Jawed, keep in mind that the "waiting" statistics will be inflated by those people who would not have bought an R600 by now even if it was released earlier. And those who still won't buy one after release. Note how many people claim to be waiting for high-end hardware then end up buying nothing or a mid-range variant.

Even the price is right crowd will wait to see ATI's mid-range offerings after G84/G86 come to market.

I think the poll is worded to take into account all those factors.

It is not a "who is going to buy an R600?" poll. But people might make up their mind what to do based on the next NVidia parts, because the prices will be "unignorable". (Though I admit the performance shown on Hardware Zone could be off-putting, if it turns out true.)

~21% have already decided something: 11% have bought 8800GTX and 10% won't buy anything any time soon.

Jawed

Link for that? The blog post said that DX10 patch is being developed in the same team as SP1, and at least I understood from something in there that they would be released at the same time?

No what I'm saying is that some of the 35% who chose "waiting for R600" are probably also waiting for more affordable hardware and DX10 games (which are two other categories). What would you have considered an unsurprising number - it seems pretty reasonable given where we are today.