Revolution release date revealed?

[pipo]

To make things even more interesting...

Nintendo will ship the Revolution console in June of 2006, it was revealed to SPOnG overnight, with technology and manufacturing partners letting slip Nintendo’s plans for a shock global launch.

It was thought that Nintendo would keep with tradition and deliver a staggered home console launch, with the US following Japan, and Europe keeping up the rear, as it were. This will not be the case. Rising to the challenge set by Microsoft’s Xbox 360, all territories will see launch within a month. A global roll-out with Japan, the US and Europe seeing hardware in the same day is thought highly unlikely.

“As of early October this year, we had agreed with all key partners that a global ship date of June 2006 was achievable,� said one of SPOnG 's several sources associated with the Revolution manufacturing process. “Nintendo will get the launch in Japan and America and Europe as close as possible. It will be like the Xbox 360 launch, only tighter.�

“Everyone at Nintendo in all territories is now focusing on a global launch in June of next year,� another highly-placed source told us yesterday afternoon, under terms of anonymity. “The European launch might slip into July, but that’s it. Everyone at Nintendo has been briefed for this date and the official release schedule everyone is working to shows Revolution down for June 2006; this is simply a matter of fact.�

More http://news.spong.com/detail/news.asp?prid=9244&cb=0.7055475

[Carl B]

Wow, if true Nintendo must be *pissed* that this news was let slip! But, that being said - awesome!

[Shifty Geezer]

Luckily for Nintendo it was 'leaked' to Spong, so no-one with sense will believe it even if true :p

[pipo]

:lol:

Spong has a pretty good track record when it comes to Nintendo rumors though...

[Bohdy]

Sorry, but Spong...

[McHuj]

:lol:

Spong has a pretty good track record when it comes to Nintendo rumors though...


as bad as they are they did know about the gameboy micro and that the revolution controller would be show at tgs.

although, maybe its just me remembering what they got right and selectively forgeting what they got wrong.

i hope this is true.

[dukmahsik]

well IF this is true then it's good news for MS as sony and ninty will be battling it out during the same timespan.

[pipo]

It does put some extra pressure on Sony with regards to a global launch too...

[Powderkeg]

:lol:

Spong has a pretty good track record when it comes to Nintendo rumors though...


Megaton!!!

[Shifty Geezer]

Dunno how true that is. The main concern is long-term supply. If Nintendo release with 1 million in each region and PS3 launches with 3 million in Japan, Sony will be able to keep supplying Japan while Revolutions are spread throughout the rest of the world. Then 6 months later when supply has ramped up the smallish installed base in other countries won't matter as much as how quickly units are sold.

Or to look at it another way, what's the advantage to launching worldwide? If you can fabricate n million units, why is it better to spread those around the world then concentrate them in one market? How much impact will 2 million units (of Revolution or XB360) in the EU have if PS3 launches there later? I can only think of keeping the software developers happy, who aren't going to be pleased to write software for a home market on a machine that isn't launching. How likely is that scenario? Are Ninja Theory developing HS only to have it finished and waiting a year to be launched outside of Japan?

[Powderkeg]

Dunno how true that is.

It's spong, which means it's 99.9999999% chance it's totally false.

[pipo]

I think he was referring to the global launch...

Which I think is a tricky subject. IMHO it's the best scenario, but it only matters when they're able to ship significant numbers of course.

And as long as we're talking Japan, the DS proved that software titles still make all the difference.

[Carl B]

Well, Nintendo went a somewhat similar route with the DS launch, and that seemed to pan out for them. Certainly to me it at least sounds plausible, and with foreign markets as important as they are to Nintendo's bottom-line (despite lagging the other consoles in penetration), I could envision Nintendo moving to a worldwide launch model. Again they really set the bar for such anyway with the DS, despite the Euro-lag. If the components are of the system are as inexpensive as has been rumored, meeting volume demands shouldn't be too difficult.

Anyway, if it's in Spong it's no more or less newsworthy than if it's anywhere else - it's not like Spong tries to deceive afterall. :razz:

[Shifty Geezer]

Well, Nintendo went a somewhat similar route with the DS launch, and that seemed to pan out for them.That's an interesting analogy. We have DS vs. PSP, one with a global launch and one with regional launches, including a protracted delay until a UK release. How much did DS trump PSP because of this? To my mind, it didn't. People who would buy DS bought regardless. People who bought PSP bought regardless. It's not like people wanting PSP but waiting decided to get DS instead.

Now of course DS and PSP are quite different platforms. Certainly more diverse than the next-gen consoles in what they offer. And I'm sure some people just wanting some portble gameplay saw DS before PSP was released and maybe bought DS where, if PSP had been on the shelves at the same time, may have gone with the PSP instead. But I think such people are the extreme minority, and when these consoles launch and the people buying are early adopters, they all know what they want and will buy it regardless. I don't think anyone in the EU waiting for PS3 will buy the competitors if PS3 takes too long to appear. The only people who'lldo that are undecided, and these people don't usually make up the launch.first year buyers from what I understand.

Seeing also have MS have said they may well have chosen differently to a worldwide launch if they 'knew what they were getting into' this is an intersting (if true) direction for Nintendo to take. I'm not sure what they'd hope to get out of the extra effort (as MS testifies to) involved.

[Deepak]

...it was revealed to SPOnG overnight

:lol: ROTF

I never laughed this much in my life.

[StefanS]

From Nintendo's hotline:

Nintendo of America's game counseling hotline, the Nintendo Power Line (425-885-7529), also features news on upcoming games and systems. If you listen to the current version of their news section, you can select an option to hear about the next-generation Revolution console. It features an introduction that contains a very interesting piece of information. Here's a word-for-word transcript:

"As the company with the strongest heritage of innovation, Nintendo moves the bar for all next-gen systems by employing a wide-ranging strategy that will attract more kinds of gamers to more kinds of games. When Nintendo's new console, codenamed Revolution, arrives in the later half of 2006, everyone will discover the meaning of all-access gaming."

http://www.planetgamecube.com/news.cfm?action=item&id=6587

So SPONG could be right, (for the first time! I guess the universe will collapse soon)

[Dr Evil]

So SPONG could be right, (for the first time! I guess the universe will collapse soon)

except that June is in the first half of 2006..., but offcourse they could still be right if it comes out in June.

[Powderkeg]

From Nintendo's hotline:

http://www.planetgamecube.com/news.cfm?action=item&id=6587

So SPONG could be right, (for the first time! I guess the universe will collapse soon)

Nothing there suggests spong is right. That's Nintendo of America, and we pretty much all knew the PS3 would show up in the Americas in fall 2006.

[Mefisutoferesu]

Pretending that SPoNG has a clue... is this a good thing? I mean yeah, worldwide is nice, but in June that could put them up against a Sony launch, and while I love Nintendo... realisically, that's not exactly a safe situation for them. You don't go up against the King unless you've got an angry mob behind you, and I don't see any reason to dethrone Sony at the moment.

[c_k_i_t]

SPONG did have something right, well according to Gamespot, Revolution will have a worldwide release sometime after march 2006:
http://www.gamespot.com/news/6136453.html

[Carl B]

Ok well there we go then:

Talking about the Revolution in an interview with Nikkei Business, Iwata stated, "I can only say that it's coming out during 2006, but it will be after the current fiscal year. We hope to make it a simultaneous worldwide release as much as it's possible."

[Powderkeg]

Thought this was an interesting comment from Iwata in that Gamespot report.

"It [the Revolution] would be a complete failure if we didn't sell more units than the Nintendo GameCube,"

So, now we know what Nintendo considers to be a complete failure, and apparently that is anything less than where they are now.

[london-boy]

Thought this was an interesting comment from Iwata in that Gamespot report.



So, now we know what Nintendo considers to be a complete failure, and apparently that is anything less than where they are now.


**But they're making a profit!!!!11**

[Teasy]

So, now we know what Nintendo considers to be a complete failure, and apparently that is anything less than where they are now

Every company aims to improve from one generation to the next. Not to mention Revolution is aimed at gaining new customers. Therefore anything less then GC's users plus new users would obviously be a failure of the whole "Revolution" concept. Iwata's words have little direct correlation to GameCubes situation.

[Shifty Geezer]

So, now we know what Nintendo considers to be a complete failure, and apparently that is anything less than where they are now.No, they would regard the current level of GC sales for Revolution as a failure of Revolution. And that's not hard to see why. They believe there's a huge untapped market out there which they think will flock to Revolution. If they only make 20 million sales in 5 years, even making a trillion dollars profit, it shows their belief was wrong and their philosophy failed. I'm sure Nintendo would have loved the GC to do better than it has, but it hasn't driven the company to ruin so I doubt they consider it an absolute flop. GC's purpose was to make more money for Nintendo from the existing market. Rev's purpose is to make money on a new market, and on that it needs to be judged.

[london-boy]

No, they would regard the current level of GC sales for Revolution as a failure of Revolution. And that's not hard to see why. They believe there's a huge untapped market out there which they think will flock to Revolution. If they only make 20 million sales in 5 years, even making a trillion dollars profit, it shows their belief was wrong and their philosophy failed. I'm sure Nintendo would have loved the GC to do better than it has, but it hasn't driven the company to ruin so I doubt they consider it an absolute flop. GC's purpose was to make more money for Nintendo from the existing market. Rev's purpose is to make money on a new market, and on that it needs to be judged.

Well now now, i'm sure that if they make 1 trillion, they won't even care about games consoles anymore! They'd go for private space holidays business. Or something like that. Advertised by Mario.

[Teasy]

But they're making a profit!!!!11

Good point, your absolutely right there. Though I think you should try to post in a more calm manor, that post made you look a little bit fan-boyish, just FYI.

[london-boy]

Good point, your absolutely right there. Though I think you should try to post in a more calm manor, that post made you look a little bit fan-boyish, just FYI.

It was a sarcastic post. Making fun of the people who will come in and just tell us how Nintendo are making a profit so it doesn't really matter if they sell a lot or not.

[Teasy]

I wasn't being serious london-boy :D

[london-boy]

I wasn't being serious london-boy :D

Totally! I knew that!! Err..:oops:

[Powderkeg]

Every company aims to improve from one generation to the next. Not to mention Revolution is aimed at gaining new customers. Therefore anything less then GC's users plus new users would obviously be a failure of the whole "Revolution" concept. Iwata's words have little direct correlation to GameCubes situation.

I wasn't referring to the Gamecube other than to say that is where the line is drawn between success and failure. If the Revolution sells like the GCN, it will be a failure. Not only a failure, but a complete failure.

[Powderkeg]

No, they would regard the current level of GC sales for Revolution as a failure of Revolution.

Why do you say "no" and then agree with me?

I made no claim that the current generation was a failure, only that the current numbers would represent a complete failure next-gen.

It's something to keep in mind, because companies rarely continue following a path that led them to complete failure. It sounds to me that if the Revolution doesn't sell better than the GCN that Nintendo may be in for some heavy restructuring in their future console strategies.

[Shifty Geezer]

Sorry powderkeg. Read ya wrong.

[Li Mu Bai]

Some important aspects to consider when reading this news forrumites: (directed towards anyone even considering this to be even partially factual)

-A worldwide June launch a mere month after its official "coming out party" at E3?

-Launching 2 months after the LOZ:TP would represent somewhat of a conflict of software interests imo as TP is not a next-generation title, the Revolution's software launch will be. 20-21 million+ GCs will have sold by then ww, all of these consumers may not be picking up a Rev upon release or at all for that matter. Backwards compatability has no meaning for them, but the upcoming TP does.

-Last but certainly not least, the source. Despite their intentions, the site's credibility for news of this magnitude is very seriously in doubt. An erroneous track record has been established for reliable information over the years, many more misses than actual hits.

[DemoCoder]

I have a sneaky suspicion that Revolution's GPU will be an R520 or R580 equivalent given the timeline.

[V3]

I have a sneaky suspicion that Revolution's GPU will be an R520 or R580 equivalent given the timeline.

Lets hope that's true, my worry is that it will only have hardwired T&L and combiner.

[Li Mu Bai]

Lets hope that's true, my worry is that it will only have hardwired T&L and combiner.

Be serious V3, the Broadway GPU will certainly be advanced enough. It's the Rev's dedicated Hollywood CPU is its weak point comparatively speaking, or so I've been told.

[Teasy]

Powderkeg, so you weren't trying to say that Iwata's comment shows that Nintendo consider GameCube to be a complete failure? Sounded like it to me, but if you say so then ok.

Lets hope that's true, my worry is that it will only have hardwired T&L and combiner.

Why would you worry about that V3? There's no reason or logic behind the idea.

Be serious V3, the Broadway GPU will certainly be advanced enough. It's the Rev's dedicated Hollywood CPU is its weak point comparatively speaking, or so I've been told.

Broadway is the CPU and Hollywood is the GPU.

[pc999]

I have a sneaky suspicion that Revolution's GPU will be an R520 or R580 equivalent given the timeline.

Why put a hi rez beast in a console that is not suposed (as standard, at least) do HDTV:?:, probably making a shader intensive (I hope for a "GPGPU" ready one) GPU would make much more sense IMO.

Plus, unless it is a very moddified version, that probably would generate to much heat.

[Guden Oden]

-Launching 2 months after the LOZ:TP would represent somewhat of a conflict of software interests imo as TP is not a next-generation title]
Different markets. One doesn't neccessarily interfere with the other. Besides, Rev is backwards compatible, or so they say anyway. Or perhaps the game is delayed because it's being updated for Rev and will be released for both formats! *wild stary Doc Brown look*

[pc999]

I dont see nothing wrong with a june release, right after E3 will be perfect, people will be very interesting in knowing the new games/consoles (and they will still with the lot of games overall, Rev or not, as always), plus there are holydays people want to try new things and do have more money and time, so it is a good time to people will try new games/consoles with their friends (and meybe buy for them too), and at that time they may get 65nm, which for them would be a big win (once that their ratio of performance/cost/power is even smaller).

In a bussiness sense I think that it is a great date and in my personal opinion I like it too.

[Li Mu Bai]

Broadway is the CPU and Hollywood is the GPU.

Thanks, I always seem to misassign the correct names oddly enough.

Different markets. One doesn't neccessarily interfere with the other. Besides, Rev is backwards compatible, or so they say anyway. Or perhaps the game is delayed because it's being updated for Rev and will be released for both formats! *wild stary Doc Brown look*

It's not "so they say," it is Guden. As I stated earlier for many, b/c is neither a concern nor consideration. It's been delayed to actually finish its development & implement the many new game ideas that cropped up along the way making it more & more ambitious. (as well as delivering upon Aonuma's & Miyamoto's claims) Nintendo's most ambitious software endeavour to date, (esp. monetarily so) various motion-capturing & what should be a fully orchestrated score. Do not believe for a moment that Nintendo would prematurely cannibalize its sales.

I dont see nothing wrong with a june release, right after E3 will be perfect, people will be very interesting in knowing the new games/consoles (and they will still with the lot of games overall, Rev or not, as always), plus there are holydays people want to try new things and do have more money and time, so it is a good time to people will try new games/consoles with their friends (and meybe buy for them too), and at that time they may get 65nm, which for them would be a big win (once that their ratio of performance/cost/power is even smaller).

In a bussiness sense I think that it is a great date and in my personal opinion I like it too.

Sadly, (as well as beneficially for the Rev's Hollywood GPU & the quality & diversity of their software launch lineup) this will not take place. Expect a very late launch, perhaps following even close after that of the PS3. Even Perrin Kaplan's recent IGN comments lend credence to what I've been hearing. Late 3rd to early 4th qtr. launches. Good reasoning though pc, "strike the hammer while the iron is hot" type of business philosophy. But the Nintendo software history dls must be voted & decided upon, (as well as which titles to enhance) various popular 3rd parties will be approached & recruited as well, (Square-Enix, Capcom, Konami, etc.) the Wi-Fi interface & implementation must be flawless, software designed solely around & taking advantage of the the new controller interface, specifically designed peripheral shells, etc. Time consuming to say the very least.

[Qroach]

There is simply no way revoloution is launching in June next year. they don't even have devkits available yet. I had one of my guys out at nintendo on wednesday showing them some stuff we're working on. We asked about revoloution and they said "nobody is getting devkits for it yet, you'd be best to protytpe any games on the gamecube hardware". We asked about information on the new hardware and they said "All nitnendo is willing to release is the same information already on the internet"

Another friend of mine is flying to Japan to discuss a new game with Nintendo, and he already told me nintnedo doesn't have the hardware yet. he seemed to think the hardware specs weren't settled on yet. so I wouldn't expect any sort of miracle launch in june next year. I think the earliest we can see it is the fall 2006.

the fact nobody has devkits yet, makes me certain that they aren't launching in June.

[Guden Oden]

It's not "so they say," it is Guden.]
Since it's not even finished I think it's a little too early to tell if it is or not just yet.

Do not believe for a moment that Nintendo would prematurely cannibalize its sales.
I don't care how ambitious Nintendo claims this game is going to be, I don't believe for a moment they would let their entire next generation platorm hinge upon the release of ONE SINGLE GAME of the current (and dying) generation!

That'd be just plain crazy.

[BlueTsunami]

So if they do release (as rumored) on this schedule, the most likely scenario is good first party titles and very bad 3rd party titles. I don't remember, at all, Gamecubes launch and what titles came out for it at that time. Also, 3rd party developers are going to have to wrap their heads around how the Rev controller should be utilized :/

[pc999]

So taking in acount what you said

The bad:
1- They will make wait even more:evil: .
2- Go against MS and S in Xmas time, taking in acount that their are 2 markting beasts, plus they will have a good advance (assuming PS3 at ~Q1/2), this also may be bad for getting gamers how already have a next gen console as they will probably want games too, and after all they may losse the price advanage once that Xb should have the core version at 250 or less (unless N go at ~150).

The good:
1- IMO this make 65nm a safe bet, meybe they can make a CPU of equal power, and a GPU of equivalent (720p --->480p) power, at a good price/power.
2- Going at full speed to Xmas time is good for them, people are seeking new things and are receptive to new thinghs so it is a good time to present a radically new thing to the big public (the no gamers).
3- Good line up.


Also, 3rd party developers are going to have to wrap their heads around how the Rev controller should be utilized :/


I think it should be very easy addapat (at least the basics) the Rev controler to any type of game, so if the HW is enought they should be able to get some nice crossplatforms games, at time.

[Li Mu Bai]

There is simply no way revoloution is launching in June next year. they don't even have devkits available yet. I had one of my guys out at nintendo on wednesday showing them some stuff we're working on. We asked about revoloution and they said "nobody is getting devkits for it yet, you'd be best to protytpe any games on the gamecube hardware". We asked about information on the new hardware and they said "All nitnendo is willing to release is the same information already on the internet"

Another friend of mine is flying to Japan to discuss a new game with Nintendo, and he already told me nintnedo doesn't have the hardware yet. he seemed to think the hardware specs weren't settled on yet. so I wouldn't expect any sort of miracle launch in june next year. I think the earliest we can see it is the fall 2006.

the fact nobody has devkits yet, makes me certain that they aren't launching in June.

Actually, that's not entirely true. Japanese & a few western developers close to Nintendo (Namco, Konami recently, Capcom, Square-Enix, Ubi Soft, EA, amongst a few others) are/or have been privy to alpha kits with unfinalized specifications. (two seperate sets are said to still be floating & undecided upon by Takeda, Miyamoto, & ultimately Iwata but the developers are supposedly aware) That is why they are telling developers to start building off of pre-existing GC toolkits, the Nintendo Revolution's internal architecture one can only assume will mirror the GC's enough to have visual enhancements (handled primarly in-hardware) to be added/coded easily enough by the developers with minimal time due to the dedicated GPU instead of the laborious & time consuming handcoding needed for the TEV this time. (If they are indeed still targeting 480P instead of 720P that's 1/3 the number of the pixels so they could produce comparable imagery albeit at a lower native resolution of course)

In fact I remember in an older interview Iwata saying that many aspects they found to be advantageous, innovative, efficient, powerful, etc. within the Flipper/Gekko chipsets would also be making appearances within both the Rev's Broadway & Hollywood counterparts. What those aspects are however are anyone's guess, but I compiled an older GC list I made for possible attributes, of course there will be alterations & resource increases in areas:

:
-Mosys 1-TSRAM with a refresh/latency rate equivalent to, though not surpassing those of conventional SRAM. Main memory system bandwidth: Approximately 10ns Sustainable Latency


-2mb of on-chip embedded RAM Z and framebuffer with 7.5gb dedicated bandwidth. This on-die Z-buffer completely removes all of those accesses from hogging the limited amount of main memory bandwidth the Flipper GPU is granted. 6.2ns suistainable latency (1T-SRAM)

-1mb texture cache with 10.5gb dedicated bandwidth which can hold compressed textures & assists with texture load performance

-Early Z check HSR

-Texture Environment (TEV) which is essentially a pixel shader with extremely flexible texture reads (more so than even the NV2A's) but slightly less flexible combines than the NV2A. (think indirect texturing effects like heat distortion)

-Half the L1 data is locked to keep needed information without wasting reads to L2 cache, and ultimately main memory. The rest of the chip isn't penalized for accesses to the L2 data cache due to the non-blocking cache arrangement. Also, after all the data is transferred, it has to travel back through the L1 and L2 data caches while it makes its way back to the system bus.

So the 64 bit data bus to the processor from the L1 data cache is still 5.6 GB/s, and it is written back to the L2 cache using the remaining bandwidth of the 256-bit connection.

-A 128-byte FIFO write gather pipe accumulates data to be sent in 32-byte bursts to the graphics chip.

-32 byte fill buffer rests between the L2 cache and the L1 cache, and between the L1 cache and the FIFO write gather pipe.

-4:1 vertex compression can be held in the L1 cache, with a small but effective amount still left remaining for decompression.

-Seperate FIFO write gather pipe for bursts of graphics data to main memory while the bus is not busy.

-8 layer multi-texturing per single pass (however extremely fillrate intensive)

-8 hardware lights (global) offered at no computational penalty as they are performed in parallel to other functions

-Flipper does support virtual texturing, which is a fetch on demand for textures

-PPC 750CXE Cpu with additional SIMD functionality. (40 instructions total) Data quantisation inclusive, which simplifies the use of compressed data and in effect ties in with the Gekko when needed for dynamic geometry processing in the system.

-Compresses textures at a 6:1 ratio via S3TC

-EMBM & per-pixel lighting supported in hw

-Trilinear filtering comes at no cost to the Gamecube's texel fillrate

-Gekko utilizes paired single capability

-A few of its features were added in dynamically, like self-shadowing and color tinting to be performed simultaneously with global & local lighting variants

-A FSB frequency that results in a 1.3GB/s connection between Gekko and the North Bridge

-All bus clocks operate in synch with one another, which lends itself to a much lower latency operation (the memory bus is synchronized to the Gekko's FSB and Flipper's operating frequency (162MHz x 2)

That being done I believe Nintendo knows that it needs more continual 3rd party support than the GC ever had, (as they alone cannot support the Rev, even w/lmited exclusives esp. with this new interface) but in order to secure this for the major big budget cross-platform titles that a higher minimum spec. is needed which imo may be leading to the actual hw delays, (deciding upon these exact specifications & even HD considerations) as well as chipset modifications. Getting western devs behind the new controller interface & to create sw for it as well. (at least Molyneux & fpser studios are on-board) Conversely, this doesn't seem to be a deterrant for japanese developers, & I suppose the west wasn't aware of this interview with Miyamoto:

http://www.engadget.com/entry/1234000297061506/

Miyamoto: From our perspective the Revolution controller is the new controller, everything else is now the classic controller. And with this expansion, you’ll be able to have a classic controller that expands the functionality of the core unit. And to be honest, we’ve already—

Engadget: It’ll have that more traditional form factor?

Miyamoto: Exactly. We’ve got something that would be very similar in style and form to the Wave Bird already complete. What that allows us to do is that we have all of these new features. We have the new functionality of the Wave Bird controller and we have new ways that players will be able to interact with games. But at the same time, we’ve retained all the functionality of the classic-style controller, so that people who are familiar with games and familiar with that style of game play are going to be able to have the types of experiences that they’re expecting, on top of all of these new experiences that they’ve never imagined before.

[pakpassion]

If the console is released this soon, then 2006 will have alot of tri-console fireworks

[Teasy]

On getting third party developers to use the controller properly. Iwata said recently that Nintendo are actually prepared to help third parties develop there games to make use of the controller.

[jvd]

Some important aspects to consider when reading this news forrumites: (directed towards anyone even considering this to be even partially factual)

-A worldwide June launch a mere month after its official "coming out party" at E3?

-Launching 2 months after the LOZ:TP would represent somewhat of a conflict of software interests imo as TP is not a next-generation title, the Revolution's software launch will be. 20-21 million+ GCs will have sold by then ww, all of these consumers may not be picking up a Rev upon release or at all for that matter. Backwards compatability has no meaning for them, but the upcoming TP does.

-Last but certainly not least, the source. Despite their intentions, the site's credibility for news of this magnitude is very seriously in doubt. An erroneous track record has been established for reliable information over the years, many more misses than actual hits.

Zelda will sell no matter what . It could actually sell alot more with the new system being in the mix .

ALot of people who love zelda but no longer own a gamecube or never bought it can pick up the cube dirt cheap or the rev and play the game

[ERP]

If it does launch in June, there is going to be very little in the way of 3rd party support. Just going from what devs currently know about revolution.
Also why launch in June, when in at least two of the territories Xmas sales are king?
Now Nintendo might do this, but it doesn't strike me as the best time for a launch.

[Qroach]

Li Mu Bai

Actually, that's not entirely true. Japanese & a few western developers close to Nintendo (Namco, Konami recently, Capcom, Square-Enix, Ubi Soft, EA, amongst a few others) are/or have been privy to alpha kits with unfinalized specifications.

Well like i said that came from nintendo, and a friend of mine working with nintendo of japan directly. ERP confirm seems to think the same thing...

[Ty]

Zelda will sell no matter what . It could actually sell alot more with the new system being in the mix .

ALot of people who love zelda but no longer own a gamecube or never bought it can pick up the cube dirt cheap or the rev and play the game

This is going off-topic but I just don't think Zelda is going to do anything to sell units - Revolution or GCN. The only way, imo, it might sell Rev unit is if it has something special for it, like the ability to use the controller to swing the sword or other implements (in other words, not just using the Rev as backwards compatible).

Pushing the GCN? Too little, too late. Those people that like Nintendo-type games (like myself) already have a GCN.

[pipo]

Now Nintendo might do this, but it doesn't strike me as the best time for a launch.

QFT.

[Squeak]

If it does launch in June, there is going to be very little in the way of 3rd party support. Just going from what devs currently know about revolution.
Also why launch in June, when in at least two of the territories Xmas sales are king?
Now Nintendo might do this, but it doesn't strike me as the best time for a launch.
Because waiting a year to release a technically slightly inferior machine, just when the competition has gained momentum and an installed base would be suicide.
Nintendo needs to release as soon as Mario revolution is finished and not a moment sooner.

Xmas is not *that* important anymore, games sell well all year round.

[Metal]

I'm still curious about what I'm going to see on screen from this console. I just wonder how much weaker it might be to the competition. I also find it curious the timing of this with the delay of the new Zelda game. Would make since to abandon the Cube and move it to the revolution. Especially if the technological jump from GameCube to Revolution isn't that big with the new controller interactivity being the selling point for the system.

[dukmahsik]

Good thing for MS as this will leave Sony and Ninty duking it out

[jvd]

This is going off-topic but I just don't think Zelda is going to do anything to sell units - Revolution or GCN. The only way, imo, it might sell Rev unit is if it has something special for it, like the ability to use the controller to swing the sword or other implements (in other words, not just using the Rev as backwards compatible).

Pushing the GCN? Too little, too late. Those people that like Nintendo-type games (like myself) already have a GCN.

I think you forget zelda's importance. Zelda is a huge title for nintendo. I know personaly (and i know it doesnt' account for to much but ) that want zelda but felt picking up the gamecube this year (when it was still coming out this year ) was a waste of time but when they heard the rev would be backwards compatible they were excited feeling they could get the rev and the new games the controller would bring and also some of the gems esp zelda from the gamecube for cheap .


As for zelda pushing the cube i don't think it matters. I'm just saying that zelda will make people buy nintendo systems that can run it .

[Shifty Geezer]

Good thing for MS as this will leave Sony and Ninty duking it outBecause the release of a stronger branded and more powerful console, and unique controller+cheaper console, won't have the slightest impact on XB360 sales...?I'm sure MS just can't wait for the opposition to launch.

[dukmahsik]

Because the release of a stronger branded and more powerful console, and unique controller+cheaper console, won't have the slightest impact on XB360 sales...?I'm sure MS just can't wait for the opposition to launch.

yes that's exactly what i said /sarcasm

[jvd]

Because the release of a stronger branded and more powerful console, and unique controller+cheaper console, won't have the slightest impact on XB360 sales...?I'm sure MS just can't wait for the opposition to launch.

Depends on how many consoles nintendo and sony can ship. I tmay have no affect on ms

[Urian]

I believe that will be NEC who marks the date and the design of the console is finished.

If Revolution is a 90nm system we will see it before than if it a 65nm system. But I believe that it will be 90nm, the reason is the MoSys 1T-SRAM and the maximum manufacturation process from NEC that supports it the 90nm.

http://www.epn-online.com/page/12780/1t-sram-q-technology-ported-to-nec-s-90nm-standard-logic-process.html

[Shifty Geezer]

Depends on how many consoles nintendo and sony can ship. I tmay have no affect on msIt's bound to steal mindshare. I'm sure there'll be people who walk into a game store and see either PS3 or Revolution and put off getting that XB360 as a result. Even if there's a shortage of hardware it's likely people who are swayed will save their money for later. eg. If the next Mario game has super-whizzmatastic control with the Rev controller and someone wants that, they'll wait for it rather than buy XB360. Yet if Revolution doesn't appear in the shops that same customer might see XB360's great graphics and buy on of those instead, never knowing that they'd prefer to save their cash for Revolution.

As I see it tThere's no way two consoles launching with have no effect on sales on XB360.

[Li Mu Bai]

If it does launch in June, there is going to be very little in the way of 3rd party support. Just going from what devs currently know about revolution.
Also why launch in June, when in at least two of the territories Xmas sales are king?
Now Nintendo might do this, but it doesn't strike me as the best time for a launch.

Which is precisely why this launch time frame isn't going to happen ERP. Nintendo will/are going to be courting as much 3rd party western support as humanly possibe, the eastern support is already there.

Well like i said that came from nintendo, and a friend of mine working with nintendo of japan directly. ERP confirm seems to think the same thing...

I'm not disagreeing with you at all Quincy, the specs have yet to be finalized. But certain development studios have a range of what to expect, as I've stated before my buddy works for the Treehouse & my brother-in-law at NST. Yes Guden, b/c with the GC is a reality, I wasn't correcting you simply for the sake of doing so. I'm not claiming to be any sort of insider, they just drop info to me that won't jeopardize their NDAs. Other things they are much more cryptic about, leaving it open for me to speculate on.

I'm still curious about what I'm going to see on screen from this console. I just wonder how much weaker it might be to the competition. I also find it curious the timing of this with the delay of the new Zelda game. Would make since to abandon the Cube and move it to the revolution. Especially if the technological jump from GameCube to Revolution isn't that big with the new controller interactivity being the selling point for the system.

It isn't being designed with any of the Rev's functionality in mind, & for the bilionth time it is a GC game & won't be jumping platforms. A 20-21 million+ installed userbase is certainly nothing to overlook, the majority of the LOZ:TPs sales will come from this base, & you certainly don't know what you're talking about by assuming the technological jump won't be "that big" Mr. Kaplan simply due to the new controller interface. It will be worthy of its next-gen designation.

Because waiting a year to release a technically slightly inferior machine, just when the competition has gained momentum and an installed base would be suicide.
Nintendo needs to release as soon as Mario revolution is finished and not a moment sooner.

Xmas is not *that* important anymore, games sell well all year round.

Suicide wouldn't apply with a platform that truly differentiates itself, (interface control) has a lower price-point, free online, easier & not as cost prohibitive to develop for, etc. I believe you need to re-check your hardware & software % sales numbers in regards to Xmas as well.

[jvd]

It's bound to steal mindshare. I'm sure there'll be people who walk into a game store and see either PS3 or Revolution and put off getting that XB360 as a result. Even if there's a shortage of hardware it's likely people who are swayed will save their money for later. eg. If the next Mario game has super-whizzmatastic control with the Rev controller and someone wants that, they'll wait for it rather than buy XB360. Yet if Revolution doesn't appear in the shops that same customer might see XB360's great graphics and buy on of those instead, never knowing that they'd prefer to save their cash for Revolution.

As I see it tThere's no way two consoles launching with have no effect on sales on XB360.

Or it can be someone who walks into a store with 500$ . He can buy a xbox 360 premium at 400$ plus 5 games or a ps3 and 2 games or whatever nitendos pricing will be

Remember next holiday season xbox 360 launch titles will be dirt cheap as will other games released through out the year. So even if there is no price drop on the hardware itself ms will still have the pricing advantage .

I'm sure that ps3 will get alot of looks . But will that looking turn into lost sales for ms .

[pc999]

I think that Li Mu Bai has the point here,what if it do have inferior spec but you dont see it as from 480p to 720p you may need to have nice coditions to see the difference (ie in a store with bad light for the purpose, on a normal TV etc..., remember that at pixel pipes they only need 1/3 at the same speed as low as ~6 pipes (compared to a X1800 for example)), but the price is 1/2; the games may also be cheaper; the console being unique it can be a great Xmas buy/present; plus remember that for the first time some games like a "real" SW light sabers games (eg) can be made and that alone would make a lot of buyers for Rev ,this can make gamers wit things; also a very probable 65nm.

I always thought that this gen (all) as going to release to soon, at least nintendo can make put themselfs on a differnt path, that allows them liberty, and they have the chances to use it.

[Ty]

I think you forget zelda's importance. Zelda is a huge title for nintendo. I know personaly (and i know it doesnt' account for to much but ) that want zelda but felt picking up the gamecube this year (when it was still coming out this year ) was a waste of time but when they heard the rev would be backwards compatible they were excited feeling they could get the rev and the new games the controller would bring and also some of the gems esp zelda from the gamecube for cheap .


As for zelda pushing the cube i don't think it matters. I'm just saying that zelda will make people buy nintendo systems that can run it .


Well the same argument could (and was in fact) made, that Mario, Metriod Prime, etc. are huge draws for Nintendo. And I don't disagree with that (though obviously WW wasn't enough to propel the GCN very far) but I personally don't think Zelda now will do much for getting more GCNs into homes - it's simply just too late to matter. Revs? I guess it might but really it should have something special tied into the Rev for maximum effect.

In the end, I think we agree that Zelda won't save the GCN but disagree as to it's effect upon Revolution uptake. /shrug - we won't know till we know. :)

[Li Mu Bai]

The LOZ:TP doesn't have to attempt to do what cannot be done, it simply has to sell over 3 million+ units (or perhaps even considerably moreso with its mainstream aesthetic appeal & consumer anticipation) which it will do so with ease. Heck TWW is over 4 millon ww already iirc. Coincedentally, this isn't Nintendo's only promising GC release for '06. Baten Kaitos II, (looks beautiful, much better than the 1st imo) 2 Naruto fighters, (JPN's upcoming 4th iteration & its sequel) Kirby platformer, (utilizing the SSB:M engine) & some as of yet unannounced titles.

[Li Mu Bai]

Or it can be someone who walks into a store with 500$ . He can buy a xbox 360 premium at 400$ plus 5 games or a ps3 and 2 games or whatever nitendos pricing will be

Remember next holiday season xbox 360 launch titles will be dirt cheap as will other games released through out the year. So even if there is no price drop on the hardware itself ms will still have the pricing advantage .

I'm sure that ps3 will get alot of looks . But will that looking turn into lost sales for ms .

jvd, you don't truly believe that the launching of 2 brand new consoles & their prerequisite "must-have" exclusive software will not seriously affect both the 360's mind as well as marketshare do you? Not that they are remotely in the same boat, but I remember the DC's games (many being superior to the PS2's launch line-up) being drastically discounted as well, it made absolutely no difference. 360 Launch titles will be dirt cheap next holiday? Are you certain? How long did Halo take to drop in price again? Any popular title with continously strong sales will remain at the same price point, (especially factoring in their production costs) only shovelware or those titles that have underperformed sales-wise will be "dirt cheap." Yes, those looks that the PS3/Rev receive will translate directly into lost sales for MS. You must be realistic here jvd.

So there is no pricing advantage in essence, & certainly not anything to deter the purchase of the newer consoles.

[Mefisutoferesu]

You know, I think sometimes little kids are a lot smarter than we believe... remember this?

"First is the worst, second is the best, third is the one with the treasure chest!!"

Dreamcast failed
Sony ruled
and Nintendo made all the money

It'd be pretty funny if life broke down to nothing more than nursery rhymes...

[Shifty Geezer]

In the UK it's "Third the one with the Hairy Chest". Hence XB360 is the worst hardware, PS3 the best, and Revolution will...be released with...a fuzzy overcoat...:???:

[PC-Engine]

Just want to give a hypothetical situation here. Let's say you're running a game on a PC with a X1800 GPU at 720x480 resolution with all features on then you change the resolution to 1280x720 with all features on. Will you see any difference in the visual effects? Will you see much difference in the resolution with AA enabled?

As for Zelda, I hope they thow in some Revolution specific treats onto the GOD.

[pc999]

Just want to give a hypothetical situation here. Let's say you're running a game on a PC with a X1800 GPU at 720x480 resolution with all features on then you change the resolution to 1280x720 with all features on. Will you see any difference in the visual effects? Will you see much difference in the resolution with AA enabled?

As for Zelda, I hope they thow in some Revolution specific treats onto the GOD.

If the effects are the same the only difference should be the fremerate (aside the better qualittity of image overall).

About the AA there is a old thread about it.

[Metal]

It isn't being designed with any of the Rev's functionality in mind, & for the bilionth time it is a GC game & won't be jumping platforms. A 20-21 million+ installed userbase is certainly nothing to overlook, the majority of the LOZ:TPs sales will come from this base, & you certainly don't know what you're talking about by assuming the technological jump won't be "that big" Mr. Kaplan simply due to the new controller interface. It will be worthy of its next-gen designation.

My post was complete speculation on my part, and I framed it as such. I don't think I need to be reminded from a GAFER that "I don't know what I'm talking about" when I clearly never stated I was coming to the table with clear facts. Perhaps you could learn something from my posting style. It's the way the internet was before the ******s invaded the forums.

[Belmontvedere]

What about price? A launch price below $200 would be excellent. Definitely below $300.

[Li Mu Bai]

My post was complete speculation on my part, and I framed it as such. I don't think I need to be reminded from a GAFER that "I don't know what I'm talking about" when I clearly never stated I was coming to the table with clear facts. Perhaps you could learn something from my posting style. It's the way the internet was before the ******s invaded the forums.

No you did not frame it as speculation, it was your own opinion presented & there was no clear fact ever presented. Look at who joined here 1st, whether you were a lurker here before or not. pcostabel, panajev, ERP, as well as many respected others also post on the GAF boards. So are they somewhat beneath you now as well? This "GAFFER" (btw I'm not there any longer) also has access to sources that you do not, so that is why I corrected your opinion. I also figured you were trolling subtetly, my mistake.

[Powderkeg]

What about price? A launch price below $200 would be excellent. Definitely below $300.

Price and what the system is go hand in hand, so it depends on what you think the system will be.

If you think it's something very similar to the PS3 or 360 in power and has that controller that is certainly more expensive to produce than a standard gamepad then you should expect it to be in the $300 range. Anything below that is unrealistic unless you also think Nintendo is willing to take a big loss on the hardware.

If you think Nintendo is willing to make some sacrifices in certain hardware to save on manufacturing costs then they could easily launch at the $200 price point.

[pc999]

Would the 720p ---> 480p make less need for pixelpipes, high speed memory (memory capacity also if they will use lower rez tex, normal maps etc...) which is some of the most , lower capacity power suply there quite a few places here they can spend much less money than S or MS.

[Powderkeg]

Would the 720p ---> 480p make less need for pixelpipes, high speed memory (memory capacity also if they will use lower rez tex, normal maps etc...) which is some of the most , lower capacity power suply there quite a few places here they can spend much less money than S or MS.

Yes, they could use a lesser GPU and less RAM and still look "as good" as their competition if they stick to 480p as a maximum resolution.

Of course, "Ass good" is entirely subjective. I doubt you'll find very many PC gamers that think 640X480 looks "as good" as 1024X768 even when running the exact same game with the same settings.

[london-boy]

Yes, they could use a lesser GPU and less RAM and still look "as good" as their competition if they stick to 480p as a maximum resolution.

Of course, "Ass good" is entirely subjective. I doubt you'll find very many PC gamers that think 640X480 looks "as good" as 1024X768 even when running the exact same game with the same settings.

:lol: Was that on purpose?

[Powderkeg]

:lol: Was that on purpose?

No, but it is funny. :lol:

[pc999]

Yes, they could use a lesser GPU and less RAM and still look "as good" as their competition if they stick to 480p as a maximum resolution.

Of course, "Ass good" is entirely subjective. I doubt you'll find very many PC gamers that think 640X480 looks "as good" as 1024X768 even when running the exact same game with the same settings.

Taking in account that most gamers (~90%(+?), meybe even more if they really got new gamers), would never see the difference while gaming (at least for some time) one can argue that it is a good trade off, of curse those how will play on HDTV may not think that...

[Powderkeg]

Taking in account that most gamers (~90%(+?), meybe even more if they really got new gamers), would never see the difference while gaming (at least for some time) one can argue that it is a good trade off, of curse those how will play on HDTV may not think that...

While we are pulling unrealistic figures out of our asses, I'll say that 87.2845 gamers can tell a complex shader instruction from a singple shader instruction just from a screenshot, so clearly the lower resolution won't help Nintendo since everyone will see their lack of power in action.

:roll:


If you can find a person who can't tell the difference between 640X480 and 1024X768 I'll show you someone in desperate need of corrective eye surgery. The difference is not subtle in the least, it's quite clear and dramatic.

[london-boy]

While we are pulling unrealistic figures out of our asses, I'll say that 87.2845 gamers can tell a complex shader instruction from a singple shader instruction just from a screenshot, so clearly the lower resolution won't help Nintendo since everyone will see their lack of power in action.

:roll:


If you can find a person who can't tell the difference between 640X480 and 1024X768 I'll show you someone in desperate need of corrective eye surgery. The difference is not subtle in the least, it's quite clear and dramatic.

Uhm... To someone with a normal 480i CRT TV (still the vastest majority of gamers), it won't matter. He will get the crappy 480i image whatever happens.

But i'm confident HDTVs will penetrate out homes rather quickly.

[pc999]

I said that because most people will not play on HDTV at 720p, but in normal TVs.

That is way most people will not see the diference, plus I think their shaders should have (more or less) the same instructions but thys will need to calculate ~1/3 of the pixel ence the need of less powerfull HW, so to you run the same game at the same fremerate in a (eg) X1800 at 720p you would need only ~1/3 (~6) of the pixelpipes to run it "equaly good"(same shaders) but at 480p (is this what you are talking about, Right?).

[Powderkeg]

Uhm... To someone with a normal 480i CRT TV (still the vastest majority of gamers), it won't matter. He will get the crappy 480i image whatever happens.


Not all 480i images are created equal. Pixar's DVD of The Incredibles is "crappy" 480i on a normal TV, but looks infinitely sharper and more detailed than any video game. Mostly because the source material is much higher resolution that's been downsampled to 480i rather than a native 480i recording.

[london-boy]

Not all 480i images are created equal. Pixar's DVD of The Incredibles is "crappy" 480i on a normal TV, but looks infinitely sharper and more detailed than any video game. Mostly because the source material is much higher resolution that's been downsampled to 480i rather than a native 480i recording.

Obviously. That's where proper AA comes into play.
Field rendered PS2 games looked like ass because they were raw even-and-odd lines output like that. 480i Xbox games with AA looked a lot better.
The 720p resolutions of X360 and PS3 will be completely lost of the majority of HDTV-less people, who will get downsampled images with or without AA applied (still not clear at the moment).

[PC-Engine]

TVs are not as clear and crisp as computer monitors. AA along with the monitor quality factor will make the difference in resolution kinda moot for the majority of gamers.

[Li Mu Bai]

While we are pulling unrealistic figures out of our asses, I'll say that 87.2845 gamers can tell a complex shader instruction from a singple shader instruction just from a screenshot, so clearly the lower resolution won't help Nintendo since everyone will see their lack of power in action.

:roll:


If you can find a person who can't tell the difference between 640X480 and 1024X768 I'll show you someone in desperate need of corrective eye surgery. The difference is not subtle in the least, it's quite clear and dramatic.

And the last HDTV penetration numbers I recall seeing were around 10-15% maximum, & that's solely within the US, ww adoption rates will be significantly smaller (60hz & p-scan anyone?) & take an extremely lengthier amount of time to even reach mainstream levels, even in JPN. So how was pc pulling numbers out of his ass again?

[pipo]

New interview...

Next we asked Merrick about Satoru Iwata's recent comments regarding a possible simultaneous launch for the Revolution. Here's the good news: "With DS, we were 14 weeks, which was the tightest Nintendo has ever been with a console launch and that was an achievement. But with Revolution, we expect to do better than that. That certainly is our goal.

"You know, simultaneous - what's 'simultaneous'? The same day, the same time?" Merrick goes on.

"That probably doesn't even make commercial sense. But within a few weeks of one another, sure."

And here's the even better news: Europe might not get left behind for once.

"We're very serious about trying to be a more global company and not follow the stereotypical formula of Japan first, then the US, then Europe some time later," Merrick says. So does that mean the Revolution could be the first console to launch in Europe first?

"Anything's possible. There are no rules that it must be Japan or US first." Hurrah!

http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=61604

[Shifty Geezer]

Yeah, right! I don't think it makes commercial sense to place the EU first. If you're going to do one territory first it'd be NA, with one language, one packaging, one everything for largest integrated market. Then either EU or home-ground Japan. I'd like to see how they justify a EU first, NA/Japan second/third release schedule. If EU isn't last, it'll be because it's a uniform launch across all territories.

[rabidrabbit]

NA and Japan are more "HD Ready" than EU.
"Revolution" is not "HD Ready" console - EU is still very much a SD territory.
So it just kinda makes sense if they release here first.

[Powderkeg]

NA and Japan are more "HD Ready" than EU.
"Revolution" is not "HD Ready" console - EU is still very much a SD territory.
So it just kinda makes sense if they release here first.

The US is the worlds largest gaming market. Explain how it makes more sense not to launch where you will get the most sales.

[london-boy]

NA and Japan are more "HD Ready" than EU.
"Revolution" is not "HD Ready" console - EU is still very much a SD territory.
So it just kinda makes sense if they release here first.

Nintendo would be out of their minds if they used that as a reason. Thank god you don't work for them. :wink:

[dopefishzzz]

It's hard to believe that Ninentendo won't support HDTV.

Market penetration is growing fast, I saw figures of 30% next year, and 50% in 3 years in the US.

Most HDTV will be LCD, or plasma. Resolution inferior to 720p look like shit (really, I can tell...) on those panel. So anyone with an HDTV CANNOT even CONSIDER a 640 X 480P console.

If Ninentendo added ONLY this feature, they would gain a HUGE market share. I will buy the XBOX360, I WILL buy the PS3, but I WON'T buy the revolution due to lack of HD.
But I would love to give them my money...

Crazy, isn't it...

(and sorry about my so-so english)

[london-boy]

It's hard to believe that Ninentendo won't support HDTV.

Market penetration is growing fast, I saw figures of 30% next year, and 50% in 3 years in the US.

Most HDTV will be LCD, or plasma. Resolution inferior to 720p look like shit (really, I can tell...) on those panel. So anyone with an HDTV CANNOT even CONSIDER a 640 X 480P console.

If Ninentendo added ONLY this feature, they would gain a HUGE market share. I will buy the XBOX360, I WILL buy the PS3, but I WON'T buy the revolution due to lack of HD.
But I would love to give them my money...

Crazy, isn't it...

(and sorry about my so-so english)

DVDs run at 480p (or 480i if you have an old player), and still look 1000000 times better than anything that will come out of next gen consoles. Whether they output crazy resolutions or not.

My point is, it all depends on what's being shown. And crazy levels of AA also help i guess.

[Shifty Geezer]

I was just wandering around town earlier this morning, and poked my nose into a couple of tech stores and eyed up the large HD ready screens. They were showing SD media, and it looked really manky. I've yet to see a large HD screen show a good SD TV picture. Contrast, saturation, general fuzzy-blobbiness, has always been manky on every example I've seen. Maybe just the few places I've gone aren't set up right, but there's no way I'll switch from SD CRT to HD plasma/LCD if they can't handle a nice SD picture.

[london-boy]

I was just wandering around town earlier this morning, and poked my nose into a couple of tech stores and eyed up the large HD ready screens. They were showing SD media, and it looked really manky. I've yet to see a large HD screen show a good SD TV picture. Contrast, saturation, general fuzzy-blobbiness, has always been manky on every example I've seen. Maybe just the few places I've gone aren't set up right, but there's no way I'll switch from SD CRT to HD plasma/LCD if they can't handle a nice SD picture.

Well it all depends what was shown and how it was all connected.

DVDs are SD, but a decent pro-scan player plugged through component or even HDMI will look gorgeous on HDTVs.
Aerial TV is bound to look crap. Also Freeview usually looks sub-par.

[Teasy]

Yeah, right! I don't think it makes commercial sense to place the EU first. If you're going to do one territory first it'd be NA, with one language, one packaging, one everything for largest integrated market. Then either EU or home-ground Japan. I'd like to see how they justify a EU first, NA/Japan second/third release schedule. If EU isn't last, it'll be because it's a uniform launch across all territories.

What justifies a U.S first, Japan second and Europe distant third schedule then?

[rabidrabbit]

Also it depends on the HD display device itself, some are just better at scaling the SD to the HD panel with less artefacts, while some are just crap at that job.
Definitely something to look for when shopping a new HD display.
Of course proper cabling helps too.

[rabidrabbit]

The US is the worlds largest gaming market. Explain how it makes more sense not to launch where you will get the most sales.
Why exactly should a device be launched first in the largest market?

To me Nintendo launching first in EU would make some sense, a lot of sense actually.
I bet the reception for the Revolution would be more positive in EU than in NA.
- In NA the first negative would be the lack of HD, in EU it would probably be overlooked more.
- I think EU in general would be more open-minded for the Revolution than NA. This would put a more positive spin in the Revolution launch and a "better first impression" than if it were launched first in NA, where it would be more "ridiculed" (without a reason of course imo) :)

[london-boy]

Why exactly should a device be launched first in the largest market?

To me Nintendo launching first in EU would make some sense, a lot of sense actually.
I bet the reception for the Revolution would be more positive in EU than in NA.
- In NA the first negative would be the lack of HD, in EU it would probably be overlooked more.
- I think EU in general would be more open-minded for the Revolution than NA. This would put a more positive spin in the Revolution launch and a "better first impression" than if it were launched first in NA, where it would be more "ridiculed" (without a reason of course imo) :)


Seen how Nintendo have done last time around in Europe i can't think why they would release here first, demand is hardly high, or in any way higher than NA or Japan, where i assume demand for Nintendo hardware and software will always be at its peak.

[rabidrabbit]

If they launch in a territory that has no great demand for the console, they can avoid THE SHORTAGES!!! Many points make sense, so many that I'm sure they'll release first in Antarktis.

[london-boy]

If they launch in a territory that has no great demand for the console, they can avoid THE SHORTAGES!!! Many points make sense, so many that I'm sure they'll release first in Antarktis.

Now you're just being silly.

- In NA the first negative would be the lack of HD, in EU it would probably be overlooked more.
Releasing later in the US won't make your supposed "disappointment" any better. In fact, the more they wait, the more the Americans will look at them funny. I mean, release a SD machine in 2006 or in 2007? What's more ridiculous?

- I think EU in general would be more open-minded for the Revolution than NA. This would put a more positive spin in the Revolution launch and a "better first impression" than if it were launched first in NA, where it would be more "ridiculed"

Why would the European be "more open" to Revolution? If anything, it has been shown that European love their Playstations, football and racing games. There is nothing that leads me to think that Europeans would welcome Revolution better than the Japanese (ridiculous to think that would happen) and the Americans. But then again, that was "your opinion without reason" so i can hardly discuss this properly.

[rabidrabbit]

Yeah, that was just my "hunch" or "Intuition" don't slap me so hard.
But someone in Nintendo was rumoured to say so, wasn't it? So there must be some reasoning behind that which I just tried to find.

[london-boy]

Yeah, that was just my "hunch" or "Intuition" don't slap me so hard.
But someone in Nintendo was rumoured to say so, wasn't it? So there must be some reasoning behind that which I just tried to find.

Someone rumoured MS would buy Nintendo.
Someone else rumoured that all developers would jump ship to Xbox and PS2 would fail.
Someone else rumoured that X360 had 256GB/s total bandwidth.
Someone else rumoured that the E3 Killzone video was realtime...

[rabidrabbit]

Then why is this thread 5 pages long? Should it be just "You're wrong!!" - "No. I'm RIGHT!!!" - "No, WRONG!!" page after page instead of trying to find what could be behind those rumours?

[dopefishzzz]

DVDs run at 480p (or 480i if you have an old player), and still look 1000000 times better than anything that will come out of next gen consoles. Whether they output crazy resolutions or not.

My point is, it all depends on what's being shown. And crazy levels of AA also help i guess.

A movie with motion blur is not the same as a fixed res game.

My computer is connected to my HDTV as my main gaming monitor, and I can tell you, that 640 X 480 in a game on my panel is plain ugly. Even with 8xAA.

[london-boy]

Then why is this thread 5 pages long? Should it be just "You're wrong!!" - "No. I'm RIGHT!!!" - "No, WRONG!!" page after page instead of trying to find what could be behind those rumours?

... I thought that WAS how this thread was going. Much like all other threads more or less.

[Rodéric]

Blah!