X360-Maybe the best launch line-up ever?

[Master-Mold]

In my opinion it will be hard to top the Dreamcast launch titles, but for the first time since then I can easily name 5+ games that have a chance to be good/great and I am struggling on which ones to "settle" with.

My top five:

Oblivion
Call of Duty 2
Project Gotham 3
Perfect Dark Zero
Dead or Alive 4

Not sure about but could be good:

Kameo
Ridge Racer 6
NBA 2K6
Madden 06'
Ninety Nine Nights


Not too interested right now:

Dead Rising
Condemed
Quake IV
Tiger Woods 06'
Frame City Killer
Test Drive
Need for Speed


I can't really think of any more, but looking at that alot of games have good potential. At least 3 of those I am pretty sure will be AAA. Oh the agony :???:

[Platon]

The question though is which oneof those are day one launch games. But sure, the xbox360 seems tp have some ppotentialy great game at launch or very near launch...

[Nemo80]

In my opinion it will be hard to top the Dreamcast launch titles, but for the first time since then I can easily name 5+ games that have a chance to be good/great and I am struggling on which ones to "settle" with.

My top five:

Oblivion
Call of Duty 2
Project Gotham 3
Perfect Dark Zero
Dead or Alive 4

Not sure about but could be good:

Kameo
Ridge Racer 6
NBA 2K6
Madden 06'
Ninety Nine Nights


Not too interested right now:

Dead Rising
Condemed
Quake IV
Tiger Woods 06'
Frame City Killer
Test Drive
Need for Speed


I can't really think of any more, but looking at that alot of games have good potential. At least 3 of those I am pretty sure will be AAA. Oh the agony :???:

PGR3 is no launch title. Others in your list also not. And the lineup sucks imo big time. Lots of PC conversions and some not too good 1337 title.

[Master-Mold]

Allright Launch Window titles, as MS puts it.

Plus, I don't see how getting a potentially great game thats has PC roots such as Oblivion or Call of Duty is a bad thing.

Good games are good games regardless of where they come from.

[mesyn191]

PGR3 is no launch title. Others in your list also not. And the lineup sucks imo big time. Lots of PC conversions and some not too good 1337 title.

Hhahaha, no...

[Sis]

PGR3 is no launch title. Others in your list also not. And the lineup sucks imo big time. Lots of PC conversions and some not too good 1337 title.Must be Console Wars Sunday here at B3d. But I'll bite: of the 17 games he listed, 2 of them are PC ports (COD2 and Quake 4). Where's the "lots" parts?

And can you qualify the statement "some not too good 1337" titles? This would allow us to actually have a discourse about it, as opposed to a childish "yes-huh!" "nuh-uh!" thread.

.Sis

[Sis]

In my opinion it will be hard to top the Dreamcast launch titles, but for the first time since then I can easily name 5+ games that have a chance to be good/great and I am struggling on which ones to "settle" with.It is a good lineup. I'm super excited for Kameo--I HOPE it plays as good as some of the demos I've seen.

Question for someone with better memory or search skills than me: What was the official launch lineup for the Dreamcast, particularly in NA? It'd be interesting to compare them.

.Sis

[Nemo80]

Must be Console Wars Sunday here at B3d. But I'll bite: of the 17 games he listed, 2 of them are PC ports (COD2 and Quake 4). Where's the "lots" parts?

And can you qualify the statement "some not too good 1337" titles? This would allow us to actually have a discourse about it, as opposed to a childish "yes-huh!" "nuh-uh!" thread.

.Sis

Actually no. Oblivion, Call of Duty 2, NBA 2K6, Madden 06, Dead Rising, Condemed, Quake IV, Tiger Woods 06,Need for Speed are Multiplatform which also come out on PC in parallel.

[NavNucST3]

In my opinion it will be hard to top the Dreamcast launch titles, but for the first time since then I can easily name 5+ games that have a chance to be good/great and I am struggling on which ones to "settle" with.


I wish I lived where you were, because the ONLY game I could get for my dreamcast was Blue Stinger...not what I considered a stellar launch lineup, maybe I'm getting old but I definitely remember, waiting and waiting and waiting for more games.

I have pre'd and paid for: Kameo, PGR3, PD0, Burnout Revenge (nothing special about this one, its for my son)
I will probably pickup/preorder another game or two or three on launch day (if available), those would be Oblivion, COD2, NBA2K6, maybe DOA4 maybe.

Even if we go by "launch window" I think this is the largest quantity of games ever for a console (at least in the U.S.).

Edit: emphasized quantity

[scatteh316]

Oblivion
Call of Duty 2
Project Gotham 3
Perfect Dark Zero
Dead or Alive 4



1. 2 of those games are PC ports, not a great for a new system to be relying on PC ports as AAA games
2. Is PGR3 a launch title????
3. PDZ, not interested...i expect a killzone with this one. Hyped up to hell only to play like crap
4. DOA games have never scored any good, and Tekken and especially VF games are alot better

[Sis]

Actually no. Oblivion, Call of Duty 2, NBA 2K6, Madden 06, Dead Rising, Condemed, Quake IV, Tiger Woods 06,Need for Speed are Multiplatform which also come out on PC in parallel.In your mind, as long as the game has come out on the PC at some other point in time, it's a PC port. That has to be the most liberal definition of "PC port" that I've ever seen. And by "liberal" I mean "incorrect".

.Sis

[Sis]

1. 2 of those games are PC ports, not a great for a new system to be relying on PC ports as AAA games
Please back up this post with some link where the developer said they were doing a port of Oblivion (I'm assuming that's what your post references). From all accounts, they are doing a simultaneous release and the Xbox 360 version is built from ground up for the console. This is not the definition of a port.

.Sis

[scatteh316]

Please back up this post with some link where the developer said they were doing a port of Oblivion (I'm assuming that's what your post references). From all accounts, they are doing a simultaneous release and the Xbox 360 version is built from ground up for the console. This is not the definition of a port.

.Sis

Its a PORT...how could they have built an exclusive 360 game engine when the game development started before 360 was ever revealed. Face it.

[Sis]

Its a PORT...how could they have built an exclusive 360 game engine when the game development started before 360 was ever revealed. Face it.Sorry, but the "face it" argument doesn't hold a lot of weight.

Note that I never said it can't be a port, just that every account I've read suggests that it isn't. This MAY be marketing hype by Bethesda but right now that's all we have to go on. And frankly, I'm more apt to believe them than you in this regards, seeing as how your argument boils down to lack of knowledge about their development.

.Sis

[Dr Evil]

Its a PORT...how could they have built an exclusive 360 game engine when the game development started before 360 was ever revealed. Face it.

If it's released simultaneously, it's incorrect to call it port, and your comment's about PD0 were weird.

[Master-Mold]

Question for someone with better memory or search skills than me: What was the official launch lineup for the Dreamcast, particularly in NA? It'd be interesting to compare them.

.Sis

Hmmm. I know I bought and was very pleased with at DC launch:

Soul Calibur
NFL 2K
Sonic Adventure
Power Stone
Ready 2 Rumble

[Qroach]

Oblivion - PC port
Call of Duty 2 - PC port
NBA 2K6 - never has appeared on PC and this version was made for xbox 360.
Madden 06 -This version was made for xbox 360 and next gen consoles, it's not a PC port.
Dead Rising - Not a PC port. developed for console with a possible pC port later.
Condemed - PC port
Quake IV - I think console is the lead sku on this game. They will release a PC version afterwards.
Tiger Woods 06 - The version for xbox 360 is different then the version released for PC.
Need for Speed - xbox 360 is the lead sku on this game.


so you're not correct in your assumptions. you might have 4 solid PC ports out of that bunch. The rest you are stretching for.

[scatteh316]

Sorry, but the "face it" argument doesn't hold a lot of weight.

Note that I never said it can't be a port, just that every account I've read suggests that it isn't. This MAY be marketing hype by Bethesda but right now that's all we have to go on. And frankly, I'm more apt to believe them than you in this regards, seeing as how your argument boils down to lack of knowledge about their development.

.Sis


The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion has been under development for well over three years as a next-generation title for PC and Xbox 360. While Bethesda has only recently transferred the game over to Microsoft’s new system, the jump in power to Xbox 360 has made the port from PC nearly flawless.

1. NOTE the 3 years development time, hence the game engine and levels are PORTED onto the 360
2. NOTE that the game has been in development for 3 years, way before 360 was ever revealed, Hence they could not create an 360 specific engine because they knew nothing about the harware 360 contain.

[scatteh316]

If it's released simultaneously, it's incorrect to call it port, and your comment's about PD0 were weird.

What was weird about what i said about PDZ???

I think it'll be like killzone. Hyped to hell then play like crap and flop.

whats so hard to understand about that????????????????????

[valioso]

wouldnt a game have to already be out on pc for it to be considered a port.. in that case.. every multiplatform game ever released is a port.

[scooby_dooby]

Ugg the trolls in this thread are sick.

Why does it matter if it's a cross platform PC-game when the hardware to play the PC game is thousands of dollars? By definition only 2 are ports.

Get a grip on reality. These are launch titles for a $400 console will look superior to a multi-thousand dollar gaming rig.

" Oblivion, Call of Duty 2, NBA 2K6, Madden 06, Dead Rising, Condemed, Quake IV, Tiger Woods 06,Need for Speed are Multiplatform which also come out on PC in parallel."

This comment is so ridiculous I don't know whether to respond or just laugh....I'll just laugh :lol: :lol: :lol:

Nemo, hate ti break it to you, but 80% of the PS3 launch titles will be XBOX360 'ports'....I know..it's rough...but it'll be ok

[scatteh316]

wouldnt a game have to already be out on pc for it to be considered a port..

Its a PC game engine, levels, etc etc

The ENTIRE game is being PORTED to another platform

[valioso]

Its a PC game engine, levels, etc etc

The ENTIRE game is being PORTED to another platform

is coming out at the same time... and you don't have any inside info so you're just speculating.. still with your logic, every multiplatform game is always a port.

[scatteh316]

Get a grip on reality. These are launch titles for a $400 console will look superior to a multi-thousand dollar gaming rig.

That comment is just plain WRONG. regardless of what the devs say.

A PC with :

SLI'D 7800GTX's
2GIG of RAM
And a top flight AMD

will have better textures, better filtering, better resolution, better FSAA implemented, a possibility of better HDR.

But as you said that rig would cost thousands, but it WOULD look better than the 360 version.

[scooby_dooby]

It's a game designed from day one for the next gen game console, just because they didn't know specs didn't mean they couldn't develop the game.

The controls are designed for a console not hacked from the PC like morrowind, what's that tell you?

The X360 version is the version with best quality. According to Bethesda PC's can not beat it, only match it. What's that tell you?

Your logic is completely flawed, if it was a PC game it would come out on the PC first, which it's not. In addition, the graphics would look better on a top end PC than the console version, which they do not.

Give it up, and quit trolling this thread so people can discuss the wide variety of cool launch titles for teh XBOX360. Don't try and piss on everyone's parade cause you've decided to wait an entire year before getting a next gen console. Not our problem.

[scatteh316]

is coming out at the same time... and you don't have any inside info so you're just speculating.. still with your logic, every multiplatform game is always a port.

So its using a PC developed game engine, levels and game data that was developed on a PC, but its not a port??

ROFFL

[scooby_dooby]

But as you said that rig would cost thousands, but it WOULD look better than the 360 version.

No it wouldn't. I'll believe Bethesda over some random internet sony lover.

Why would anyone be so loyal to a CORPORATION???

Leave troll.

[valioso]

So its using a PC developed game engine, levels and game data that was developed on a PC, but its not a port??

ROFFL

Didn't the developer themselves say that they are building the game from the ground up for the 360, and that the 360 version will be the best version available at launch.

And no a port, would be if the pc game came out 6 months ago.. but it didnt, they are coming at the same time, therefore is a multiplatform game, unless you consider all multiplatform games ports.

[shred5]

I think it is a great line up for a console... Who cares if some of them are ports... The only games I prefer to play on my computer anymore are fps..
Kameo looks amazing..
PGR3 does too, dont know for sure if it is a launch title...
PDZ could be a monster hit... Dont know for sure if it is a day one launch title yet either

Actually Very few have been confirmed day one titles yet.. We will know this week though..

Bethesda has said oblivion will be awsum and you will need the highest end computer to pull off what the 360's version does..

[Qroach]

there's a whole lot of trolling going on lately. it better f'ing stop.

[Sis]

The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion has been under development for well over three years as a next-generation title for PC and Xbox 360. While Bethesda has only recently transferred the game over to Microsoft’s new system, the jump in power to Xbox 360 has made the port from PC nearly flawless.

1. NOTE the 3 years development time, hence the game engine and levels are PORTED onto the 360
2. NOTE that the game has been in development for 3 years, way before 360 was ever revealed, Hence they could not create an 360 specific engine because they knew nothing about the harware 360 contain.
Fair enough--good quote. :)

.Sis

[scatteh316]

Didn't the developer themselves say that they are building the game from the ground up for the 360, and that the 360 version will be the best version available at launch.

And no a port, would be if the pc game came out 6 months ago.. but it didnt, they are coming at the same time, therefore is a multiplatform game, unless you consider all multiplatform games ports.

See the post above this 1

[scatteh316]

No it wouldn't. I'll believe Bethesda over some random internet sony lover.

Why would anyone be so loyal to a CORPORATION???

Leave troll.

Denying that system playing oblivion would still be inferrio to the 360 versionr is just plain wrong.

[Master-Mold]

De-railed :???:




Anyhow, if the X360 version of Oblivion is running at MAX SETTINGS that are selectable in the PC options (Bethesda claims) and the assests are the same the only thing a $4000 Rig will get you is better FPS, possibly better resolution (depending on performance), and more AA AF options, right?

If the X360 version runs a 30+ FPS I would hardly call it a port. Plus as was mentioned if they simultaneously release and share all assests how is it a port?

[Dr Evil]

What was weird about what i said about PDZ???

I think it'll be like killzone. Hyped to hell then play like crap and flop.

whats so hard to understand about that????????????????????

What do you base that though of yours on?, I think that comment of yours sounds biased and is very close to trolling. Why do you think it plays like crap?.

[Sis]

Oblivion - PC port
Call of Duty 2 - PC port
NBA 2K6 - never has appeared on PC and this version was made for xbox 360.
Madden 06 -This version was made for xbox 360 and next gen consoles, it's not a PC port.
Dead Rising - Not a PC port. developed for console with a possible pC port later.
Condemed - PC port
Quake IV - I think console is the lead sku on this game. They will release a PC version afterwards.
Tiger Woods 06 - The version for xbox 360 is different then the version released for PC.
Need for Speed - xbox 360 is the lead sku on this game.


so you're not correct in your assumptions. you might have 4 solid PC ports out of that bunch. The rest you are stretching for.Q, where do you see that the PC will lead the Condemned effort? The Xbox 360 version--according to IGN--has a Nov '05 release date whereas the PC version has a TBA.

.Sis

[scatteh316]

Why do you think it plays like crap?.

I never said it plays like crap, i said i can see it playing like crap when its released.

Whats the matter with this place???

i express my personal opinion / view and get flamed for it??? what gives????

[Master-Mold]

1. NOTE the 3 years development time, hence the game engine and levels are PORTED onto the 360
2. NOTE that the game has been in development for 3 years, way before 360 was ever revealed, Hence they could not create an 360 specific engine because they knew nothing about the harware 360 contain.

But they knew the exact specs of all todays current hardware on the PC side? It sounds to me like they made an engine and its art assets for all future hardware.

I am pretty sure this game wasn't being built with a 9700 Pro in mind.

[scatteh316]

But they knew the exact specs of all todays current hardware on the PC side? It sounds to me like they made an engine and its art assets for all future hardware.

I am pretty sure this game wasn't being built with a 9700 Pro in mind.

Im not gonna argue no more as its pointelss.

So yes its not a port

[Inquisitive_Idiot]

Since I am too lazy to look it up, what is, in terms of gamimg, the definition of a port?

As far as I am concerned, it means a game built from the ground up with one platform in mind, later (after release) having its assets (game engine) moved to another platform of lesser capability. This usually leads to the port being of lesser quality than the original. An example of this would be Morrowind for Xbox, in which case, the controls and graphics were not as good as the PC counterpart.

Holt

[Qroach]

That is an excellent definition of port.

[Master-Mold]

Since I am too lazy to look it up, what is, in terms of gamimg, the definition of a port?

As far as I am concerned, it means a game built from the ground up with one platform in mind, later (after release) having its assets (game engine) moved to another platform of lesser capability. This usually leads to the port being of lesser quality than the original. An example of this would be Morrowind for Xbox, in which case, the controls and graphics were not as good as the PC counterpart.

Holt

^That is pretty much my definition.

[pegisys]

Since I am too lazy to look it up, what is, in terms of gamimg, the definition of a port?

As far as I am concerned, it means a game built from the ground up with one platform in mind, later (after release) having its assets (game engine) moved to another platform of lesser capability. This usually leads to the port being of lesser quality than the original. An example of this would be Morrowind for Xbox, in which case, the controls and graphics were not as good as the PC counterpart.

Holt

I would agree but I wouldn't say going to a platform of lesser capability, because game coming from the xbox to the pc are ports also, but most of the time they suck aswell

[scatteh316]

having its assets (game engine) moved to another platform of lesser capability.

Holt

What about when riddick was ported from x-box to PC.

What if COD was running on a medium spec PC, then ported to 360. the 360 version would look beter. but that would conflict with what you said.

And the same thing happens with a extremely high spec PC. that would make 360 inferior due to higher resolution, filtering, AA etc.

[Miksu]

Ah please, for last weeks I've been thinking how nice Console-forum is nowadays. But this thread seems to contradict that quite much.

[seismologist]

Best launch window ever? Before 360 I think people were saying that about the PSP. As the industry grows I think launches will keep getting bigger with more games people ported to any system that's able to run it.

[Shifty Geezer]

As far as I am concerned, it means a game built from the ground up with one platform in mind, later (after release) having its assets (game engine) moved to another platform of lesser capability.So you rate XB as a lesser console than PS2? For Baldur's Gate: Dark Alliance was ported to XB after PS2, as was PES. You may want to revise your definition a little ;)

[Shifty Geezer]

I have to say anyone thinking all these PC ports acceptable is a prime nimrod, grade A doofus of biblical proportions. For me and all the sane people of this world, we'd rather have original titles for our launch window of our beloved console no matter how rubbish they are, than any quantity of award winning AAA titles if these games are also to be available on inferior hardware scum. :evil:










:mrgreen:

[Qroach]

Q, where do you see that the PC will lead the Condemned effort? The Xbox 360 version--according to IGN--has a Nov '05 release date whereas the PC version has a TBA.

oh you could be right I'm not certain if I had my info correct on that one. Anyway this is all a non issue. every game coming out for xbox 360 and PS3 int eh first wave were titles designed on PC to start with, then moved/migrated over to console when the devkits were released.

[dukmahsik]

sony loyalists: line up sucks
MS loyalists: line up rules

imagine that

[expletive]

Considering youd ahve to spend about $1500 on a PC to run Oblivion at the same quality as a $400 Xbox 360, i cant see how its relevant if its a 'port' or not.

IMO, the games should be judged on their own in the console world alone. The reason being, at this point, in order to get similar performance youd have to spend a LOT more on a PC which is entirely NOT an option for most people.

J

[Acert93]

:lol: At all the PC hate. I have barely got 10 posts in the first page and this thread is already spiraling!

How many people own gaming PCs? i.e. $1,000+ rigs
How much overlap is there between the console and PC market?

http://www.steampowered.com/status/survey.html

According to Valve's survey, note 6 of the top 8 GPUs (basically all the GPUs with more than 3% of the market):

9.6% of PC gamers have Radeon 9600 GPUs (SE, Pro, XT)
8.0% of PC gamers have FX5200 GPUs
6.5% of PC gamers have MX 400 series GPUs (MX440, MX420)
5.1% of PC gamers have Radeon 9200 series GPUs
4.8% of PC gamers have GeForce 4 series GPUs (Ti4200, Ti4600)
3.3% of PC gamers have GeForce 2 series GPUs

The top PC gamers (37.3% of gamers) have HORRIBLE GPUs!

The only *decent* GPUs with more than 3% of the market, according to the Valve Survey, are the 9800 series (128bit, 256bit, SE/Pro/XT) with 9.3% and the GeForce 6600 series (normal and GT) with 5.5%. And these cards are not even in the same class as Xenos. And remember, this survey is wonkey on the 9600/9800 series because of the vouchers.

The only GPU in the Xenos class is the GF 7800GTX--which a whopping .4%, meaning 4 out of 1,000 users, has!

Easy conclusion: There is not significant overlap in the audiance; and for most PC gamers the $300 Xbox 360 is going to play the game better than their rig and better than almost any sub-$1000 PC.

Sorry, being able to play the BEST PC games--CoD2, Prey, Quake 4, Oblivion, etc--at high end graphics quality, on a $300 Console, is NOT a negative.

Anyone who thinks it is, well, you are totally out of touch with the smaller, and less technically advanced PC market.

[zifnab]

Since all launch titles have undoubtedly started their development on PCs (without devs knowing all final hardware specifications), they are all ports in the sense of the word. This of course applies to all game consoles, even Sony’s. The fact that the xbox 360 launch will have a couple of brand new big name titles from the PC realm, which will demand expensive pc rigs, only makes it more appealing and it seems like a smart move.

[Sol Radi]

sony loyalists: line up sucks
MS loyalists: line up rules

imagine that

Hopefully B3D doesn't get overrun by ******s. This is one of the few sites remaining that can actually hold mature and intelligent debates about games. That's not to say that all people who have opinions are ******s of course! I myself favor the Xbox 360 but I also respect the efforts and quality games that come from Sony and Nintendo.

Anyway, back on track, it's merely a personal opinion whether or not X360 has a great launch lineup. Although I would argue that Dreamcast had the best launch (personal preference/ Sonic fan here), PC "ports" or not, the X360 has an impressive list of software for launch. In the long run however, I think that the X360 probably has the most complete lineup I've seen in a long time. Almost every genre I can think of has been covered well.

[Laa-Yosh]

The trolling is ridiculous. I suggest a 1 week ban for a few posters here...

[Inquisitive_Idiot]

So you rate XB as a lesser console than PS2? For Baldur's Gate: Dark Alliance was ported to XB after PS2, as was PES. You may want to revise your definition a little ;)

Sorry, I should have been clearer with my definition.

What I was trying to point out was that in the context of this thread the term port does not really apply to the previously mentioned Xbox 360 titles, as it usually caries a negative connotation. Not that in every case a port would be a downgrade and as others pointed out it can sometimes actually make the original game better.

Holt

[pso]

The trolling is ridiculous. I suggest a 1 week ban for a few posters here...

One poster just came back from a 1 week banning. :p

[seismologist]

:lol: At all the PC hate. I have barely got 10 posts in the first page and this thread is already spiraling!

How many people own gaming PCs? i.e. $1,000+ rigs
How much overlap is there between the console and PC market?

http://www.steampowered.com/status/survey.html

According to Valve's survey, note 6 of the top 8 GPUs (basically all the GPUs with more than 3% of the market):

9.6% of PC gamers have Radeon 9600 GPUs (SE, Pro, XT)
8.0% of PC gamers have FX5200 GPUs
6.5% of PC gamers have MX 400 series GPUs (MX440, MX420)
5.1% of PC gamers have Radeon 9200 series GPUs
4.8% of PC gamers have GeForce 4 series GPUs (Ti4200, Ti4600)
3.3% of PC gamers have GeForce 2 series GPUs

The top PC gamers (37.3% of gamers) have HORRIBLE GPUs!

The only *decent* GPUs with more than 3% of the market, according to the Valve Survey, are the 9800 series (128bit, 256bit, SE/Pro/XT) with 9.3% and the GeForce 6600 series (normal and GT) with 5.5%. And these cards are not even in the same class as Xenos. And remember, this survey is wonkey on the 9600/9800 series because of the vouchers.

The only GPU in the Xenos class is the GF 7800GTX--which a whopping .4%, meaning 4 out of 1,000 users, has!

Easy conclusion: There is not significant overlap in the audiance; and for most PC gamers the $300 Xbox 360 is going to play the game better than their rig and better than almost any sub-$1000 PC.

Sorry, being able to play the BEST PC games--CoD2, Prey, Quake 4, Oblivion, etc--at high end graphics quality, on a $300 Console, is NOT a negative.

Anyone who thinks it is, well, you are totally out of touch with the smaller, and less technically advanced PC market.

If your just talking about the GPU, those 37% dont need to buy a $1000 PC. They could go out and buy a $150 6600GT which will run oblivion just fine. That's what I intend to play it on.

And if Oblivion wont run on a midrange PC then Bethesda has really shot themselves in the foot.

[Acert93]

If your just talking about the GPU, those 37% dont need to buy a $1000 PC. They could go out and buy a $150 6600GT which will run oblivion just fine. That's what I intend to play it on. Go read the charts. Those are the TOP 37%, meaning most common cards.

Or put another way, less than 20% of users have a 6600 card or better. So 80% of TOTAL users have cards WORSE than a 6600GT. Nevermind the fact less than .5% have a GPU in the class of Xenos.

And all of this is not counting RAM, CPU... or Spyware and other crap that bogs down a lot of people's PCs.

As for the 6600GT, I hardly believe that the 6600GT is going to have the same level of detail at the Xbox 360 version.

Just take a look at CoD2. It runs at 60fps on the Xbos 360 at 1280x720, with MSAA.

Xenos > 6600GT

No questions asked.

All things even, if someone was spending money to just play Oblivion a $300 Xbox 360 is going to provide a better experience than a $1,000 PC.

And if Oblivion wont run on a midrange PC then Bethesda has really shot themselves in the foot. Do you even play PC games???

You can run all modern games on old GPUs. The catch is you have to turn down the detail.

Seeing people run BF2 on a Radeon 8500 or FarCry on a Ti4200 is not pretty, but they work and people get to enjoy the game.

Only the elite PC snobs get to enjoy them at the highest quality, and even then a options have to be turned off on a regular basis. e.g. I have an NV40 and I have had to turn off options on a regular basis or jump down a resolution to get 60fps in a lot of games. No AA in Doom 3 at 1600x1200, numerous features at medium in BF2 at 1280x960, etc.

PC software is not very optimized compared to a console game. They write to a broad number of features. If your HW can do it, fine; if not, tough luck--go get a faster card. On a console they can optimize for the specific architecture and features.

Until next spring, or even fall, when G80/R580 are released, desktop chips are going to be behind in many ways to RSX (a super overclocked G70) and Xenos.

Your talking high end GPUs, STANDARD, in a $300 box.

A very elite few have PCs that can compare to that range. To suggest someone with a 6600GT is going to get the "best" experience out of Oblivion is funny :lol: Not sure if you have noticed, but the 6600GT struggles in games like Fear, CoD2, Doom 3, FarCry, etc... with higher resolutions/features/AA.

Nice midrange gaming card, but it is not some holy grail "top quality" device. And yes, I have one in the 2nd PC in my home ;)

[PARANOiA]

I don't know what all the fuss about the launch on this machine is... it doesn't really matter because the X360 has until the PS3 release as it's "launch window" to get games right. Until then, it has no competition, except for the PS2/GC (which will continue to be competition until it's demise).


Add that to the fact that the best launches have traditionally ended up that machine doing the worst overall, and I'm going to say the X360 launch looks awesome, but no one will care two months afterwards, when more great games come out.

[shred5]

Hopefully B3D doesn't get overrun by ******s. This is one of the few sites remaining that can actually hold mature and intelligent debates about games. That's not to say that all people who have opinions are ******s of course! I myself favor the Xbox 360 but I also respect the efforts and quality games that come from Sony and Nintendo.

Anyway, back on track, it's merely a personal opinion whether or not X360 has a great launch lineup. Although I would argue that Dreamcast had the best launch (personal preference/ Sonic fan here), PC "ports" or not, the X360 has an impressive list of software for launch. In the long run however, I think that the X360 probably has the most complete lineup I've seen in a long time. Almost every genre I can think of has been covered well.


I agree .. Nice post... I have been reading these forums for a while..The b3d forums have some of the smartest hardware people anywhere... I just recently sign up to post because I was getting sick of all the system bashing going on at other sites... I love my pc and my consoles... I just care that the companies create great game and hardware.. I want all systems to survive because it gives me a choice.. Compitition leads to better hardware, better games and better prices...

[MrSingh]

since most art assets for any game are created on PC, technically every game on the market is a PC port. LOL AM I RITE!?

[seismologist]

Do you even play PC games???


Yes I do, I never said 6600GT was top of the line. You're suggesting that people without the best PC card should go out and buy a $400 Xbox 360 ($400 if you want HD and a way to save your game ;)) so they can play the game with bump mapping.

I'm suggesting they should simply live with what they've got buy a cheap gfx card upgrade and turn down some of the effects. Just like we've been doing for the past 10 years with PC gaming. That's what Im doing.

Next time I upgrade my PC it will be to something much more powerful than an Xbox 360 and all of my games (including Oblivion) will benefit :) So, I'm just saying.. buying an Xbox 360 to play PC games isn't necessarily the best solution.

[Ruined]

Its a PORT...how could they have built an exclusive 360 game engine when the game development started before 360 was ever revealed. Face it.

http://www.xbox.com/en-US/e32005/devinterviews/20050518-oblivion.htm

Xbox.com: How many team members have been with The Elder Scrolls series since the beginning? How has this development process been different from that of The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind®?

Howard: The whole series? Gosh, probably over 100 different people have had their hands in it. We're fortunate that almost everyone who worked on Morrowind is working again on Oblivion, and we've added a lot of great new talent.

In many ways, the development has been similar to Morrowind's, since we basically started from scratch on Oblivion. But this time around, we were making a console game from the very start. We knew from day one that Oblivion would be on the Xbox 360™, while with Morrowind, Xbox development didn't start until we were halfway done. Oblivion's been designed from the ground up to be a next-generation console game in every respect.

its a good idea to read up on games before you declare them a port :)

[BenQ]

I'm mostly a PC gamer, and I'll be getting Oblivion for my PC.

What all these "crazy Xbox fans" have been saying about having to spend ALOT more for a PC that can run Oblivion anywhere near aswell as the Xbox 360 will run it....... is 100% Fact.

It's going to be a year or two where the Xbox 360 will be offering a MUCH better bang for your buck.

Infact JUST the GPU needed to run Oblivion aswell on a PC, as it will run on the Xbox 360, costs asmuch, if not more, than the entire console.

[overclocked]

This discussion is so silly that i dont find the words for it, ohh i find it LOCK this thread mods!

[Moegames]

PGR3 is no launch title. Others in your list also not. And the lineup sucks imo big time. Lots of PC conversions and some not too good 1337 title.

Lots of pc conversions? LOL

[LunchBox]

It has good launch titles but i wouldn't say best launch line-up ever.

I think the first Xbox had a better launch line-up.

[Mordecaii]

I think this is a very good launch lineup especially compared to some of the launch games we've seen in the past. I loved my PS2 but the launch games for the system weren't anything special. With Xbox (which I also quite enjoy), I remember Halo coming out but that's the only really good game I remember at launch. So I would definately say that this definately looks to be a great launch lineup. For me personally, however, most of the games are not the kind of games that I would want. I'm getting Oblivion on PC (I love my 7800 GTX and my Athlon X2 (dual-core) 4600). :) I'm not a fan of fps games on consoles at all, I hate using a controller (the exception is Halo and Halo 2). I also don't really like racing games since I get bored with them. In my personal opinion Kameo is the only game that I would get and to be honest I may get an X360 close to launch and only buy Kameo. I definately think that Microsoft covered quite a few genres, but my personal wish is that they would have an RPG out at launch as well (other than Oblivion).

[Acert93]

Yes I do, I never said 6600GT was top of the line. You're suggesting that people without the best PC card should go out and buy a $400 Xbox 360 ($400 if you want HD and a way to save your game ;)) so they can play the game with bump mapping.

I'm suggesting they should simply live with what they've got buy a cheap gfx card upgrade and turn down some of the effects. Just like we've been doing for the past 10 years with PC gaming. That's what Im doing.

Next time I upgrade my PC it will be to something much more powerful than an Xbox 360 and all of my games (including Oblivion) will benefit :) So, I'm just saying.. buying an Xbox 360 to play PC games isn't necessarily the best solution. But yet it can be depending on your rig. If you are stuck on AGP or if you have a P4 1.4GHz CPU etc... if you want to play CoD2, Prey, Quake 4, etc... with decent settings the cheapest way possible it is an option.

But that was not even my original point. I was not suggesting all PC gamers go run off and get a console.

The point was all the Xbox 360 bashing for getting "substandard ports". It is hardly fair to call these ports when

1. They are being released in the same time frame
2. They look better on the Xbox 360 than compared to over 80% of gamers PCs (and that is being kind)
3. These titles have been, to different degrees, co-developed for the 360

The point: The Xbox 360 is going to have some of the best games available, for gamers, this fall. To knock the 360 for getting these titles underminds the fact

1. they will look/play better than on most PCs and
2. that console gamers and PC gamers overlap, but are NOT the same.

PC gamers are a MUCH smaller demographic, so offering high quality games--even if they appear on the PC--is NOT a negative for most of the market.

The fact the Xbox 360 versions look great and will play better than all those people with Ti4200s and Fx5200s is just a side point.

Console gamers who do not own $1,000+ PCs will be VERY happy to get the console versions--that just happen to look even better in same cases. So I don't understand this obsession some have with knocking PC ports. PCs are not consoles, they are not necessarily in direct competition. Some overlap, but nothing like PS2<>Xbox.

[BlueTsunami]

2. that console gamers and PC gamers overlap, but are NOT the same.

PC gamers are a MUCH smaller demographic, so offering high quality games--even if they appear on the PC--is NOT a negative for most of the market.

I guess its off topic, but did Microsoft ever mention uniting PC gamers with 360 gamers in this console generation? That would be pretty cool and raise the userbase (Online) for a certain game. Also playing a game on 360 then the PC surpasses it (Visually) and being able to play a 360/PC game on your PC but still be able to play with your friends on 360 would really rock.

[expletive]

But yet it can be depending on your rig. If you are stuck on AGP or if you have a P4 1.4GHz CPU etc... if you want to play CoD2, Prey, Quake 4, etc... with decent settings the cheapest way possible it is an option.

But that was not even my original point. I was not suggesting all PC gamers go run off and get a console.

The point was all the Xbox 360 bashing for getting "substandard ports". It is hardly fair to call these ports when

1. They are being released in the same time frame
2. They look better on the Xbox 360 than compared to over 80% of gamers PCs (and that is being kind)
3. These titles have been, to different degrees, co-developed for the 360

The point: The Xbox 360 is going to have some of the best games available, for gamers, this fall. To knock the 360 for getting these titles underminds the fact

1. they will look/play better than on most PCs and
2. that console gamers and PC gamers overlap, but are NOT the same.

PC gamers are a MUCH smaller demographic, so offering high quality games--even if they appear on the PC--is NOT a negative for most of the market.

The fact the Xbox 360 versions look great and will play better than all those people with Ti4200s and Fx5200s is just a side point.

Console gamers who do not own $1,000+ PCs will be VERY happy to get the console versions--that just happen to look even better in same cases. So I don't understand this obsession some have with knocking PC ports. PCs are not consoles, they are not necessarily in direct competition. Some overlap, but nothing like PS2<>Xbox.

Just to add on here, lets assume Xbox 360 gets Half-Life 3 as a console exclusive and its a near-perfect port. Does that not give the 360 a great title that oculd potentially sell systems? Heck, there may even be PC Gamers who get the 360 version because it runs better than theyre 5200 GT. So I agree that something being a 'port' in and of itself is not relevant, it has to be taken in the context of the big picture.

J

[blakjedi]

CoD2 isnt a PC port. CoD2 doesnt exist on PC yet and the assets were created with both systems in mind.

Oblivion isnt a port because it was designed from the ground up for 360. Thats like saying SC:CT is a port to the Xbox :roll: Based on the dvelopers words own words... they dont consider it a port either.

Ports are games designed for entirely different target platform brought over to another platform. These are games with simultaneous development.
In a complete reversal, however, blakjedi will probably buy both Rare titles for 360 whereas one month ago he wouldnt have touched them with a ten foot pole!

[Acert93]

I guess its off topic, but did Microsoft ever mention uniting PC gamers with 360 gamers in this console generation? That would be pretty cool and raise the userbase (Online) for a certain game. Also playing a game on 360 then the PC surpasses it (Visually) and being able to play a 360/PC game on your PC but still be able to play with your friends on 360 would really rock. Depends on th game. The FF MMO does allow such connectivity.

I doubt we will see this in FPS due to the KB/MS advantage. Outside of that I think it is more of a software hurdle, not a hardware one. It would be nice to see games like WOW cross polinate.

[Johnny Awesome]

The launch lineup is fantastic. Certainly the best the industry has ever seen.

[EndR]

I agree, the 360 launch-line up is outstanding. We´ll just have to see how good the games really are, but MS has managed to get a very diversified line-up, with "several" potential system sellers...

[Alpha_Spartan]

I never said it plays like crap, i said i can see it playing like crap when its released.

Whats the matter with this place???

i express my personal opinion / view and get flamed for it??? what gives????
If your opinion has no basis on reality then it's crap. Killzone has a mediocre developer behind it. They released two stinkers in the same year: Killzone and that Vietnam game. Rare is a proven developer. Your comparison sucked.

Right now, what PDZ will be is undecided. I hope it's a breath of fresh air. I'm sick of Halo this and Halo that...

[c0_re]

Wow it's pretty sad how people feel the need to come into this thread to bash the launch of the 360 and the available games when it easily has the best launch lineup ever, unless someone can point me to a better one please do.

And for the poeple comparing Killzone to PDZ the differenece is Rare has a history of great games and PDZ has been in development forever. stupid comparison when Killzone dev's are still a bunhc of rookies without a single great FPS under their belt.

Some of the poeple just need to take the "if you can't say anything nice or construstive keep you cake hole shut" for threads like this.

quit being strait up jerks for no reason besides you don't like Microsoft and the 360 and your blinded by your fanb0yism.

[c0_re]

Yes I do, I never said 6600GT was top of the line. You're suggesting that people without the best PC card should go out and buy a $400 Xbox 360 ($400 if you want HD and a way to save your game ;)) so they can play the game with bump mapping.

I'm suggesting they should simply live with what they've got buy a cheap gfx card upgrade and turn down some of the effects. Just like we've been doing for the past 10 years with PC gaming. That's what Im doing.

Next time I upgrade my PC it will be to something much more powerful than an Xbox 360 and all of my games (including Oblivion) will benefit :) So, I'm just saying.. buying an Xbox 360 to play PC games isn't necessarily the best solution.


This reply isn't directly aimed at the above poster I'm just using them as an example of the rest of the jerks here.



Yea cause it's so much fun to hole myself up in my office on some crappy knock off leather office chair nad a 19inch monitor, instead of kicking my feet back on my cumfy couch with my 65inch HDTV and 7.1 Surround sound system with my buddies.

You have your fun I"ll have mine.

Bringing the PC into the console argument is just stupid and desperate, say whatever it is makes you poeple sleep better at night. I'll leave my laptop and desktop for work and my consoles for games. (Minus AOE and Sims)

I mean if this was a topic about how great the PS3 launch lineup is going to be I would try to find some things I feel positivly about and post about that instead of of rip into and cut down the things a large amount of other people find to be very exciting.

[Mordecaii]

Due to some people's inability to keep from attacking other posters, I believe it's about time to close this thread...