Gothic 2

[SlmDnk]

Gothic 2 Official Website (http://www.piranha-bytes.com/gothic2/content_english/home.php)

3 new pics showing the fog effect:

http://www.piranha-bytes.com/gothic2/files/media/shots/shot_mood_01.jpg
http://www.piranha-bytes.com/gothic2/files/media/shots/shot_mood_02.jpg
http://www.piranha-bytes.com/gothic2/files/media/shots/shot_mood_03.jpg

Making of Gothic 2 (http://www.piranha-bytes.com/gothic2/content_english/makingof_sascha.php)

To be released by JoWood in Q4 2002 (http://www.jowood.com/gamers/index.php?site=10&lang=en) -- Personally I just can't wait for Gothic 2 anymore :D

Gothic ruled so very very much. One of those unforgettable gaming experiences of all time and as an action/adventure game it is definitely on par with the almighty voxel-based Outcast from Appeal.

[Saem]

What made the first Gothic so good. I saw the box thought it was neat but decided against buying. I really hate no or crappy game return policies and I didn't want to waste money.

[Gollum]

Believe me, I thought exactle the game thing "aha, a 3d rpg getting some but not overly much praise in reviews, from an unknown german developer, uh I dunno...", but when I finally picked it up and gave it a shot i was almost stunned! So I understand SlmDnk's excitement perfectly. Be prepared for an extended mini-review Saem: ;)

It's one of those really surprising games, granted if you like RPGs. Maybe I can express it best like this: It is the game Ultima 9 should have been! It has a nice, almost seamless 3D world (only a few dungeons need loading but 90% are seamless) with good (DX7 style) graphics and really good gameplay. It also has a surprisingly smart AI, no other 3D RPG I know has anything remotely like Gothic's AI! The beasts and monsters rarely get stuck, they fight and react very differently and believable, some are really tough and agressive while others are peacefull and ignore you until you get too close (then they will first try to scare you and only then, if you don't leave them alone, will they attack). Very carefull use of landscape on the players part can sometimes help in fights, but many a beast will actually be prepared to run hundreds of meters to get at you on that cliffside from behind while the rest of the pack runs around below distractingly. You got a lot of freedom to explore at first, training your skills either peacefully through quests or through combat (although combat requires a bit of UO bunny/bug-killing early on as you're easy prey for most animals in the beginning). You explore the world, the three camps, start getting to know people and after a while you decide where you personally feel you fit in the best out of the 3 possible camps. From there on the story gets more linear (while a bit differently for the three factions, the main storyline runs independent of the camps) but its quite good and offers enough motivation. The game world leaves you plenty of things to explore and you've got some almost Ultima 7 like interactivity with it at points. Simple example: you can go hunting early on for extra cash, learn to get the meat and fur off animals, then sell the fur and cook the meat to raise its potency and worth (cooked meat gives more health when you eat it an sells for more too). The game has lots of this stuff. Also, playing it as a mage character or a full blown fighter are really two different experiences, so its worth at least one replay! So all in all, if you even just think a RPG like that could be for you, give it a shot!

The one thing that really put me off the first time were the controls, they are really ODD, different than any standard controls used to from other games (originally they were intended for keyboard only, good thing they changed that!). But once you figure them out, they're quite quick and feel good. They are supposed to be improved a lot in Gothic 2 too. Overall, don't be shy of trying this game because its developmed by a small german dev team, it really is oe of the best RPGs to emerge in the past 5 years IMHO (but you'll find many others agreeing with me), just be sure to patch it up (it will reduce load/save time by like 80% and remove some nasty bugs, hehe). Phew, long post... ;)

[nate240]

I also am very excited about gothic 2! Gothic is the game that introduced me to rpg's, and it's still the best that I've played. There are multiple paths to take in the game, and lots of places to explore. The graphics are good, and the story is interesting. I liked this game much more than Morrowind(which I never finished-to repetative). Here is a link to the english demo of gothic

http://worldofgothic.de/dl/index.php?go=downloads&file_id=2

The controls are a little akward at first, but once you figure them out it works really well. Definitly give this game a try, you won't regret it!

[SlmDnk]

I wasn't aware of Gothic's existence before I tried the demo. I was simply awestruck by it's atmosphere and the overall feeling it made me feel. As a demonstration of the game it definitely made me want to buy the full version, IMHO, a rare thing nowadays.

Demo's are good =)

[Rodéric]

I didn't liked Morrowind, would I like this one ?

(my question might be stupid, but it's late in here, so my brain is probably already in power saving mode)

[mat]

I didn't liked Morrowind, would I like this one ?


yep
i didnt like Morrorwind, but i really like Gothic (but i still haven'd finished it).
try the demo.

[Saem]

Damn you all. Now I want the game, but I don't think I can get it right now, seeing as I doubt it available in Pakistan.

[SlmDnk]

Gotta play and finish Gothic once more before Gothic 2 hits the shops :D

[Alistair]

Hello all. I{m new to these forums and must say I{m impressed by the maturity generally on display.

I{m also working on a Bolivian machine which doesn{t appear to want to do apostrophes. Ahem. Sorry.

I{m very much looking forward to G2. I wrote a couple of small mods for the G1, and I{m desperately hoping they release some form of editing support this time round. With the original, the tools were powerful, but unstable and very complicated, so little was done with them. I hope that doesn{t dissuade Piranha Bytes from trying again.

However, the real point of this post is just to comment that while the Gothic engine has a lot of fantastic elements, PB, in my view, did not take full advantage of it. There is immense support for living, breathing characters in this engine, both in terms of their individual behaviour, and in the interaction between groups. Despite this, they insisted on sending us down dungeons that were already dull by the time Tomb Raider III rolled round.

A couple of examples, where flashes of greatness nearly made it through the more conventional wander-round-a-fantasy-landscape plot:

SPOILERS...































When the free mine was seized by the old camp:

This was a great idea - changing the political landscape, the very backbone of the story like this - but they presented it as a fait accompli, when the engine is perfectly capable of letting you observe or plan or command this kind of attack. Imagine if you{d been part of this raid, sending your troops to attack or defend specific points, or fetch help or equipment, etc etc. I can guarantee this can be done, as I wrote a mod (unpublished, but playable) where a battle scenario was fought through like this, with the AI happily coping wth competing groups slugging it out.



Your exile from the old camp:

I think they got this more right. You did actually, in game, find yourself prevented by guards from going home, and people{s attitudes to you did change. The treatment was a bit superficial, with two of the main characters just flipped into a new AI state, but it was still a great try, hampered only a little by developer time constraints, I think.

I sincerely hope G2 exploits it{s fantastic AI and scripting options in this kind of way, rather than concentrate on having 150 weapons as opposed to 100, or 26 monster types rather than 20 etc etc...

I haven{t seen any comments from PB about the quality of the story... Given that they demonstrably have the ability to move gaming closer to the human drama conventional in other media, I just hope they don{t shove us down another dungeon to get the sword of Zog.

Thought I{d share that with you.

:)

Cheers,

A.

[Saem]

Any chance that you will be publishing your mod, Alistair.

[Alistair]

I{d hope to, but I{m in S America right now, and my machine and the code are in the UK. Possibly early next year, if the sequel doesn{t eat up my time :)

Does this mean you were able to find a copy of Gothic in Pakistan?

Alistair.

PS: For a simpler English language mod, my original test mod, Visigothic, is available from:

http://www.worldofgothic.de/dl/index.php?go=downloads&release_id=13

and you can get ShakeyCam, which gives Gothic I a rather ropey first person perspective, from:

http://www.pcdrama.com

Feedback still more than welcome :)

A.

[Saem]

I'm only visiting in Pakistan. If I try I can get a copy here, but I'll have one waiting for me back in Canada.

[vrecan]

The first Gothic was easily my fav game when it came out now that I have played through a large part of Gothic II I am in even more love for the series, I cant wait for the 3rd one I have also heard rumors about an expansion to Gothic II, I hope this is true! *btw I didn't like morrowind either and I LOVE this game*

[Gollum]

The expansion pack is supposed to be released here in Germany sometime next month. When/if the english localization is done probably depends on the international success of the title.

For the 3rd part they're gonna use a new engine AFAIK, so its probably going to have a longer development time than Gothic 2. If it turns out anything like the previous games though, its gonna rock! :)

[epicstruggle]

just my 2 cents on gothic. the controls were really weird, and put me off for a while. while bored i tried the game again and got used to it. The game was pretty cool.

later,

[Alistair]

If anyone is interested in the mod wich adds party-building to Gothic 1, in a new scenario, have a look at http://www.pcdrama.com.

(Just started Gothic 2 :))

[Gollum]

epic: yup, the controls freaked me out the first time I tried it too, once you got used to it the game played very well though. G2, though still not perfect, has way better controls by default...

[SlmDnk]

I'm in Chapter 2 in Gothic II with over 22K of xp right now.

I'm 30 years old and I feel like a kid again adventuring the lands of Gothic II. Playing Gothic I was one of those "never forget" gaming moments/highlights of my life. Gothic series is one that I'd never wish to end.

To the gods at Piranha Bytes:

I hope to see a Gothic game someday with THIS (http://download.nvidia.com/downloads/5900_videos/demos/Gas_Station_Demo_full.wmv) (~67MB .wmv) kind of lighting, effects and overall visual quality, plzkthx :wink:

[John Reynolds]

I think Gogamer.com has the British version of Gothic 2 for $38 USD.

Just installed Arx Fatalis, a game I purchased last year and never played. Really jonesing for a decent RPG since I finished Bloodmoon and cancelled my DAoC account.

[RussSchultz]

To the gods at Piranha Bytes:

I hope to see a Gothic game someday with THIS (http://download.nvidia.com/downloads/5900_videos/demos/Gas_Station_Demo_full.wmv) (~67MB .wmv) kind of lighting, effects and overall visual quality, plzkthx :wink:
That video was like watching paint dry. Or the sun go up/down several times.

Actually, it was pretty cool, but dang they could have made it shorter.

[vrecan]

I've now beaten gothic 2 which has a great ending btw definetly leads to an addon. I beat it with a dragonslayer now I am about 1/2 way through it again with a mage. I LOVE THIS GAME!!!@

[Gollum]

LOL, why is that almost everybody seems to play as a Dragonslayer the first time through? I did it too, guess its got something to do with the nostalgia for the old mine folks or something. Looking forward to give the game another try as a mage as soon as I have more time...

[nate240]

I just finished it yesterday myself, as a Dragonslayer. I think I will try as a paladin next, I now know a lot of stuff I didn't the first time, so it should be interesting.

[Alistair]

I lost my saves (up to chapter 5) when the hard drive went down... I was loving it, apart from the clunky dialogue, but I can't really face going back through all the same stuff...

[Sxotty]

Well I liked morrowind (besides the crashing) so would I like this. What is combat like? I hate scrolling through lists to do combat ala final fantasy games.

[Snyder]

Well I liked morrowind (besides the crashing) so would I like this. What is combat like? I hate scrolling through lists to do combat ala final fantasy games.

You'd certainly like this game. The combat controls are a bit unusual in the beginning, but they are great one you got used to it.

[Gollum]

I lost my saves (up to chapter 5) when the hard drive went down... I was loving it, apart from the clunky dialogue, but I can't really face going back through all the same stuff...

That sucks, but if the Gothic saves turn out to be the worst problem among your lost data, then you actully were lucky. As for starting over, you could always join a different faction the second time around, that would at least offer you lots of different sub-quests and different ways to fight.

I'm gonna wait with starting over till the expansion pack is released, what little info there is available about it sure looks promising.

[Alistair]

Link for add-on info?

Well, my Gothic saves were pretty valuable to me :) I also lost the source code for my Gothic I mods, which is more annoying.

[Gollum]

Here's a link to an RPG Dot interview with some coverage of the Add-on:
http://gothic.rpgdot.com/index.php?hsaction=10053&ID=644
There's also an official thread from Piranha Bytes at the JoWood Gothic 2 forums about the Add-on, maybe an online translator can help you make sense of it (it's in German):
http://forum.jowood.de/showthread.php?s=&threadid=38775

[CosmoKramer]

This game is great. The most immersive game experience for me in long time.

As a sidenote, this game is "great" at showing the inherent weakness of ATI's AF algorithm.

[krayzkrok]

My parents (both nearly 60) raved about the original Gothic. I must give it a try sometime.

Just installed Arx Fatalis, a game I purchased last year and never played. Really jonesing for a decent RPG since I finished Bloodmoon and cancelled my DAoC account.

How are you getting on with it? For me, Arx Fatalis was flawed by numerous silly bugs - game-breaking ones, unfortunately. Certain essential items or pieces of dialogue would completely fail to trigger if you did things out of order, or forgot to talk to a character even if it wasn't obvious (because you'd spoken to them a few minutes earlier). I had to pack it in after a few hours play because of this, which is a pity because I was enjoying it.

[Alistair]

Thanks for the add-on link :) How long will the English version take them do you think?

I'll translate it for them and code it up, if they'll just let me have the .d source files... I'll even brush up the writing for them :)

Unlikely, I know. We'll have to wait aeons for dialogue written by a teenager.


CosmoKramer: Which AF weakness do you mean?

[CosmoKramer]

CosmoKramer: Which AF weakness do you mean?

Its angle dependence.

In a game like this with lots of varied terrain (unlike the perfectly flat "highways" of older games like SS2) it is annoyingly easy to spot where the algorithm fails (imo).